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Droppedbomb

What will the future wing suit resemble?

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Imagine if the "large" manufacturers of wing suits (BM, FYB, Phoenix fly, Tony suits, etc) had a large pot of $$ and support to conduct R&D to develop the future wing suits. What would they look like? Hmmm?!?

After researching wing suits and the few rigid wings being developed (Yves Rossi's wing, the SPELCO Gryphon, and its precursor which Felix B. flew across the English Channel with) I personally see the future WS being a hybrid semi-rigid wing. Almost like what Batman flew in one of the more recent Batman movies.

I sincerely believe the technology is only on the second wave of development. The first being the flying gypsys of the 30s (Clem Sohn etc) and the current being the technology which builds on what Patrick de Gayardon started. What will the next wave look like?

Jeb Corliss has been getting a lot of coverage on international news about his idea to land a WS. And although I recall hearing that in 2003, which never came to fruition, his ideas and thinking are vital to the next iteration to man's "unassisted" flight.

I am curious to get input from anyone else out there who has ideas (Tony, Campos, Jarno, or even Monkey Boy) Where do you see wing suit technology going?

I am finishing my Master's thesis on "Innovations in Air Insertion (Involving Parachutes)" and have been giving this a lot of thought.

:D

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Jeb Corliss has been getting a lot of coverage on international news about his idea to land a WS. And although I recall hearing that in 2003, which never came to fruition, his ideas and thinking are vital to the next iteration to man's "unassisted" flight.



Jebs idea's dont seem to have ANYTHING to do with the development of wingsuits. The wingsuit is just the vehicle that will help him aim at his catching device (which should support even catching a person from normal freefall, as I remember him being quoted somewhere)

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I am curious to get input from anyone else out there who has ideas (Tony, Campos, Jarno, or even Monkey Boy) Where do you see wing suit technology going?



The wingsuit designs of today fly at 2 to even 2,5 times the performance of the first (current ram-air design) wingsuits. Thats a big improvement over the past 8 to 10 years.

I think that for the future we're mostly looking at new materials, which will allow for more of a hybrid between rigid/flexible wing design. Evolving into bigger and more aerodynamic/low drag aerofoils, allowing more optimal flight.

The human body is awfully misbalanced when it comes to our size/weight/shape, mostly where our arms(wings) are located. Advances in technology/materials will/may allow wings to be bigger in variable directions, and be moved towards spots on the body that give us a much better flying characteristics.

There are an awefull lot of people thinking about wingsuits and trying new things in terms of designs. PF, Tony, JiiWings, Vkb, Egsuits etc etc
And next to that there are a lot (you'd be surprised to find out how many) of people working on wingsuits and designs privately, without the intent to sell, just to try and make something that flies even better.

And when one new idea is found that works, the trend is for other manufacturers/designers to take that idea and run with it. Usually coming up with new and improved techniques and ideas.

Though many people talk about brand-wars, its actually also the thing pushing the companies more and more to be innovative and come up with suits that outfly their competitors. In the end, benefiting the development..

No clue where we'll end up, but compare the glide of a bird to what we're doing, and we're still just flying like bricks;)
JC
FlyLikeBrick
I'm an Athlete?

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yes, a bird has a chest built to hold those big wings,
it has relatively no muscle outside of what it needs to fly its wings,
plus scrawny little legs,
no we could never match a bird with a cloth wingsuit,
all we can do it keep making proto's, doing little tweaks here and there to see if it fly's better without ripping your arms off, no flapping or whatever parameters you set yourself,

One possible down side to performance is if our wings got real flash like a glider or Yves Rossi's you'll restrict the way we fly relative the way we do, funneling and flailing all over each other will have a different meaning...........perhaps
Life is a series of wonderful opportunities,
brilliantly disguised as impossible situations.

tonysuits.com

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What Batman flew in the movie is called a glider. We have those already, they've been around for a while. Also I seriously doubt human muscles could withstand the loads imposed by wings that big.
"The evil of the world is made possible by nothing but the sanction you give it. " -John Galt from Atlas Shrugged, 1957

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Imagine a slightly wing-shaped air mattress with holes in it for your head, hands and feet to exit. 3 slots in the front for your cutaway, reserve handle and main ripcord (no way you'll be able to grab that hackey!) to poke out. A flap in the back so the main or reserve pilot chutes could exit while the rig is completely enclosed by the suit. A set of inlet vents on the front and a set in the back ... hell, it could even double as a place to sleep instead of the floor! :)

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In the far future a suit will be designed that has wings on it with a significantly large wingspan. As the wings of a bird are in proportion with his body in order to fly. The gaint wings will take the place of the parachute container on our back. The operating system would be build from the beginning of the left hand all the way over your back to the end of your right hand, in other words your upperbody would be placed in a "pulse-suit" that monitors every little muscle movement. Those muscle movements would be translated on to the wings, the wings would make movements as normal bird wings would and it would be posible to go from up to down to a landing.

It remains speculation and my imagination but either way we will have to wait for nano-technology to be perfected and new fabrics. In an other lifetime I'd say.

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I suggest that smart materials (those whose properties can be changed to suit the circumstances) will be the wave of the future. Then we can have long span wings that are rigid and require no muscle effort on the part of the flyer to support his/her weight, but can be flexed as needed for maneuvering and deployment (if we don't want to risk landing the suit).

Suitably smart materials can also change color according to need - maybe white in the hot summer and black in the winter, green and yellow in the spring, red and gold in the fall...
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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Kallend,

That is what I am talking about. I have discussed this with others and I think you are right on! After all, who would have ever thought that a Jumbo jet would exist until Alloy materials and jet engines came along. It is hard to imagine future iterations of an innovation when you are looking through a lens of currently available technology.


Thanks for the input!!

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I,m new to this and thought you guys might like to see a photo of a fellow by the name of Cecil Mackenzie flying a wingsuit here in Oliver BC Canada
The year was 1937 and the event was the opening of the Oliver Airport BC.
Apparently he was arrested after his flight.
Pretty cool.

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and its precursor which Felix B.



In which he stole the design from the german company who is off the market only working with the Germany Military... ? lol
Leroy


..I knew I was an unwanted baby when I saw my bath toys were a toaster and a radio...

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See, this example emphasizes what's wrong with wingsuit development. 1937 - airplanes are already quite sophisticated, they are tested in wind tunnels, aerodynamics is a well-developed science. Airplanes of that time are already engineered to fly well.

Yet, wingsuit "pioneers" of that time, like zombies, follow the same dumb pattern: "let's strap something to our arms and legs to resemble bats or flying squirrels". Doesn't matter what it is, what the state of the art of aerodynamics is now - let's strap a sheet of fabric and "fly"!

Total disregard to thinking. You're in 1937 yet you're borrowing from the designs of 17th century. Or you're in 2007 and borrowing from the designs of 19th century.

It's like a Wall Street firm run by people who can't even add 5 and 7 without a calculator.

So the answer to the question "What will the future wing suit resemble?" is:

"It will resemble whatever somebody knowledgeable and talented in aerodynamics will say, "What the hell is wrong here??? Are these people all fucking retarded? Let me do something about it!" ;)

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Wingsuits are stuck in a paradigm and huge shift is imminent. Every component and technology for actual flight by humans already exists, it is a simple matter of applying faith, will and skill to the problem.
Birds have never needed to use their legendary brains to fly, but we do. Consider the following misapprehentions with respect to the possibility of human flight :
1) man is too heavy to fly: reduce a man in three dimensions to the size of your favorite heavy bird of prey, add the prey to the weight of the bird and compare the weight of mini-man and bird. How big is the difference really? Whatever answer you get will tell you where to concentrate your efforts to close the gap, and how to balance the options, being wingspan, aerofoil design and thrust .
2) man is anatomically misshapen for the purpose of flight: Superimpose the skeleton of a man over the skeleton of a bat and be amazed.. now work out what movements mechanics and engineering are needed to simulate the action of the flying skeleton.
3) humans lack the strength to generate thrust and control large wingspans: humans also lacked the strength to move massive boulders to Stonehenge, they opted to use the crudest of methods to leverage the strength available to them. We have innumerable technologies for augmenting our strength, and more than enough which do not require any outside power. The force of gravity and the minimum input from our muscles and tendons are enough to power the right engineering.

The challenge is to tailor and adapt technologies in an elegant way, and to consider the process of safely introducing them to the current wingsuit environment.

The wingsuits of the future will combine the very best of human accomplishments in science and art, and they will allow humans to actually fly, glide and land. They will be the most beautiful objects ever created in human history for sure.

(pronounced G - jii is the force that makes you fly!)

Jii-Wings - no strings!

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The wingsuits of the future will combine the very best of human accomplishments in science and art, and they will allow humans to actually fly, glide and land. They will be the most beautiful objects ever created in human history for sure.



...very exciting to think about! How far down the road do you think the "future" is?

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1) man is too heavy to fly: reduce a man in three dimensions to the size of your favourite heavy bird of prey, add the prey to the weight of the bird and compare the weight of mini-man and bird. How big is the difference really?


I'm not sure you can look at it this way. Scaling down, volume and therefore weight are scaled down in three dimensions. Wing area in only two. Scaling down, your wingload decreases. This makes a lot of things, like landing, a lot easier.

Also, if you want to redesign wings, the most efficient ones seem to be long and thin, like gliders', or birds'. Forces may scale, but force moments do not.

Sorry to rain on the parade, a paradigm shift may come from a direction where I didn't see it coming at all, but there may be a reason the largest flying bird is a lot smaller than a human (comparing body size here, not wingspan).

Give the moon an atmosphere though, and with 1/6 g you may get somewhere. (This is not my idea.)
Johan.
I am. I think.

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If the creative and competitive energies involved are fueled by sufficient finance, we will see huge advances in a very short time. I predict that within a decade most of the major milestones will have been reached.

(pronounced G - jii is the force that makes you fly!)

Jii-Wings - no strings!

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But Jarno don't you think its amazing how similar our fingernails are to the quill of the feather as well ?
If I went down to the nail parlour and had webbed extentions added, i think I would look a lot like a bat!

(pronounced G - jii is the force that makes you fly!)

Jii-Wings - no strings!

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If I went down to the nail parlour and had webbed extentions added, i think I would look a lot like a bat!



I say you'd just look like a handicapped mouse:P
I definitely think there is room for improvement in current designs, but a lot of philosophy on our kinship to flying/gliding animals is not the answerB|
JC
FlyLikeBrick
I'm an Athlete?

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1) man is too heavy to fly: reduce a man in three dimensions to the size of your favorite heavy bird of prey, add the prey to the weight of the bird and compare the weight of mini-man and bird. How big is the difference really? Whatever answer you get will tell you where to concentrate your efforts to close the gap, and how to balance the options, being wingspan, aerofoil design and thrust .



Show me a flying bird the weight of a man.
Do you want to have an ideagasm?

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No no .. I don't say that man is not heavier than the heaviest flying bird, I say that only to the degree that this differs we must aim to compensate. That goes for weight , strength and shape. It's a just phlyosophy of mine.

(pronounced G - jii is the force that makes you fly!)

Jii-Wings - no strings!

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