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The111

Mercury Rising: Photos of the new Tony Suit

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With the Blade (and I expect with the Ghost as well) the cutaway handle is so low you can't reach it without pulling up your knees



You've mentioned this before..
Maybe I have weird body dimensions, but standing up I can reach and pull the cutaway handles without having to do any bending or pulling knees up.

When standing up (if you have an avg. body size/shape) my hands/palms are resting on the side of my upper leg, and my fingers are fully on the handles. Just slighly dipping the shoulder when reaching down enables me to fully enclose the handle with my hand and jank it out.

I end every skydiving day by putting my suit away. And always remove the suit from my rig standing up, and pulling the cables out. And I never really have to bend or dip to get to the handles..

I suspect the Ghost to be pretty much the same in terms of grabbing the cutway loops/handles. Maybe even easyer, as you only need two fingers through the loops on the cutaway, instead of having the grab the little pillows like those on the blade.

Could your lentgh, and maybe sometimes jumping suits that are 5 to 10 cms too short maybe have something to do with the problems in reaching handles?

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On the S3S I jumped I could hardly remove the cutaway cable because it was so tight.



A few years back, I pulled the cutaway cables on my S3 (which happens to be THE S3 you were jumping) on one of the first few jumps I made with the suit.
I made a helicopterjump (at the Herc Boogie in '04) where I decided to go for my first full-flight pull. That one caused a simple linetwist. My canopy started diving already in the opening, so I decided to pull the handles. As the zippers still took me a while back then, and I had practiced pulling/touching the handles quite often on the ground. Like normal emergency proc. I had no issue at all removing/pulling the cables out in a hury. It was one smooth move.
And that is THE same suit you couldnt get it to come out if I understand you correctly?

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On the Phi I could not remove the cable at all without ripping off some fabric.



About a year ago, a friend at skydive rotterdam ripped half of the loops of the body of his GTI during a reserve procedure where he felt it necessary to pull the cables out.
He told me he grabbed the handles and pulled em straight up towards his chest. And it was hard to impossible to get em out. Afterwards, trying it again on a friends GTi, pulling with an outward curve (either forward or sideways) the cables came out smooth and easy.
Its been noted before a wrong pull (pulling upward) can cause the cable to sort of lock, and come out harder/more difficult. And I remember debating about this when you pointed out the difficulty in the Phi you tried.

Like all clever designs..they're only as clever as their user...so it might be that your inabily to pull the handles says more about you then the design;):P

You may just have a weird build (in terms of reaching), and need to switch hands every once in a while while watching videos late at night, so you gain some strength in both arms..;):P
JC
FlyLikeBrick
I'm an Athlete?

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I must say i have never had problems with the release cables. I have jumped gti,firebird,V2 and currently a blade.

They always(mostly on the ground) came out with ease
If people from Poland are called Poles, why aren't people from Holland called Holes???
My logbook

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You've mentioned this before..
Maybe I have weird body dimensions, but standing up I can reach and pull the cutaway handles without having to do any bending or pulling knees up.



Maybe I'm just a bit ahead in evolution, less of a monkey then you:P. But shouldn't the wingsuits be safe for more evolved people as well?

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A few years back, I pulled the cutaway cables on my S3 (which happens to be THE S3 you were jumping) on one of the first few jumps I made with the suit.
I made a helicopterjump (at the Herc Boogie in '04) where I decided to go for my first full-flight pull. That one caused a simple linetwist. My canopy started diving already in the opening, so I decided to pull the handles. As the zippers still took me a while back then, and I had practiced pulling/touching the handles quite often on the ground. Like normal emergency proc. I had no issue at all removing/pulling the cables out in a hury. It was one smooth move.
And that is THE same suit you couldnt get it to come out if I understand you correctly?



I never said you couldn't do it, you were just super pumped up with adrenaline because of your line twist on your Spectre 170:P

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About a year ago, a friend at skydive rotterdam ripped half of the loops of the body of his GTI during a reserve procedure where he felt it necessary to pull the cables out.
He told me he grabbed the handles and pulled em straight up towards his chest. And it was hard to impossible to get em out. Afterwards, trying it again on a friends GTi, pulling with an outward curve (either forward or sideways) the cables came out smooth and easy.
Its been noted before a wrong pull (pulling upward) can cause the cable to sort of lock, and come out harder/more difficult. And I remember debating about this when you pointed out the difficulty in the Phi you tried.



Isn't one of the main points about the cable cutaway system that it should work every time? Especially in a stress situation.

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You may just have a weird build (in terms of reaching), and need to switch hands every once in a while while watching videos late at night, so you gain some strength in both arms..;):P



You dirty gemeentereinigingsbeamtenaar! Now stop posting on DZ.com and send me the next episode of Romeo and Julio;)
Tristan
Will you answer "NO" to my next question?

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Maybe I'm just a bit ahead in evolution, less of a monkey then you:P. But shouldn't the wingsuits be safe for more evolved people as well?

As long as they fly suits in their own size its all ok..

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I never said you couldn't do it, you were just super pumped up with adrenaline because of your line twist on your Spectre 170:P



Blame it on the guy with the smart canopy-choice..
Ive downsided a lot since then...on a spectre 150 now!
Does that make me cool again?

Or do I have to go beneath 90 sq/ft on a wingsuit to be cool?

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Isn't one of the main points about the cable cutaway system that it should work every time? Especially in a stress situation.



Yes..when used correcly...
Or are you one those people that starts complaining your reserve doesnt come out when you push on your reserve-handle? As stress may cause you to push instead of pull.

Use it the way it was designed, and it will work...

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Now stop posting on DZ.com and send me the next episode of Romeo and Julio;)



As good a porn movie that may be...I bet we never actually get to see the video:P;)
JC
FlyLikeBrick
I'm an Athlete?

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He told me he grabbed the handles and pulled em straight up towards his chest. And it was hard to impossible to get em out. Afterwards, trying it again on a friends GTi, pulling with an outward curve (either forward or sideways) the cables came out smooth and easy.
Its been noted before a wrong pull (pulling upward) can cause the cable to sort of lock, and come out harder/more difficult
-------------------------------------
yes I get the same prob with the zippers, sometimes I pull em towards my sholders and sometimes I pull em towards my sholders,
:)
Life is a series of wonderful opportunities,
brilliantly disguised as impossible situations.

tonysuits.com

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For years I told people to try and keep the cables in an orientation that would not let them sit in a kinked position for a long time. A kink might make it harder to pull the wing cut away cables. I preferred to keep the cables on the body side and omit a wingtab if I could so there is less cable zig zag.

Its funny but the PF suits almost mandate you omit a body tab for most users, unless a miss match of rig-suit size-body size require you do otherwise, but, the major design difference is that the tabs are twice as wide now. This gives the cable more support. What was previously a potential for a tight zig~zaged cable allows for a gentle radius.

For what its worth I can reach the cable handles on all the suits that I own that have that system, even the ghost, whether on the ground or hanging in the harness.

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d the whole point here is that its easier to undo a zip than it is to cutaway because you do it every time,



no way. cables cant jam. ever.

look at the gs1/sugarglider. a one handed, cable based cutaway system, that is only undone when needed, and runs down the arm parralell with the zippers.

none of this " i cant reach past my knees " crap, because the handle is in the middle of your chest.

as innovative as the tonysuits have been, its hard to beleve they cant come up with decent cutaway system.


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no way. cables cant jam. ever.


I agree. If they're sticking for some reason, spray a little WD-40 on them.

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as innovative as the tonysuits have been, its hard to beleve they cant come up with decent cutaway system.


I'm really surprised to be hearing this. The "hinge" cutaway system is THE innovation that separated the deathtraps of the mid-20th century from the new era of wingsuits. Removing this critical safety feature is huge step backwards.

Zippers fail. Tabs break off. Your shirt sleeve gets caught in the teeth. The teeth can get out of order and jam. If the suit's a bit too big or if the handle/wing is dropped, there won't be enough tension to unzip. There's a whole host of problems.

This is death in the BASE environment.

There is no way I'd buy a wingsuit without a cable cutaway system. I know of no suit where you can't easily reach the cable cutaways on the side. For the extra big wings, I second going with the GS1-style cutaway.

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I say this is a 'webbed gloves are a good idea' story all over again
-------------------
Noooo, the webies wernt as fast as reaching back for the grip, I proved it to myself on the big M jump,

the twin zips are "here to stay" :)
Life is a series of wonderful opportunities,
brilliantly disguised as impossible situations.

tonysuits.com

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Zippers fail. Tabs break off. Your shirt sleeve gets caught in the teeth. The teeth can get out of order and jam. If the suit's a bit too big or if the handle/wing is dropped, there won't be enough tension to unzip. There's a whole host of problems.
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1. the handles on our suits can be dropped and picked because they dont move when let go of.
2. That being said the handles have nothing to do with unzipping the arms
3. theres no way you are gonna have both zippers break on the same jump. Ive not had a problem in 2 years with one zip, now your gonna have a prob with 2 on the same jump??????????
Life is a series of wonderful opportunities,
brilliantly disguised as impossible situations.

tonysuits.com

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1. the handles on our suits can be dropped and picked because they dont move when let go of.
2. That being said the handles have nothing to do with unzipping the arms
3. theres no way you are gonna have both zippers break on the same jump. Ive not had a problem in 2 years with one zip, now your gonna have a prob with 2 on the same jump??????????



The "door" was opened on the cut away issue and people are stepping through by letting you know what they think. You have made your opinion pretty clear that you dont think it is needed on your design. Basically you like your system and it is what it is! That is great but I dont think your going to convince someone who is pro cut cables to look at your break away system as the best solution.

I jump another product and have no issues getting at the cut away's for the wings. I dont have to lift knees but that is neither here nor there. I LIKE the idea of having the cables, and no matter if you say it is not needed with your system it gives me the warm fuzzy feeling so I like the option if needed. Also it seems to be a curving pull out and up to pull them. Pulling straight up does not make sense.

I am not against your design so dont think I am attacking it as it flys good from what I have seen it do in the air next to me. I got a good close look at a suit last weekend and the workmanship is great and the suit is beefy but damn the wings are big! I was thinkig about jumping it but it just did not work out time wise this time. I do want to try it out to see how it compares. With everything I think the performance is going to be vastly improved with a better pilot and that is just a fact of any suit.

It is funny that people are expressing their thoughts and your basic response is seen in #3 above. Things can always be improved and you seem more then willing to play and adjust suits on the fly with the # of tweaks that seem to be always happening on the SM series.

Scott C.
"He who Hesitates Shall Inherit the Earth!"

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The situaion has arisen at AN72 boogie. Does any one know how the girl involved in the collision handled the situation with a smashed upper arm?



For those that didnt get this..two jumpers collided. One flying along with the flock, and one coming down, slighly diving. Both flying at a slighly different angle/converging path.
The upper arm broke on one jumper, and the other jumper got hit on his calf, and he could walk for a few weeks.

From what she told at the hospital, she used her teeth to open the zipper on her working arm, and spent a good long time trying to get it open.
Which was hard to impossible using one arm and mouth.

The cutaway cable would have been faster.
But she didnt use them as the stressfull situation made her totally forget about them.

But no denying they would have been the quick solution to getting her arm free.

Seeing how she handled the collision. Not pulling within a big flock, but first falling to a safe altitude while holding her hand/arm (as it was flapping behind her body, the upper arm snapped). She did 100% what she should and could have done. And I dont think many poeple would have had the same excelent reaction, when confronted with the same stressfull/painfull situation.

There have been a few 'unique' incidents where the cable-release would have been the best, if not only solution. And just because we've been flying commercialy available wingsuits for +- 8 years now, doesnt mean we've seen every thinkable/unthinkable scenario possible where they would come in handy during an emergency.

I for one would never fly a wingsuit without a decent cutaway system...and honestly hope the smart dicision is made regarding this subject...
JC
FlyLikeBrick
I'm an Athlete?

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well heres the deal... i flew an apache this past sunday for the first time and absolutley loved it. the legwing inflation was impressive, as was the range of the suit overall, and the fact that sight-unseen with an open container and a 5 minute call i was able to rig the suit, get it on, and get to the plane on time. the way the zipper was continuos ftom to to neck, was a great innovation.

but

i intend to wingsuit base whatever suit i buy. and with no "hands NOW"option there is no way i can consider the apache as an option.

you have to have a reliable instant cutaway. have to.


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Velcro has the annoying habit of not coming undone when you want it to and coming undone when you don't want it to. :S

The classic prototype that Robi & Jari used for their first WS BASE jumps off the ITW had velcro rather than zippers on the arm sleeves as they were worried about the zips jamming..

The velcro started to release in freefall on Robi's flight :S and this helped motivate him to come up with the tab solution.
BASEstore.it

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The Apache has the velcro sandwich rip off arm,

I have no plans for changing that



OK, I tried taking off the thumb loops before punching out the velcro sandwich system on my M1 and .....

it worked fine. Had to punch really hard, but I don't think that would be a problem when the adrenaline is up in an emergency.
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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