The cutaway system...

[notsane 0]

The two things I've learned about flat spins are: 1) fix it immediately. Don't wait until you're spun up really hard .. it'll be more difficult to get out of 2) The reason you're spinning is almost certainly your legs. When you ball up, grab your knees to make sure your legs are even. After the initial increase in rotational speed (conservation of angular momentum) things should slow down.

[birdynamnam 28]

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The two things I've learned about flat spins are: 1) fix it immediately. Don't wait until you're spun up really hard .. it'll be more difficult to get out of 2) The reason you're spinning is almost certainly your legs. When you ball up, grab your knees to make sure your legs are even. After the initial increase in rotational speed (conservation of angular momentum) things should slow down.

Yes, the person on the video learned the following 1) fix it immediately. How? Ball up really quickly / very tight. Relatively fast thereafter get belly to earth oriented (by arching forcefully). If you wait much longer you will quickly become exhausted.

[nathaniel 0]

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fix it immediately.

I think one of the keys is to be aware of any lateral yaw and correct it ASAP. Before it even feels like a spin, when you start turning about your vertical axis without intentional input is when you should be correcting it. Correcting it, in turn, doesn't necessarily mean stopping the turn immediately but acting gradually and keeping the spin from developing until your control increases.

On one of the exits from the otter at Zflock 2.5 someone ended up pinned to my leg by inertia on his part and relative wind on my part--fully vertical into the relative wind. He finally separated by pushing off my left leg, causing me to stall and to start a flat rotation. I was able to hold it to a constant rate of rotation through about 270 degrees until my pitch came back to level and the suit began flying again, at which point the spin stopped on its own with no further input.

My advice is to do what your parents did; get a job, sir. The bums will always lose. Do you hear me, Lebowski?

[trigger 0]

I cut away the wings on the S-Fly recently, up high, out of curiosity. The pull was somewhat trickier than I anticipated, leaving me with one arm inflated, one flapping, and cable flying around everywhere - I went from a nice stable position to a tumbling mess of fun, trying to sort it all out...that was the first time I'd ever been unstable, which was ironic. No, I prefer balling-up!

.CHOP WOOD COLLECT WATER.

[TomAiello 25]

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I cut away the wings on the S-Fly recently, up high, out of curiosity.

In flight cutaway on the monowing systems is reportedly significantly scarier than on the tri-wings, because the wings tend to try to inflate anyway.

I think it was LouDiamond who experimented with this a while back. Maybe he'll share his experiences again.

-- Tom Aiello

[email protected]
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[Tornolf 0]

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Flipping over is possible but requires a good deal of strength and won't always work like balling up will. ... Flipping over is impossible if the flat spin begins violently or it is allowed to build momentum.

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What do you consider a violent flat spin?

THIS is a pretty good example of a violent spin and proof that pulling the arm cutaways is worthless to stop the spin. In fact, watch the speed of the rotations after the arms are cutaway and you will notice an increase in the revolutions.

I've had one spin which was worse (the one I described earlier) and one roughly equal to the last part of the video. Both went into full speed pretty much immediately. I had no problem flipping over and flying out of the spins within several seconds of them starting.

I agree that cutting away the wings is the wrong thing to do, but it's very possible to flip over and get out of it even if the spin is bad. I do think that twisting over is a better description since all I do is a laid out half twist. Tom's post does make me think that I probably only do it because of my acrobatic background. Also, I don't have much upper body strength at all. I'm 6ft and under 140 lbs so there's very little room for muscle on my skin and bones

A waddling elephant seal is the cutest thing in the entire world.
-TJ

[VectorBoy 0]

In flight cutaway on the monowing systems is reportedly significantly scarier than on the tri-wings, because the wings tend to try to inflate anyway.

[Tonto 1]

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I cut away the wings on the S-Fly recently,

The Roberts cutaway system has several advantages over the systems used on the S Fly, Sugarglider, GS-1, etc.

The pilot maintains control over the leading edge, so even if the wing inflates, there is reduced consequence.

In the event of a "swallowed" cutaway or reserve handle - already a rare/unlikely occurence on a tri wing suit, cutting the wings away allows access to those handles, while on monowings that is not the case.

t

It's the year of the Pig.

[birdynamnam 28]

good info, thanks

[SkymonkeyONE 3]

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zippers break and get caught. would not be fun to have the zipper malfunction and the canopy at the same time.

That is the primary important reason for the robert cutaway system. The only time I ever pulled those handles was one instance where I jammed a zipper on my left arm unzipping after a brake fire. I had to pull the wing cutaways after I got under my reserve.

They serve a very important purpose.

Chuck

[TomAiello 25]

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zippers break and get caught. would not be fun to have the zipper malfunction and the canopy at the same time.

That is the primary important reason for the robert cutaway system. The only time I ever pulled those handles was one instance where I jammed a zipper on my left arm unzipping after a brake fire. I had to pull the wing cutaways after I got under my reserve.

They serve a very important purpose.

I think they are also slightly faster than the zippers (especially the leg zippers if you are a fatso like me). I've pulled the cables when I opened low before to save time (when I say I was low, I mean that after landing I walked back the 100 yards to where I dropped them and just picked them up off the ground).

-- Tom Aiello

[email protected]
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[Nidez 0]

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I for one among many experienced fliers do not believe that cutting away the wings is the correct response for a flat-spin.

Ok, but it is still part of the FFC.

It's not in mine...

It told to not cut-away the wings to recover from a flat spin during FFC... it wont help, but it will probably increase yor sping putting your head lower. without wings your arms are useless if you compare them to the leg wing.

cut-away is still needed and absolutely important fo zip jam or very low reserve ride !

Marco "Pazzo" Pistolesi
pistolesi.marco(at)gmail.com

[birdynamnam 28]

public Flight manuals available from PF and BM sites, still tells the old story. I know for a fact that BM's docs have been updated reg. the flatspin procedure, but they are not public yet unfortunately and I still have not seen it.