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agentsmith413

This is why we track away

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That jump was all experienced jumpers except me and the guy that deployed under me. He (one that almost killed me) had more jumps than I did at the time and jump was organized by competent organizer.



That looked like real "combat RW", or Mongolian cluster F*** (why do we pick on Mongolians?) as we used to call it back when dinosaurs roamed the earth. High speed strafing passes, Is it you in the bottom of the frame at the end that is trying to track? Whether it is you or not, it looks a lot more like a dive than a track, and would not result in much horizontal movement, although the perspective from above can be misleading. Unfortunately, some people will be considered experienced without having a high level of skill. Far too many do not track well at all, and likely don't know they are lousy at it.
People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

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Hey, don't get me wrong, I remember when I had about 50 jumps and I was on a 10-way, and I ran into (horizontally) the guy I was supposed to be docking on and took him out of the formation...

...and yes, it may have been Lew Sanborn... :o

...but I didn't dump under the formation.

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Keep in mind that nobody starts this sport knowing much of anything. The first time an organizer told me "If you go low, stick with the formation until breakoff and then track like your life depends on it (cuz it does)" I learned something new. I like to think I wouldn't have pulled under the formation even without that briefing, but keep in mind that 50 jumps is not a lot. Exits are still a total blur, your flying skills pretty much suck, your altitude awareness isn't spectacular, and if you've been doing a bunch of solos you may only have 10 (or fewer) jumps with more than 1 other person in the sky with you.

Was this a dumb thing to do? Absolutely. Is it the organizer's fault for not briefing the jumper? No. But we'd all be well served remembering that you have to learn from someone. I think it's great that we have this video--we can tell low-timers that tracking is important all day long, but seeing the results of a bad breakoff really sends the point home. A newer jumper reading this thread may have just learned something and avoided a mistake. Never miss an opportunity to teach somebody something.

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Bowling really is starting to look appealing to me after watching this video. Or maybe curling... J/k I'm sure I made a rookie mistake like that, except it was never captured on video. Thanks for sharing.

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But we'd all be well served remembering that you have to learn from someone. I think it's great that we have this video--we can tell low-timers that tracking is important all day long, but seeing the results of a bad breakoff really sends the point home. A newer jumper reading this thread may have just learned something and avoided a mistake. Never miss an opportunity to teach somebody something.



+1

Its certainly a good lesson of what I can remind a newer jumper I'm jumping with or coaching.

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That's me in bottom left of frame in red and black jumpsuit tracking. No my track was not perfect and still isn't. But my horizontal distance was sufficient even back then. I still practice tracking every time I go jump. Even when I was at 48 jumps when that video was shot I understood the importance of separation before deployment.

Just to make sure everyone understands: THAT was NOT me that Deployed Under the Formation. That was another Jumper. Edit to add I don't suspect my track will ever be perfect either but I will strive for it. I have been a very conservative jumper from my first solo.
Some may say this is crazy or not but the safety of those that I jump with comes before my own. I could not live with myself if I injured someone else.

I absolutely understand the seriousness of what happened on this jump and hope I never see it again. Still scares me when I watch it and I think of my daughters. I avoided posting it for a long time till I saw a thread that it fit into as a learning tool.

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Also keep in mind the jumper in my video thought he was way low.
He thought he was gonna die. The question you have to ask "Would I have still tracked thinking I was below 1000 feet? " I would hope that I never loose awareness that I would Be in his situation. Did he put me in the line of fire? Yes he did. He was in panic mode trying to save his own skin.

Another lesson here is he put me in the line of fire of a main canopy at what he thought was under 1000 feet. Making the wrong decision to deploy his main instead of his reserve. Another question: Would that many jumper loose awareness and all go in? Probably not. He just saw us but panic took hold of him.

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Also keep in mind the jumper in my video thought he was way low.
He thought he was gonna die. The question you have to ask "Would I have still tracked thinking I was below 1000 feet? " I would hope that I never loose awareness that I would Be in his situation. Did he put me in the line of fire? Yes he did. He was in panic mode trying to save his own skin.

Another lesson here is he put me in the line of fire of a main canopy at what he thought was under 1000 feet. Making the wrong decision to deploy his main instead of his reserve. Another question: Would that many jumper loose awareness and all go in? Probably not. He just saw us but panic took hold of him.



Depends on whether there's a mountain in your way or not. :P

But that was a big part of the issue I took with what that guy did on your skydive. No one is awesome at 50 jumps. No one has made all the mistakes they will make at 50 jumps. No one expects you to be a master planner of skydives at 50 jumps. No one expects you to be able to recount every last nuance of what happened on the skydive at 50 jumps...

...but 5500 ft doesn't look anything like 1000 ft, even when you only have 50 jumps. You simply can't be that prone to panic and jump with more than one other person (preferably an instructor) safely.

Congrats on surviving someone almost killing you, and for recalling it with the proper amount of nausea.

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Down where I'm from (Texas) we do SCR jumps with low-timers. Some people, in order to get them done, will just tell the low-timer to pull in place. This is why I hate that -- EVERYONE should be able to track at least somewher, and it's your responsibility as part of a group jump.



This is why I sometimes have mixed feelings about the SCR, as compared to the SCS. In my mind, even an SCR should be an indication of, say, respectable RW skills. Any twit can just lay base (a linked base at that) and then dump in place. What's that called? - Oh, yes - AFF-1. If you can't be counted on to reliably, consistently and safely track away from everyone on every 8-way jump you're on, you don't have the requisite skills to "earn" your SCR.

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Can't say for sure, but my money would be on the 'star' of the video being the guy who was supposed to pull in place. That's the guy the camera flyer goes to, and the two-way that everyone tries to get in on, so I would figure that he's the guy that was supposed to pull in place (and have the deployment on video).

The 'offender' here went low, and I'm betting lost track of the formation. When he got to pull altitude, he just pulled. I'll also add that you might take note that the guy who went low was the only guy not wearing a baggy, freefly type jumpsuit, he was wearing shorts. Big surprise he went low.

There's a 'slight' chance that he tried to track, and just went in a circle, but in either case he was ill-preparred for the jump.

The plan to backslide at break off was a big mistake. Most jumpers are not able to backslide on-level and in a straight line. It's a skill in itself, and not something you can just 'put your legs up' and do.

Beyond that, the skill level of all the jumpers was suspect, either due to low time or lack of RW skills (remember all the freefly suits?). One thing people need to keep in mind is that your skills are your skills, no matter how bad you want to be on a jump. Often times a 'special' jump, like a milestone, or a sunset big-way will have all sorts of people wanting to participate, but the only ones who know the jump is 'special' are the jumpers. Gravity and the reaper don't know one jump from the other.



Very well put, Dave. I am the guy in black and grey, the "star," or "asshole," as the case may be. ;)

I think it's easy for some of us to forget that, even though we really want to jump with our friends, not everyone is at the same skill level at a given number of jumps. And I also agree that we ALL should have paid very close attention to our friend that went low, or just broken off the formation altogether.

Very powerful learning experience for all of us.
T.I.N.S.

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