0
John4455

Extra links vs wearing weights

Recommended Posts

Personally, I would think that it would be better off, not wearing or adding anything until you get familiar with the canopy. Having mixed wingloadings doing small formations shouldn't be too bad. Of course, that's my opinion, I'm not as seasoned as some of the other CRWDogs, they probably have more insight, and ideas about this than I.

CReW Skies,
"Women fake orgasms - men fake whole relationships" – Sharon Stone
"The world is my dropzone" (wise crewdog quote)
"The light dims, until full darkness pierces into the world."-KDM

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote

I'm new to Crw and bought a canopy not too long ago. (Thanks Chuck) I have heard that for a newer jumper to Crw it was better to wear weights vs extra links until you have gained more experience.
Thoughts or opinions???



As a small person it was always WAY easier to use links instead of wear weights. The weights on your body wear you down.. I don't think it makes a big difference in the long run however...

W

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
They are opposite ways of getting the same effect (more speed). I prefer extra links and let me explain why.

Objective is to increase forward speed to match other jumpers (so you don't wear youself out hanging in front risers all the time trying to keep up).

Adding weights will increase the loadfactor. Theoretically this will increase forward speed and only that. The glide angel will remain the same (you ride down the same hill with more weight). Practically speaking this is true within reasonable limits. Note that different size canopies with the same loadfactor do not have the same flight characteristics. A small canopy will have relatively more drag from lines, tape and stitches (giving it a steeper glide angel) and a large canopy will have more momentum (making it harder to stop). The result however is that a higher loaded canopy has less 'range'. It will stall at a higher speed, and you have less toggle/riser input available to maneuver.

With extra links you change the way the canopy is trimmed (make sure your steering lines are long enough) giving it a higher angel of incidence. It gives more speed because this results in a steeper glide angel (you ride down a steeper hill). This makes it easier to stay down with a formation while flying next to it. It makes it easier to float up because you have an extra inch of rear riser range. It makes it easier to kill forward speed while docking because of less momentum. And your stall margin is bigger (can fly slower).

Now, be aware that this is not wonder medicine. A novice might not even have enough finesse to notice the difference, but at least a less loaded canopy is safer. And there is an option to combine the two so you don't end up hauling around 20 pounds of lead, and I wouldn't put in double links because this deforms the camber too much.

--
Everything you know is wrong. But some of it is a useful first approximation.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Remko,
That should be required reading all CRW Pups. You explaned many things very well.
However, I must respectfully disagree on the links. I wear weights under my 160 (Lightning) simply because I weigh too little for it. I'm in that "grey" zone, too much for my 143, too little for my 160.
I think adding links (except for Wendy) is sort of like looking for a crutch. Learn to fly your canopy!
If you're floaty, learn to work from the bottom of the formation. If you're sinky, fly from the top. Slow, stay in front (ok, always stay in front).
My opinion is, if you are looking for a "perfect" mechinical advantage, you will never find it. You will just keep looking for a more "prefect" fix for any given situtation.
In my opinion, learn to fly your canopy, find out what works and what doesn't. Adjust from there.
CRW Skies
Frank
CRW Diva #58

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote


I think adding links (except for Wendy) is sort of like looking for a crutch. Learn to fly your canopy!



I remember being told that years ago when I had borrowed a big rig, was wearing 30 lbs of lead (I weighed 115 back then) and was jumping a Prodigy 175. I was told the reason I had problems was because I needed to learn to fly my canopy and that I didn't need a 150..

I'm a fan of matching....
W

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I totally agree with what remko says.

My preference would be to use links. I never do crw with lead if i can avoid it. wearing 10lbs of lead in a belt around your waist is not quite the same as being 10lbs heavier, whereby the weight would be more evenly distributed.

This can make the canopy behave differently, not to mention the physical discomfort especially if your are team training doing 8 or more jumps a day.

Wearing weights on the shoulders can be a problem also as if you are not careful can cause you to go very flat on exit which can lead to whiplash on opening.

One other thought, i always found it to be better to be one of the heavier wing loadings rather than lighter. sure you have more performance on the formation but one you become experienced and get used to this you will find it physically easier and more forgiving to have that little bit of extra performance should you need to chase a formation rather than be the lighter guy who is always on the front risers.

Remember it is not just docking on a formation but you also have to fly your slot once you get there, if you have spent a lot of time front risering to get down to a formation you may still need your strength to keep your canopy down when you arrive.

As always though, the more experienced you get the easier it all becomes.

regards
plastic

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote


One other thought, i always found it to be better to be one of the heavier wing loadings rather than lighter. sure you have more performance on the formation but one you become experienced and get used to this you will find it physically easier and more forgiving to have that little bit of extra performance should you need to chase a formation rather than be the lighter guy who is always on the front risers.

Remember it is not just docking on a formation but you also have to fly your slot once you get there, if you have spent a lot of time front risering to get down to a formation you may still need your strength to keep your canopy down when you arrive.



So, being heavy (fast) is good if you are in the base (picture a 70+ way, he he :-)) but if you are a wing and have more speed than the rest of the formation you are much more likely to come around than if you are light (slow). The way this affected the big ways was not only in the lateral (wing - center - wing) but also in the vertical (top - center - point). Imagine a fast top, tilting the formation forward, increasing it's speed...

This was done with details like big vs small canopies and baggy vs tight clothes, all within a very small loadfator range (yes I have respect for those big-way designers).

Another detail, getting there is more important for sequential/rotation, staying there is more important for big-ways.

--
Everything you know is wrong. But some of it is a useful first approximation.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quote


I think adding links (except for Wendy) is sort of like looking for a crutch. Learn to fly your canopy!



No... Adding links, just like adding weight, is about balancing a formation. It's not about trying to find an advantage. It's about taking away the advantage/disadvantage. Start off with getting the right person under the right size canopy and if the right size happens to be unavailable patch up with links and/or weights. While fine tuning even sliders, clothing or an open pilot chute can make a difference.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Yes, perfectly true remko. I should have explained that comment a bit better.

Big formations have to be properly engineered and balanced as people often have to fly a slot for quite some time while the formation builds. There is no "better to be light or heavy" it needs to be right.

My comments were meant more for more normal crw jumps, meaning 9-way or smaller, or more likely 4-way seq or 8-way speed, which is normal for us in England as we have very few crw jumpers over here, big ways don't happen over here.

regards
plastic

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account. It's free!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
0