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Bealio

It's a love/hate thing

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I go for my first skydive and i see what i did not know about at the time, "fun jumpers". Wow, these guys are here to jump out of an airplane for fun! Fuck yeah! I want to be a part of that.

I start my AFF. I see the instructors talking about their fun jumps. I want to be a part of that.

I start skydiving at a funjumper friendly dropzone. I see the fun jumpers huddled and talking amongst themselves. I want of be part of that.

I keep skydiving. Some funjumpers invite me along. Can i free fly? No, I see the free fliers talking amongst themselves. I want to be a part of that.

I travel a lot and jump at different dropzones for fun. I meet old men who like to jump with me. I see the free fliers talking amongst themselves. Why are they not talking to me?

12 dropzones later. I'm on leave and get to skydive with my highschool buddy. I see the fee fliers talking amongst themselves. Why are they not talking to us?

Skydive is not available in Northern Japan. I watch BASE jumping videos. I go to Twin Falls to learn how to BASE. Everyone talks to me. Everyone jumps with me.

I'm a lonely BASE jumper in Northern Japan. I meet a traveling BASE jumper and we BASE jump 5 bridges in Japan. I meet the most experienced BASE jumper in Japan. We sleep in his house and eat his food, drink his beer. I'm part of that.

With all due respect freeflyiers, go fuck yourselves.

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this is what you do....
- 6 hours of tunnel time. get comfy on your head.
- buy a small enough rig that you dont look like a boot
- learn the lingo
- sign up for a big way camp, they will automatically expect you know what you're doing.
- make friends
-you're in
its really not that hard bro, suck it up and conform already :D

I do know what you are talking about though, and all you really got to do is approach them and don't suck... unless the organizers are beginner friendly and like to mix it up.... they are not going to come to you. if they are doing technical jumps that you cant keep up on, you are just putting everyone in danger.

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I am sorry the freefly community has turned into this.
Some of my best experiences in my career was when I would introduce myself to the out of town skydivers and try to work them into my skydives. And a couple of those people have turned into life long friends.
It seems its getting more wide spread like a cancer.

One of the reasons I have chosen to get out of the sport now.

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It seems like you either have to be into VRW, or else you have to be willing to pay for a coach jump if you want certain freefliers to jump with you.
She is Da Man, and you better not mess with Da Man,
because she will lay some keepdown on you faster than, well, really fast. ~Billvon

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Or you have to be wealthy enough to be in the "in" crowd at the wind tunnel.

I recently found it amazing that I thought I had a friend for life. Taught him some freefly, made sure he was on all my state records, even had a VRW team with him.
But then the wind tunnel opened up and there was no way I could afford to go there and now I can't even get him to return a text message.
Not a friend when you have to force them to hang out with you. lol

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Unfortunately your "friends" were assholes who were using you for what they could get before reverting to type.

Folk like these can be found all over the place. The trick is to spot them but it is not easy. Especially if you are a generous person.

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I go for my first skydive and i see what i did not know about at the time, "fun jumpers". Wow, these guys are here to jump out of an airplane for fun! Fuck yeah! I want to be a part of that.

I start my AFF. I see the instructors talking about their fun jumps. I want to be a part of that.

I start skydiving at a funjumper friendly dropzone. I see the fun jumpers huddled and talking amongst themselves. I want of be part of that.

I keep skydiving. Some funjumpers invite me along. Can i free fly? No, I see the free fliers talking amongst themselves. I want to be a part of that.

I travel a lot and jump at different dropzones for fun. I meet old men who like to jump with me. I see the free fliers talking amongst themselves. Why are they not talking to me?

12 dropzones later. I'm on leave and get to skydive with my highschool buddy. I see the fee fliers talking amongst themselves. Why are they not talking to us?

Skydive is not available in Northern Japan. I watch BASE jumping videos. I go to Twin Falls to learn how to BASE. Everyone talks to me. Everyone jumps with me.

I'm a lonely BASE jumper in Northern Japan. I meet a traveling BASE jumper and we BASE jump 5 bridges in Japan. I meet the most experienced BASE jumper in Japan. We sleep in his house and eat his food, drink his beer. I'm part of that.

With all due respect freeflyiers, go fuck yourselves.



dude can i come jump some bridges with you?
Flock University FWC / ZFlock
B.A.S.E. 1580
Aussie BASE 121

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With all due respect freeflyiers, go fuck yourselves.



LOL! I'm with you on that. No offense, but you freeflyers somehow think you're god's gift to skydiving. You generally do not say hi to new flyers, give them dirty looks at the tunnels, pack away from the rest of the crowds, pack where the RW's are packing yet come off as the "bad ass loners" and don't say hi, fuck around on a load because you think you're god's gift to skydiving, track along the jump line (yes i've seen video of a freeflyer tracking along a jump line).
Out of all the freeflyers i've seen only 1 came up to me, said hi, sparked up a conversation, and even suggested we jump together knowing full well i'm an RW flyer. Now that's a cool freeflyer unlike most of you.

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it is what you make of it...

you spend $3000 you did AFF, got some basic belly skills and belly jumpers would jump with you (just happens that most of them are old men)

You spend $3000 again and learned about BASE and Base jumpers jumped with you

You spend $2000, get a shin new wingsuit and do a FJC and wingsuiters jump with you...

You spend 3000 in the tunnel and learn to fly head up and all of a sudden load organiser can put you in some head up jumps, other fun jumpers will jump with you on head up jumps, spend another 3k 6 months down the road on head down in the tunnel and you'll start fitting in there...

I have put all my energy in WS and belly and just recently put some into freeflying (read I am at Eloy for 3 weeks learning head up stuff right now). I will happily jump with new belly and ws jumpers, just not all the time (I still want to progress my skills) and as someone just learning f=to freefly (hell I made my first few docks in sit the other day :D) i understand that I wont be included on every organised jump nor will any of the freefliers I have just met always want to jump with me...

as a side note freefliers are just a kinda closed group, but they are a big group from what i can tell...ws fliers on the other hand...[:/]

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Maybe some people here should wipe the sand out of their vageges. A guy once tracked along jumprun? What a dick all freeflyers must be!

I think freeflyers are nothing else then any other jumpers out there. Most are cool, but there's always some dicks. Don't expect to be brought along big FF groups if you don't have sufficient skills to do it safely. It's a discipline where you have to put effort in, like any other discipline in this sport.

To me, it looks like you expect that others come up to you and start a conversation, are you aware that it's okay if you take initiative?

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I didn't jump with you ya ditty disgusting non freeflier.. you fucking rock on you belly though dude ;) how's the tunnel progressing :)
You are not now, nor will you ever be, good enough to not die in this sport (Sparky)
My Life ROCKS!
How's yours doing?

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Dude it works both ways. Why do they have to come up to you? Have you tried approaching these guys and learning something? That's what I did and I've met some really cool guys. I don't expect any one to just approach me. Who the hell am I? Go seek it out. Be hungry! We all started out in the same place, with a goofy helmet, a suit that doesn't fit, and a gigantic rig. I love free flying and unfortunately it's exclusive sometimes due to the danger factor in some of the jumps. We all have to put in the time to learn. Find a good FF coach, tunnel if you can afford it, read articles, watch videos, whatever you can do. Where there's a will there's a way. Stop hating on free flyers. "Skygods" exist in all disciplines.

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waterdog73

Dude it works both ways. Why do they have to come up to you? Have you tried approaching these guys and learning something? That's what I did and I've met some really cool guys. I don't expect any one to just approach me. Who the hell am I? Go seek it out. Be hungry! We all started out in the same place, with a goofy helmet, a suit that doesn't fit, and a gigantic rig. I love free flying and unfortunately it's exclusive sometimes due to the danger factor in some of the jumps. We all have to put in the time to learn. Find a good FF coach, tunnel if you can afford it, read articles, watch videos, whatever you can do. Where there's a will there's a way. Stop hating on free flyers. "Skygods" exist in all disciplines.



+1

Also, if you cant afford the tunnel doing a lot of solo jumps is a must. Unless you can afford the coaching in which, if you can, then you can probably afford the tunnel.

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waterdog73

Dude it works both ways. Why do they have to come up to you? Have you tried approaching these guys and learning something?



Oh for f***'s sake. He brought up the elephant in the room even though skydivers are supposed to be "one big happy family." Yes, it's true that many skydivers don't want to jump with others that aren't skillful. We can all accept it.

Moving on...

A few things that helped me along the way (other than a lot of tunnel time)
- Go to boogies with plenty of freefly organizers. If a boogie has just one freefly organizer, their time is going to get eaten up quickly. There are other boogies (Carolinafest comes to mind) that have plenty of organizers for all levels. They do a good job of matching skill levels, so you can continue jumping with others.
- Improve your skills. (Go to a tunnel camp or pay for a coach.) The "pay it forward" atmosphere of skydiving, while it is still there, is becoming less prevalent. You can either fight it, complain about it, or accept it. If you want to jump with people at a certain skill level, in general you need to obtain that skill level. There are still exceptions to this, and I am grateful to those that have slummed it with me over the years.
- Be happy belly flying. And that is also a-ok. If you find that they are more welcoming, there really is no reason to become a part of the cool kids club.
There's a thin line between Saturday night and Sunday morning

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I really dislike generalizations and I'm sorry to hear you have had bad experiences.

I haven't had a problem (not a freeflier). I don't get the animosity that exists between RW and freefliers and in many cases it is real, rather than friendly banter. Aside from that, there is a group of rich kids that spend lots on tunnel and jump matching ninja suits - but I wouldn't have anything in common anyway.
Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived.

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Vallerina


Oh for f***'s sake. He brought up the elephant in the room even though skydivers are supposed to be "one big happy family." Yes, it's true that many skydivers don't want to jump with others that aren't skillful. We can all accept it.

Moving on...



understanding that this group of highly skilled jumpers are making very high speed technical jumps with hours of tunnel time training hundreds if not thousands of times for an upcoming national or state record they're too busy to say hello to people. :P

Bealio

I see the free fliers talking amongst themselves. Why are they not talking to me?



I've always found that if you say "Hi" first nearly everyone is approachable, friendly and easy to speak with but a lot of people are also very busy. It's a preconception not accurate in my own experience. :)
Skydiving for me has always been like the ending of the video which came out by USPA today I'd like to think. :S
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kTwT2qJa5Rs

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I recently got some freefly couching and scheduled some tunnel time.

One of the few skydiving friends I have said that the skydiving mentality has changed and it makes him very frustrated. He said ten years ago after a jump, jumpers would say "dude, that was fucking awesome!" now it's more like "hey man, you were back sliding a bit". It's almost as if everyone is in a hurry to +1 up eachother rather than just have fun.

I understand that this is a generalization and I've had numerous accounts with friendly, awesome jumpers. I just wish it felt more like family. If only i had a good set of tits...

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Bealio


One of the few skydiving friends I have said that the skydiving mentality has changed and it makes him very frustrated. He said ten years ago after a jump, jumpers would say "dude, that was fucking awesome!" now it's more like "hey man, you were back sliding a bit". It's almost as if everyone is in a hurry to +1 up eachother rather than just have fun.



What's up with the 3rd degree on freeflying?

Oneupmanship has not been my experience at all. The only time someone has given me technical feedback has been when I asked for it or I would've made a dock if...Its always been appreciated. I suppose if I had a gradual backslide for the entire jump my jump partner would say something. What's wrong with that? I'm not fun to jump with and I'm not safe for the load. I deserve to know that so I can fix it.

I jump with my wife and we've progressed very well by having a consistent partner. Progression is an important component of FF and it makes sense to get in where you fit in. We aren't trying to do a 6 way HD jump and we aren't trying to jump with someone who can't maintain a FF speed. Our sweet spot is 2-4 way sitfly jump with folks who can make docks, adjust fall rate, and make a sitfly exit.

Another good example is when you are jumping in a 4 way with 2 people who can maintain a FF speed but haven't developed a good range yet. This happened to me on my 200th jump. One of the jumpers flies about 160 the other about 145 so by breakoff time we couldn't locate the entire group. Both good jump partners just not together.

A few months later my wife was jumping with the faster jumper when the slower jumper asked if he could join the group. She left the group without giving a detailed safety explanation of why she was leaving. I'm sure this could be interpreted as being snobbish or whatever. She left because those 2 jumpers together pose a safety hazard. Does this make her a typical FF snob? She's not obligated to give a detailed safety reason or hurt someone's feeling by pointing out that they need a little more skill for that group's safety. She also isn't obligated to expose herself to the risk either. The same thing that you talked about in the beginning of the thread about how freeflyers don't reach out to other disciplines or new faces at the dz can happen inside of the ff discipline as well; with people you have jumped with before.
Its about managing risks and not perpetuating DZ drama.

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Just "walking off" isn't very constructive though. Anyone with more than a handful of jumps should understand if there's going to be a fall-rate disparity.

Part of organizing larger jumps is aligning fall-rates and dressing for success. New freeflyers seem to fail at this more frequently than the RW crowd (which is why it's important to not neglect the basics in the rush to get on your head).

Even if you have an insane range of speed you aren't going to want to fly maxed out one way or the other though... small people need fast suits and/or lead and the anvils need some drag.
NSCR-2376, SCR-15080

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