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Bealio

It's a love/hate thing

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Walk up to the group and ask if you can destroy their dive by turning it into a zoo. It worked for me. If people recognize that you know your skill level, want to learn, are easy to get along with, and have a decent sense of humor they are much more likely to include you.

It's not about being the coolest, the best thing about this sport is the fun you have screwing up, learning, and building good relationships with great people along the way.

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Or to paraphrase: the problem with skydiving is all the damn skydivers :)

When I was a young pup all the free fliers would jump with the noobs one on one and then we'd run out and do zoo dives. There are ways to include newer jumpers, but the serious people do 10s of hours in the tunnel and don't want to feel like they are wasting their jump.

It took me 400 jumps over 2 seasons to dock head down before the tunnel existed. It kept the experience differential small enough for longer that it was easier to include people. I think the tunnel has been worse for the sport in that regard.

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I do a bit of everything except CRW.
and admit FF is my weak area, but so long as I'm in the air I'm happy.
If you want to break the ice with the "Freeflyers" if you've got a solid 4 way(or 2 way even) belly group walk over and ask to do a hybrid with them. Turn points with hangers/stingers.
Hybrids rock!

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Bealio

I go for my first skydive and i see what i did not know about at the time, "fun jumpers". Wow, these guys are here to jump out of an airplane for fun! Fuck yeah! I want to be a part of that.

I start my AFF. I see the instructors talking about their fun jumps. I want to be a part of that.

I start skydiving at a funjumper friendly dropzone. I see the fun jumpers huddled and talking amongst themselves. I want of be part of that.

I keep skydiving. Some funjumpers invite me along. Can i free fly? No, I see the free fliers talking amongst themselves. I want to be a part of that.

I travel a lot and jump at different dropzones for fun. I meet old men who like to jump with me. I see the free fliers talking amongst themselves. Why are they not talking to me?

12 dropzones later. I'm on leave and get to skydive with my highschool buddy. I see the fee fliers talking amongst themselves. Why are they not talking to us?

Skydive is not available in Northern Japan. I watch BASE jumping videos. I go to Twin Falls to learn how to BASE. Everyone talks to me. Everyone jumps with me.

I'm a lonely BASE jumper in Northern Japan. I meet a traveling BASE jumper and we BASE jump 5 bridges in Japan. I meet the most experienced BASE jumper in Japan. We sleep in his house and eat his food, drink his beer. I'm part of that.

With all due respect freeflyiers, go fuck yourselves.



did you do this with Mitch?
BASE 1519

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My experience has been the exact opposite, although it sounds like I was proactive vs. the wait and see approach you took. I've moved around a lot for work and everytime I get to a new DZ I'll ask who to talk to about freeflying. You make a couple of jumps with 1-2 other people and the DZ in general gets to know where you stand with your skills. It grows after that.

For better or worse FF has grown since it first came into being. While I have no problem doing a 2/3-way with newer jumpers, if it's gonna be a "I saw you the whole skydive from 200' away" and it turns out I had to chase them across the sky, then chances are it'll be a one and done until they get a bit better. This has nothing to do with me being a dick, but this is not a cheap sport and I do like to make my money count.

The tunnel has advanced things rapidly and it continues to do so. You have to either put in the time and effort to build a solid foundation or you don't. If you don't, the number of people who will listen to you bitch is probably close to 0.

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hokierower

My experience has been the exact opposite, although it sounds like I was proactive vs. the wait and see approach you took. I've moved around a lot for work and everytime I get to a new DZ I'll ask who to talk to about freeflying. You make a couple of jumps with 1-2 other people and the DZ in general gets to know where you stand with your skills. It grows after that.

For better or worse FF has grown since it first came into being. While I have no problem doing a 2/3-way with newer jumpers, if it's gonna be a "I saw you the whole skydive from 200' away" and it turns out I had to chase them across the sky, then chances are it'll be a one and done until they get a bit better. This has nothing to do with me being a dick, but this is not a cheap sport and I do like to make my money count.

The tunnel has advanced things rapidly and it continues to do so. You have to either put in the time and effort to build a solid foundation or you don't. If you don't, the number of people who will listen to you bitch is probably close to 0.



Yep. My experience was about them same. I was told to get good at back and when I could hold a sit, They would let me join in. I would do 2 or 3 ways and be that guy 200' away. I've gotten much better and now I'm teaching people, but like you said its not going to be a regular thing if I'm chasing you all around all the time.

It's for sure done when I try and give pointers and people won't listen or try and argue with the video. I could go jump with joe, bob, Steve, and Phil and I know it'll be a fun jump because we can all stay with each other and it's always fun.

I will gladly let someone turn a jump into a zoo dive a few times before I'll get irritated. And I'm more than happy to jump with someone one on one and give feedback. I guess it's really their attitude about it and their honesty with theirselves in regards to their abilities. Nothing is more annoying than going up with a sky god and having to chase them around.

Hell, I suck. I can stay head up and have no problem getting around and docking ect. Flip me over head down and I might as well be in AFF again. I don't go try and join the big head down jumps. See how that works? I'm getting coaching for my upside down awesomeness....
I was that kid jumping out if his tree house with a bed sheet. My dad wouldn't let me use the ladder to try the roof...

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if you bounce around the dz alot, no one will jump with you since no one knows you and they don't wanna spend time getting to know you.

freefliers tends to be pot smokers, if you smoke pot that kinda gets you in.

bellyfliers tends to have real job and they can't smoke pot so they drink instead. if you like to drink that kinda gets you in as well.

truth is that vast majority of fun jumper's number decreased.
party isn't the same anymore.
and who has recently heard of no plan jumps? we used to do em all the time. no plan, zoo dive, just have fun and go safety briefing after wards.

Now we plan out exits, and several points, when there is a plan you better be able to execute, or you are wasting all of our money.

No one wants zoo dives anymore, or soul flying. Spend some money in tunnel and you'll be invited.

If that sounds horrible, go BASE jump. Base jumping is way cooler, you don't have to hold hands, you don't have to do any technical body flying, just pitch PC in time.

200 jumps in 5 year frame is not enough for 2014. It might have been acceptable back in 90's. But not now, 5 year old kids can out fly you.
Bernie Sanders for President 2016

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stayhigh

if you bounce around the dz alot, no one will jump with you since no one knows you and they don't wanna spend time getting to know you.
freefliers tends to be pot smokers, if you smoke pot that kinda gets you in.
bellyfliers tends to have real job and they can't smoke pot so they drink instead. if you like to drink that kinda gets you in as well.
truth is that vast majority of fun jumper's number decreased.
party isn't the same anymore.
and who has recently heard of no plan jumps? we used to do em all the time. no plan, zoo dive, just have fun and go safety briefing after wards.
Now we plan out exits, and several points, when there is a plan you better be able to execute, or you are wasting all of our money.
No one wants zoo dives anymore, or soul flying. Spend some money in tunnel and you'll be invited.
If that sounds horrible, go BASE jump. Base jumping is way cooler, you don't have to hold hands, you don't have to do any technical body flying, just pitch PC in time.
200 jumps in 5 year frame is not enough for 2014. It might have been acceptable back in 90's. But not now, 5 year old kids can out fly you.


This post is classic!

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I solved this problem by issuing a challenge to them. I walk up to them. introduce myself . hey man what's up? how long you been jumping? cool . me? 34 years. :P them. :oand then i ask them how slow can they sit fly? can you sit fly at 160 miles an hour I ask?. mostly they say. oh yes of course. then I tell them I can belly fly at a hundred and sixty miles an hour. Then they call bull shit on me. . I say come on up and watch. then I prove it to them.;) problem solved. they all want to jump with me after that.:P no jumpsuit t-shirt and shorts. bring it. but you have to be of certain. ahem. aerodynamic shape to pull this off;) right? . up top. where are my peeps? chris spence you know me and you could set a smoking no contact base for a hybrid :D:D:D

i have on occasion been accused of pulling low . My response. Naw I wasn't low I'm just such a big guy I look closer than I really am .


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keithbar

I solved this problem by issuing a challenge to them. I walk up to them. introduce myself . hey man what's up? how long you been jumping? cool . me? 34 years. :P them. :oand then i ask them how slow can they sit fly? can you sit fly at 160 miles an hour I ask?. mostly they say. oh yes of course. then I tell them I can belly fly at a hundred and sixty miles an hour. Then they call bull shit on me. . I say come on up and watch. then I prove it to them.;) problem solved. they all want to jump with me after that.:P no jumpsuit t-shirt and shorts. bring it. but you have to be of certain. ahem. aerodynamic shape to pull this off;) right? . up top. where are my peeps? chris spence you know me and you could set a smoking no contact base for a hybrid :D:D:D



No shit Keith is not lying. He was on his belly and I was in a sit at the last Richmond THE Boogie. Freakin awesome! I did not want to get involved in this conversation I just wanted to testify that Keith is not lying and if you get a chance... do a jump with him. Next time we meet I want to see if I can dock with you on my head Keith. B|

Side note... I'm a FF'er not a pothead and I have a real job. :P
Life is all about ass....either you're kicking it, kissing it, working it off, or trying to get a piece of it.
Muff Brother #4382 Dudeist Skydiver #000
www.fundraiseadventure.com

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Next time we meet I want to see if I can dock with you on my head Keith. :P come on down to the Fitzgerald boogie in March. and we will make it happen. I have had a number of free flyers dock on me head down over the years. I remember one jump at Bardstown Kentucky with Paul Robarts. he spent the whole dive head down transitioning between right and left hand Docks. and Pete certain and I used to do it down in Alabama all the time I have quite a bit of footage. I miss both of those guys terribly R. I. P. :( Bros

i have on occasion been accused of pulling low . My response. Naw I wasn't low I'm just such a big guy I look closer than I really am .


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keithbar

Next time we meet I want to see if I can dock with you on my head Keith. :P

come on down to the Fitzgerald boogie in March. and we will make it happen. I have had a number of free flyers dock on me head down over the years. I remember one jump at Bardstown Kentucky with Paul Robarts. he spent the whole dive head down transitioning between right and left hand Docks. and Pete certain and I used to do it down in Alabama all the time I have quite a bit of footage. I miss both of those guys terribly R. I. P. :( Bros

Love me some Bardstown jumpers!
Life is all about ass....either you're kicking it, kissing it, working it off, or trying to get a piece of it.
Muff Brother #4382 Dudeist Skydiver #000
www.fundraiseadventure.com

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Remember this next time you see a new guy at a dz. Go talk to him, bring him in to the fold. You don't have to jump with someone to include them in the community!

BUT: you can also grow your own group of people to jump with in whatever discipline you want.

This is true of the most inclusive group of skydivers: CReW Dogs. If they don't have someone to jump with, no CReW. So they make more CReW jumpers by teaching their skills and sharing their equipment. It can work at any dz with any discipline.

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I watched the WindGames today.

It felt like watching rollerblading, ice skating, or any other gay shit you can find.

Why, in the name of god, would you invest time and money in such a discipline ???

Now I can tell you why they don't speak to you: they're too busy sucking at life. AND, they probably think they're the shit.
Better be on the ground wishing you were up there than being up there wishing you were on the ground.

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This.

waterdog73

Dude it works both ways. Why do they have to come up to you? Have you tried approaching these guys and learning something? That's what I did and I've met some really cool guys. I don't expect any one to just approach me. Who the hell am I? Go seek it out. Be hungry! We all started out in the same place, with a goofy helmet, a suit that doesn't fit, and a gigantic rig. I love free flying and unfortunately it's exclusive sometimes due to the danger factor in some of the jumps. We all have to put in the time to learn. Find a good FF coach, tunnel if you can afford it, read articles, watch videos, whatever you can do. Where there's a will there's a way. Stop hating on free flyers. "Skygods" exist in all disciplines.


If this is your first night, you have to fight.

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I move to California. I ask some locals to jump their objects. They show me around and welcome me.

I get some freefly coaching, then schedule some tunnel time with the same coach. He doesn't remember me a week later.

I buy a wingsuit, do my FFC, and start flying.

I'm in line to board the aircraft for my 2nd WS jump and a guy asks me if he can jump with me and take pictures.

Every jump i go on with a wingsuit, someone asks if they can jump with me. In turn, after more experience, I ask everyone in a wingsuit if I can jump with them. I'm part of that.

With all due respect freeflyers, go fuck yourselves.

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This is funny. There's a pretty good freeflier at my DZ who jumps a lot. One morning, it's just the two of us at the DZ, plus the tandems. I ask him to jump with me. He tells me he'd rather jump solo.

I think to myself that I just got told, "Not if you were the last fun jumper on Earth!"

"So many fatalities and injuries are caused by decisions jumpers make before even getting into the aircraft. Skydiving can be safe AND fun at the same time...Honest." - Bill Booth

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it's just the two of us at the DZ, plus the tandems. I ask him to jump with me. He tells me he'd rather jump solo.

I think to myself that I just got told, "Not if you were the last fun jumper on Earth!"



He may have had other plans long before you got there. And this problem cuts both ways.

I had recently been in the tunnel with an incredible coach and flier and within the next week, he asked me in the loading area if I wanted to jump with him. I said 'thank you, no' because I was planning to do a hop-n-pop.

Some people are cautious about changing plans in the loading area and some people may be planning to work on a specific skill or learning objective that requires focus -- or may be a different discipline from what you are planning. Have respect for that.

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:ph34r:I would love to wingsuit with you someday dude. but I bet you won't like it . no one wants to wingsuit and then fly dirty as hell.:SI have the same problem wingsuiting that I do doing RW everybody else is just a floaty bastard.:P but maybe I'm just a fat guy in a little suit tribute to Chris Farley
Quote

:( that's why I just belly fly at Freefly speeds with the skinny f****

i have on occasion been accused of pulling low . My response. Naw I wasn't low I'm just such a big guy I look closer than I really am .


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I'm in line to board the aircraft for my 2nd WS jump and a guy asks me if he can jump with me and take pictures.



Actually, This is a huge reason why I haven't done as many WS jumps as I'd originally intended when I took my FFC.

There's only one or two WS groups allowed per aircraft at most DZs, so you almost have to jump with other people. Jumping with other people means now you have to concentrate on the other people instead of yourself, which means you can't really focus and learn and fix yourself, and frankly I'm just not comfortable with that. Especially when on one of the few solo jumps I did have, I managed to, unintentionally and without much effort, induce a fast 360 degree flat left turn. Now imagine I'd had some other newb WS guy off to my left. More especially when you end up with somebody who's already jumping WS and Camera at 230 jumps.

With Freeflying, on the other hand, you're expected to put in the time and effort solo. The barrier to entry is "can you hold a sit", which can take dozens of solo jumps before you're even vertically stable, much less horizontally so, not many FF people are going to walk up and ask if you want to do a two-way on your second FF jump.

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