Panasonic HDC-SD5 for skydiving?

[scottjaco 0]

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Do you believe 1080 only comes in interlaced flavors?

As soon as they have a 1080 progressive camera for 5 grand, that doesn't use pixel shifting or uprezzing to achieve it's claim, I'll jump right on the 1080 bandwagon with you.

[DSE 3]

Already there, as if it mattered anyway.
HDCAM (good enough for George Lucas and Steven Spielberg among others) records 1440 x 1080. It does use 1.333 PAR, but that's not pixel shifting nor uprezzing. They're anamorphic pixels.
Varicam (good enough for a huge percentage of non-film commercials until a couple years ago) records 960 x 720, and is upsampled to 1440 x 1080 for broadcast.
XDCAM EX is full-raster and is in the cost-class you want.
XDCAM HD is full raster 1920 x 1080 imager, recording a 1440 x 1080 image. It does use 1.333 PAR, but that's not pixel shifting nor uprezzing. They're anamorphic pixels.
Canon XLH1 is a full raster imager, recording a 1440 x 1080 image. It does use 1.333 PAR, but that's not pixel shifting nor uprezzing. They're anamorphic pixels.
Sony V1U is a 1080 sensor, no pixel shifting or uprezzing. It does use 1.333 PAR, but that's not pixel shifting nor uprezzing. They're anamorphic pixels. Anamorphic imaging has been a standard since the 1930's and began heavy use in Hollywood in the 50's. If it's good enough for Orson Wells, Alfred Hitchcock, Clint Eastwood, Mel Gibson, Michael Bay, George Lucas, Steven Spielberg, Dean Devlin, John Swartzmann, and a host of others, I'm quite sure it's good enough for you and I, yeah?

It's a lame discussion, particularly when you're arguing from the standpoint of a poorly built HDV camcorder such as the JVC HD100U. Even JVC is embarassed over that camera.

On the subject of 1080:
1080 comes in both progressive and interlaced formats. Interlaced still very much has its place in the world today. How many broadcasters are sending any kind of a progressive signal? (I know the answer, do you?)
~Yes, 1080p is a superior format to 720p.
~Yes, 1080i60 provides smoother motion than 720p30. Critically so in high motion scenes.
~Yes, 720p30 can provide sharper image detail than 1080i in high motion scenes, but it's juddered when in motion. Great for still/freeze frames though.
~Yes, 720p can have problems when displayed on interlaced displays.
~Yes, interlaced content can exhibit artifacting when displayed on a progressive display.
~Yes, 720p offers approx 25% greater resolution than 1080i when you don't factor Kell. When you factor Kell, the difference is negligible.
~Yes, 1080p provides better everything mentioned above.
~Yes, there are many 1080p cameras; more than there are 720p cameras.
~Yes, 1080 (as Laszlo first mentioned) has become the predominant format of choice by consumers, broadcasters, and most production houses.
Poll your tandem vid customers, I'd wager you won't find even one, that has a native 720p display. Not one. Ask em' about "full HD" displays, and they'll all tell you that's what they have, if they have HD displays at all.
Poll the forum; you'll find folks have 1080 or 1080-capable displays whereas they don't see, and never have seen a native 720p marketing campaign, or monitors advertised as being 720p. And why would they? If a consumer sees a native 720p display next to a native 1080 "full HD" display, most folks are gonna buy the higher number, simply because it's "more" whether it's better or not.
Give it up already. You don't know what you're talking about.

[scottjaco 0]

Every camera on your list is well over 5 grand, except the Sony V1U.

While the V1U comes close in performance, it is plagued by smaller 1/4 sensors, long 15-frame GOP compression and consumer like ergonomics.

You are correct, JVC should be embarrassed comparing their 5K pro-sumer cameras to cameras costing 10K+. It’s not in the same class.

JVC should also be embarrassed with their bad QC that continues to plague the HD110 owners despite your claim that they improved their hardware components.

Bottom line, for the price, the HD100/110’s do offer the best compromise between resolution, compression, and ergonomics.

[PharmerPhil 0]

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...good enough for George Lucas and Steven Spielberg among others......good enough for Orson Wells, Alfred Hitchcock, Clint Eastwood, Mel Gibson, Michael Bay, George Lucas, Steven Spielberg, Dean Devlin, John Swartzmann, and a host of others...

Yeah, what do they know.

[DSE 3]

5999.00 isn't "well over 5 grand" in my book.

"Plagued by .25 sensors???" OK. Whatever.
ESPN, EXPN, CNN, Oxygen, have all aired footage I've shot with the V1, Dean Devlin just used several V1's on "Isobar" and "Leverage" (both of which will be 35mm releases). "Urban Justice" (Steven Seagal) also used em, as did "Flight of Fury." "Survivorman" has used V1's along with HC3/5's. So has "Deadliest Catch" and other Discovery shows Yeah, they're just crummy lil shows, but let's not lose scope over what you're doing vs what my company is doing with clients like Seagal and Devlin. Ever Norm Kent purchased a V1 with it's "plagued" imagers.

It's one thing to measurebate (and it's fun to toss numbers around). It's another to be actually using the tools and knowing what they will and won't do in a variety of circumstances. All that aside Each time I answer your complaint, you come up with a new one, so there is little point in trying to continue. I'm a lousy dancer.

[diablopilot 2]

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Do you believe 1080 only comes in interlaced flavors?

As soon as they have a 1080 progressive camera for 5 grand, that doesn't use pixel shifting or uprezzing to achieve it's claim, I'll jump right on the 1080 bandwagon with you.

I'm SURE he'll sleep better tonight.

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You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

[scottjaco 0]

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Survivorman" has used V1's along with HC3/5's. So has "Deadliest Catch" and other Discovery shows Yeah, they're just crummy lil shows

Discovery hates all HDV cameras 720p & 1080i because of their heavy GOP compression and small chip size.

They do however allow 25% of their footage to be non-hd content. That is why they allow your Sony V1U, HC3/5's. While these cameras are technically HD, they are not up to Discovery's rigid HD standards. Your V1U was needed because it was basically used as an underwater crash cam.

They do however allow the JVC HD200 series with the aftermarket 10K lens to be used for certain studio applications. In this scenario, they are not confined to the 25% restriction because even Discovery realizes how great these low cost cameras are.

[DSE 3]

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Survivorman" has used V1's along with HC3/5's. So has "Deadliest Catch" and other Discovery shows Yeah, they're just crummy lil shows

Discovery hates all HDV cameras 720p & 1080i because of their heavy GOP compression and small chip size.

They do however allow 25% of their footage to be non-hd content. That is why they allow your Sony V1U, HC3/5's. While these cameras are technically HD, they are not up to Discovery's rigid HD standards. Your V1U was needed because it was basically used as an underwater crash cam.
They do however allow the JVC HD200 series with the aftermarket 10K lens to be used for certain studio applications. In this scenario, they are not confined to the 25% restriction because even Discovery realizes how great these low cost cameras are.

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A lot has changed since Discovery reviewed HDV in September of 2003. I don't recall seeing you in Silver Spring for the Discovery Producer's seminar?

Your first line (which is incorrect) is runs counter to your last line (which is also incorrect). Changing a lens does not impact the chip size nor the GOP compression format.
"Survivorman" is 100% HDV.
"Deadliest Catch" is nearly 100% HDV.
Which of any of these cameras are you putting on your head for skydiving, Scott?

[scottjaco 0]

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I don't recall seeing you in Silver Spring for the Discovery Producer's seminar?

I was there. I held a symposium on why 720p is better than 1080i and how easy it is to manipulate the general public with a larger number. Sorry you missed it.

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Your first line (which is incorrect) is runs counter to your last line (which is also incorrect). Changing a lens does not impact the chip size nor the GOP compression format.

Everything starts with the lens. A 10K lens allows the small 1/3" CCD's to output acceptable broadcast quality. Discovery initially denounced the HD100 but reconsidered after testing the HD200 with the aftermarket lens.

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"Survivorman" is 100% HDV.
"Deadliest Catch" is nearly 100% HDV.

Again, these HDV cameras are used for budget restrictions. Are you really going to bring a Varicam onto a fishing boat that is most likely going to end up drenched.

Compromises were made throughout the entire production. Why do you think they have Bon Jovi singing the theme song?

[DSE 3]

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Again, these HDV cameras are used for budget restrictions. Are you really going to bring a Varicam onto a fishing boat that is most likely going to end up drenched.

Bingo. budget. Which is where we started this discussion, these cameras are perfect for low-budget, average quality productions. Like Discovery, MTV, ESPN, EXPN, CNN, Oxygen, ABC, NBC, MSNBC, History Channel, A&E, Sundance, Sci-Fi, HBO, and more (We've shot HDV primary for all of the above).
Of course it all starts with the lens. And it finishes with the codec. No great mystery or statement there.
You're great at tossing FUD, yet it's apparent wedding videography doesn't quite challenge the technology, or perhaps you'd understand more about the various applications of camera tools.

None of this discussion has anything to do with skydiving photography, so we'll end it here. CreativeCOW.net or DVInfo.net are more appropriate for the final direction of this discussion.
When you do begin skydiving with a camera, let us know. We'll have more to talk about.