Boot Windows XP on an Intel Mac

[freeflydrew 0]

Apple just released a beta program called Boot camp. It will be included in the next version of the operating system called Leopard.
Basically, you can choose which operating system to boot into and either will completely take over your machine... different than virtual pc or other emulation.

Huge potential for Apple Sales!

[murrays 0]

Just saw that on tuaw.com. I still want something that will run Windows in a window. I work on Mac accounting programs and use Windows tax programs...I want to be able to look from one program to the other and have them both up at the same time.

But this is huge....it means that potential switchers that need to use one or two Windows programs now have an option that will run at native speed without emulation....and they can boot into OS X for everything else. They also don't lose their investment in Windows software.

Drew, any thoughts on whether Microsoft will release a copy of Virtual PC that will do what I want it to do?

--
Murray

"No tyranny is so irksome as petty tyranny: the officious demands of policemen, government clerks, and electromechanical gadgets." - Edward Abbey

[freeflydrew 0]

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Drew, any thoughts on whether Microsoft will release a copy of Virtual PC that will do what I want it to do?

I really don't know. I don't think they will until they finalize the next version of the Windows Operating System (called "LongWait"), and have redesigned Virtual PC to work with it and and also to work with the intel chip. That's a lot of work for Microsoft, so who knows.

Although there's a market for Virtual PC, I don't think it's on the top of their list nor do I think it's in high demand... perhaps "BootCamp" will push it even further away.

But maybe I'm completely wrong and they will introduce it next Tuesday!
:-)

[goobersnuftda 0]

Realise what has gone on in 2005 and you will not be surprised that the mighty APPLE was forced into this position. They in no way have done this out of the goodness of their hearts.

It has been 8 months now that the most beloved hackers in the world bypassed the Trusted Platform Module that the Apple O/S looks for. A chip installed in all crap Apple machines that makes sure ALL software and hardware is only true blue APPLE. That means big $$$ for Apple because they get a cut of everything.

So what does this hacked version of the Apple O/S mean? How about running it on a no name IBM system that costs no more than $300 and blows the ass off any Apple G4 or G5 !!! Pop in a no name modem, sound card or anything else that Apple hasn't approved (and got a 60% cut of) and it works without a problem.

CLICK HERE FOR FULL STORY

I'm sure IBM machines may have a problem here or there but that is what has made them great. Fast, cheap, affordable and with world wide compeition, no one is selling proprietary hardware at a 300% markup.

[freeflydrew 0]

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How about running it on a no name IBM system that costs no more than $300 and blows the ass off any Apple G4 or G5 !!! Pop in a no name modem, sound card or anything else that Apple hasn't approved (and got a 60% cut of) and it works without a problem.

Totally objective thoughts.

I love posts like this... Definitely not a Mac user

LOL

[goobersnuftda 0]

Ahh, what is what makes life interesting :)

I started out with Apple, learned my lesson and moved on. Life is all about compromises. Decide what you can live with and make a choise. Sure I have chosen a side and just like in sports, cheer for your team !!!!!

I got a link for you
Click and Download Here

[freeflydrew 0]

Too funny...

Fortunatley I'm in a position to discuss this objectively, rather than cheering for one team and knocking the other. I'm the Head of Tech Support at a school with 900 machines that hosts both windows and macs. I own both platforms and use and support both platforms

There are advantages and disadvantages to owning either windows or macs. The big disadvantage to owning a mac is that none of the windows software would work on it, and the big disadvantages to owning a windows machine is that they are much more vulnerable to worms, viruses, popups and hijackers and the OS is significantly flawed. Over time they will slow down dramatically, and every year you have to pay more and more money to have someone come in and cleanup/fix your machine, and renew your antivirus subscription.

Fortunately this latest announcement from Apple resolves the issue of Mac users not being able to run windows programs on their machines.

[indyz 1]

Are they also releasing drivers? That seems to be the main problem right now, you can boot XP just fine, but nothing useful works because there aren't any drivers.

Anyway, I would count on VMWare for Intel Macs long before Virtual PC. VMWare currently has Windows and Linux versions, so they already have a good start on the issues that porting would pose.

I'm one of those users that hates dual booting. I'll take the speed hit from running Virtual PC or VMWare long before I'll waste my time bringing the system up and down every time I need Outlook.

[murrays 0]

I believe that Bootcamp includes the drivers needed so that XP will work with the Intel Mac machines. Apple also just released firmware updates in conjunction with all of this. MacRumors has an article about it. Looks like you'd also be able to install Linux if you were so inclined...very interesting stuff.

--
Murray

"No tyranny is so irksome as petty tyranny: the officious demands of policemen, government clerks, and electromechanical gadgets." - Edward Abbey

[tso-d_chris 0]

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How about running it on a no name IBM system that costs no more than $300 and blows the ass off any Apple G4 or G5 !

Good luck finding that system. Factor in the price of the software, and your no name PC will be just as/more expensive. And slower.

[tso-d_chris 0]

Quote

I still want something that will run Windows in a window. I work on Mac accounting programs and use Windows tax programs...I want to be able to look from one program to the other and have them both up at the same time.

I have seen someone running a Mac and a Windows machine simultaneously, with Mac OS on one screen, Windows on a second screen, the same keyboard and mouse. The mouse (and files) could be moved from one screen to the other, as though they were the same screen.

I'm not sure exactly how it was done, but it seemed to work well.

For Great Deals on Gear

[freeflydrew 0]

MacRumors.com

Parallels released their Windows virtualization solution for the Intel Mac today. The product is called Parallels Workstation 2.1 Beta and a free fully functional copy is available for download now.

Unlike Apple's Boot Camp solution which was released yesterday, Parallels solution allows you to run Windows XP (and other Intel-based operating systems) from within Mac OS X. Rebooting or Dual Booting is not required. This allows users to maintain their daily environment while also being able to use any desired Windows applications. It is only available for the Intel Macs and should provide near-native performance.
Parallels Workstation 2.1 Beta for Mac OS X is NOT simply a "dual-boot" solution; rather, it empowers users the ability to use Windows, Linux and any other operating system at the same time as Mac OS X, enabling users to enjoy the comfort of their Mac OS X desktop while still being able to use critical applications from other OSes.

Parallels appears to be taking advantage of the Intel Virtualization Technology which was included in the Intel Yonah processors that are now shipping in the Intel Macs.

While in free Beta testing at the moment, the final software package for Linux and Windows is priced from the company at $49.99.

MacRumors.com

[goobersnuftda 0]

Will all this new inovation going on, look beyond the current news of the ability to use windoze programs on a MAC and realize what the big picture truly is.

For years and years, APPLE has forced you to use true blue apple software. They have fought tooth and nail to keep you from going over to the dark side. Along came some hackers last year and opened the flood gates. Apple isn't stupid. Instead of throwing a hissy fit and saying "we not playing", Apple offered software to help their income while this transition is taking place. A percentage of something is better than 100% of nothing.

What this means is that inevatably people will move over to the flawed windoze dark side. The more comfortable people become with using windoze software, the more choise and availability they have, they will lean less and less on the Apple crutch and begin to stand on their own.

There are thousands, and thousands of software developers not hampered by Apple restrictions and true competition in the free market place. The most popular software company on the planet for still & video software, ADOBE wasn't even thinking of porting its newest version over to the MAC until 2007. What do you think the odds of that are now? BTW, Premiere Pro v2.0 and After Effects v7.0 released two months ago so very rock.

I'm not a hard core APPLE basher. I'm someone that started off with them and learned my lesson the hard way which left a sour fruit taste in my mouth. Windoze does suck and is flawed but it is so much more open and free with choises and competition. Sony was so hard core protectionist with their BETA format, it too went the way of the DODO bird. Things were going well and Apple was flat lining beautifuly until that damn I-Pod came along. That was like a charge from the cardio paddles to give one more breath of life chance into the company. With this latest blow, the Doctors are saying Apple is still alive but with the STROKE it has suffered, its previous computer line will not be the same
With my experience and what I see is going on, I would not start my life down the APPLE path. Apple uses its marketing savy to give free computers to schools in an effort to get the uneducated hooked on their product. Hopefully they keep buying Apple the rest of their life. No different than what Chev and Ford does with student insentives.

This is what will happen. Apple was a good computer company but was overshadowed and didn't know when the proper time was to get off the stage. They have made some very smart business decisions and what has been true for many world wide companies, they have discoverd that it is more profitable to change product lines. I-POD and over 1 Billion (that is a "B") in I-tunes sold in 2005 shows you where the real money is. Have you ever seen video of a U2 spy plane taking off? Once the aircraft has obtained significant lift on take off, the pogos are left behind on the runway. When the Ipod first came out, it could only be used on an Apple computer. Sales sucked, they sucked hard, but for those very few that were happy with it it and gave glowing reviews, the powers that be decided to port it over to IBM and BOOM !!!! Profits galore. What did we learn from that example?

Its all cool and trendy to have your little Apple notebook in college just like all the people do in the movies but don't be fooled. You don't want to buy this brand new potato and be holding it when the music stops.

[goobersnuftda 0]

Tired of me yapping yet? Didnt think so :)

Instead of playing gunia pig on your own computer, CNET did a little review and you can wath the video of how this apple dual boot thing works.

Click to watch video

Rebooting isn't a big deal to me. Back in the early days, I had a OS/2,widoze,DOS and another one all at the same time. Popped between all 4 of them until years later one dominated. Computers are the best :)

[johnny1488 1]

I don't know what happend back in the day to you, dude, but I love my Mac and OSX. I never used a pc for anything except internet and email. And even then the machines slowly ground to a hault. It was way too frustrating to do anything with.

When I got my powerbook I found out what a computer was for. I know found a great hobby (video editing) and run a good chunk of my life with the help of my powerbook. It has actually done what people always said a computer should do.

Did Steve Jobs rape your mother or something? I dont get why you think they suck so much. OSX works like it should. I feel sick whenever go near a windows machine now. Yes they have less software. But the software they do have actually works.

Im sure I am biased too, but I dont see how you got this sand in your vagina.

Johnny
--"This ain't no book club, we're all gonna die!"
Mike Rome

[goobersnuftda 0]

Back when I started, I was taking Engineering in University. Autocad was the rule of drafting and MAC had its own quirk just enough to limit you in what you wanted to do. PC's all though underpowered at the time, were everywhere and in all bussinesses and you needed to be compatible. Summer job board was split, 3 firms MAC based, 40 PC based. No brainer on which path to choose. Later when running my own bussiness, ACCPAC dominates and rules the North American accounting software market. MAC did it's thing but it was too late because the open market PCs were everywhere. Networks that were Apple based and Apple specific were a pain in the ass to work on and had even fewer people trained in their techincal staff and therefore cost more to call in for tech work. Exclusivity means pricey.

Sony had their BETA format which was far superior to anything out there at the time but they controlled it too tightly and people left it in the dust for something with better universality even though it was a lesser quality.

Now that there is true competition, Intel and AMD are kick ass companies competing against each other. Processors are smokin and comptition in the PC market means the consumer is the real winner in choise and selection of hardware/software. Hell, 5 years ago I had a VFX-1 virutal reality head gear for my home IBM computer. Made me sick landing on the air craft carrier in US NAVY FIGHERS and the paranoia in Duke Nukem 3D with the sounds in the headgear and shooting was too much. It was awesome :) Things like that for the apple who would sell to 1/10 of 1 perecent of your targeted market...forget it.

Apple came to a fork in the road with only 2 choises. Control you product so tightly that you strangle the growth of it or open it up and let it go. IBM let the genie out of the bottle and now dominates the market. Downside is you have less control about how it is run. Ex. Microsoft O/S on the IBM machines. Buggy, virus, spyware because some of the software was open source for the hackers to see but the upside is that you dominate the market. Last time I checked, the IBM based software sales kick ass compared to APPLE's software sales.

If Apple were a car, it would get 1,000 miles/gallon. Only problem is that there are only 3 gas stations for it and all the overpriced parts must be ordered through Apple. The PC vehicle gets a normal 30 miles/gallon but has 48,987 gas stations nation wide. All parts and accessories for it are cheap because there are thousands of competing suppliers making parts for it. Sure the PC vehicle crashes randomly while turning left on a Tuesday but a complete turn off on the ignitoin and restart and away you go again :) Apples only choise in computer survival is to unwrap their fist from the throat of the software and let people make more programs. The compromise then is that Apple would be in the same boat as IBM with virus/spyware issues. Apple in giving a free download to run PC software is like a communist Captain finally alowing the passangers of his captive ship access to the life boats.

Please, no one take any offence in my choise over Apple. Hell, I can't really even defend the PC line but in my mind there is only one way to go. You must ask youself the question. If your 18 year old child was to embark into the world and they were only allowed to start on one computer system to help them through life, would you pick MAC or PC? That is a personal answer and only you have to justify your answer.

The world is full of compromises, make your choise.

[johnny1488 1]

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If your 18 year old child was to embark into the world and they were only allowed to start on one computer system to help them through life, would you pick MAC or PC?

Well im not 18, Im 26, but I choose MAC. I would recommend anyone else to get a MAC also. They see the things I have been able to do with my MAC, knowing full well I am the farthest thing from a computer person, and they want that for themselves.

Even if there were no PC emulators, let alone bootable systems, It would be a no brainer for me. I will never own a windows machine again.

Johnny
--"This ain't no book club, we're all gonna die!"
Mike Rome

[goobersnuftda 0]

I feel your pain, I really do :)

If I controlled the world, I would still be using IBM's OS/2 operating system. The first true 32 bit, multi-tasking OS that blew the doors off windoze 98, 98a,98b,98c,SE. Came completely internet ready unlike windows did at the time.

Stable as all hell and when a program through bad coding self destructed, simply close down that specific window and it was gone. Never took down the O/S and didn't destroy the whole sand box it was playing in. Wonderful O/S and I did some fantastic multi tasking on a P1-586 system.

I realise though that the majority rules in the world. The only true vote is $$$ and in time, the true winner will claim victory. Good luck to all.

[MB38 0]

Lots of PC fanboys in here. What I've learned from years of experience - including almost two years working for Apple - is it's not worth trying to convince a fanboy. While the anti-Mac arguments in here are more balanced than the usual internet banter, they are nonetheless peppered with a very solid amount of misinformation and should not be taken as the truth. Opinions I'm fine with, but incorrect statements are lies. Everybody makes their decision and that's cool by me.

And it's Mac, not MAC.

I really don't know what I'm talking about.

[murrays 0]

I was in Seattle from April 6-11th and managed to get out to one of the Apple stores while I was there. Goob.....you know you want one....you'll still be able to run Windows on it using Bootcamp or Parallels. Actually, if you use Parallels (which apparently uses Intel's virtualization technology) you might even be able to install OS2...now wouldn't that be cool! OS X, OS2, Windows, Linux...all on the same box.

The last photo is of a Powermac with a 30" Cinema Display. I played with Aperture for a while on it..my god it was absolutely fantastic to have that much screen real estate. If I could afford and justify the cost I'd have one in a heartbeat. It would be wonderful to edit video/build dvds, etc on such a large high quality screen. Unfortunately, the photo doesn't have anything to give a sense of scale....but Wow! is the best description.

--
Murray

"No tyranny is so irksome as petty tyranny: the officious demands of policemen, government clerks, and electromechanical gadgets." - Edward Abbey