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harro

42 points made in a jump

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Truth.

Here's the report that was issued by the FAI.

Quote


FAI has received the following Class G (Parachuting) record claim :
================================================
Claim number 7405 :
Sub-class G-2 (Group jumps)
Competition / Team records
General Category
Type of record : G-2-C : Formation Skydiving, longest sequence (4-Way)
Course/location : Coupe de France de Vol Relatif 2002 (Pujaut, France)
Performance : 42 formations
Team : France Maubeuge NPC (France)
Parachutists : David MOY, Erwan POULIQUEN, Marin FERRE, Julien LOSANTOS,
Laurent PECHBERTY
Date : 07.07.2002
Current record : 39 formations (23.09.99 - Arizona Airspeed Team, USA)
====================================================
The details shown above are provisional. When all the evidence required has
been received and checked, the exact figures will be established and the
record ratified (if appropriate).


quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

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The night before I saw that I was talking to my instructor about the 4-way teams and he was telling me that he liked the french better than the US team cause they have more style than the airspeed team (i think thats what he told me).

HISPA 21
www.panamafreefall.com

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Hi drenaline
Please ask your instructor what does he mean by "having more style" in a Formation Skydiving event (Style is the name for a different parachuting event...)?
Is it because they "dress better", or because of their "hair cuts"?
You can have a "LOT of Style" and be as terrible as the worst Formation Skydiver...
In 4-way FS Competition Teams, the goal is to achieve the maximum points in 35", regardless you have "style" or not. What you need in 4-Way is "effectiveness"!
And if you look well at the videos, "that style" your instructor has mentioned comes from the way all those world-class top teams deal with the paramount cycle in FS: "Move-Stop-Grip"!
Nobody knows if Airspeed Vertical, DeLand Majik, Golden Knights Gold ot others could do better than the French (those 42 points in tiem for the B-F-L-A-N). Probably they would... probably they wouldn't... it's just speculation (I'm sure these teams already did that draw and themselves know how to compare, but that is a kind of secret stuff).
The French were lucky and good enough to have such draw and do those AWESOME 42 points, and so far they will be the new WR holders for a while!
If you look carefully at the meets results where they did the 42, you'll find that at the end of seven rounds their average was "only" of 20, while GK, AS or Majik are having (for different and not easier draws) something between 22 and 23 (recently AS did 23 on a 10 round set - 22/23 Jun NSL Draw).
The only way to know if French are better will be when all those top teams meet in competition, in the very same conditions, hopefully at the next Worl Cup in Ampuriabrava (Spain).
Regarding Remster opinion that "... always enjoyed watching the French teams more the the Americain ones (GK and AS) .... their moves look much smoother..." it's just your opinion... actually they might being more effective scoring more, but smoothness is something you lose when you go faster... and we talk about skydives with 22-23 (may be 25 in a near future) averages, smothness will probably be the factor most affected... but you'll have always the cycle "Move-Stop-Grip". What top teams are doing and working on is to spend the less time they can in the stop, but definitely they'll always stop! If you see AS from the FSL Shamrock Showdown in mid-March to their last competition mid-June, you'll find that. They are still skydiving with cleaness, but faster on transitions, spending less time in the formations, so less time in the stops, but stopping.
By the way, I prefer the american school of FS than the French one: first by their philosophy ("open book" - they show what they do, they don't hide everything as the french: just hide "secret stuff"); second because you can take them as a reference and work on continuity plans adjusted to your team (from the french you can not do it, because they don't show it); Third: they are much more available to coach than the french (skills camps, tunnel or simply by e-mail)... you may call it business, but that's the main reason Formation Skydiving is US is now as it it is: with a lot of Teams doing good skydiving, with good averages and, most important, with good team foundations, because they've learned it from those experienced teams who shared their experiences.
In US there are already a lot of teams really competing with the best... in France, Maubeuge don't have rivals... this must be for somereason.
And to finalize: don't tell me that you don't find nice, beautifull and smooth the way Airspeed Vertical skydive on their videos (Best of Airspeed and others from the latest competitions)?
Blue Skies! ;)
-----------------------------
Mario Santos
Portugal

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Hi Santos,

First of all drink a glass of cold water and relax.

I have trouble with my english (almost everybody knows that by now), What I meant was what Remster said, smoother.

Like you said we all have different opinions and we prefer the french than the US, please have some respect for that. Thanx.

HISPA 21
www.panamafreefall.com

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Hi Drenaline!

You don't need to be so "dry" on your words... that will just stress yourself and is completely consuming your "fair-play"...

There's no need for cold water (I'm cool enough...) and I'm relaxed! B|

You took me wrong... :S

I did not offend to you or to anybody else! [:/]

No worries about your english... I wasn't aware of that... any way, mine isn't that good either! :$

Quote

Like you said we all have different opinions and we prefer the french than the US, please have some respect for that.



After all, your english is not that bad... I didn't say "we all have different opinions", but you've got it between the lines and that's correct! I really wanted to pass that message!

What I did was to detail a little bit (usually I like to explain my reasons... I do it a lot... just have a look at my other posts, on different subjects) my post on this subject... and to give my humble opinion (and remarks) on both the French and the US top world skydiving teams!

Instead of reacting as you did (telling me to cool down), you could have read my post twice... or thrice... until its end... and you would have found it differently than you found it after your first reading!

Don't consider this as an advice... I'm just sharing a thought: when we read a message more than once, we find it differently every new time we read it...

I didn't show any disrespect by yours or others opinions (didn't even contested it or used some kind of rude language as the one we see sometimes in these forums)... I've just presented another point of view... and compared French with the US on that matter...

But you have been rude on your reply: the attitudes are kept with those who take them, not with those they are addressed to!

If you notice well, I didn't even say that US top teams are better than the French: I've just said they have a different philosophy and those reasons (if you read them well) I presented to justify my opinion, are not subjective... actually, they are facts uncontestable!

What I have said is that, on formation skydiving matters, I prefer the American school than the French one.

Please remember Sangiro rules in the forum: avoid rudeness, spend some time before you storm in, be nice and think before you post (this last one I practice a lot: usually when I post is my 3rd or 4th version...).

I've just expressed my opinion on a reply to a post where you've shown yours... didn't contested it! I wouldn't tell you to respect my opinion, but at least, accept it! ;)

But I don't compel you to accept it, although you should! Accepting a different opinion, doesn't mean to agree with it: just means to accept it, as I did to yours. By doing that, quite often we find ourselves listening to each other in a way that we can build or start building our own opinion with more solid arguments than those we would have if we just listen to ourselves!

I have even addressed you a question... but you didn't reply (probably you didn't read my post until the end)...

I remember that question: "... don't tell me that you don't find nice, beautiful and smooth the way Airspeed Vertical skydive on their videos...?

By the way: are there any videos of the French team, that we can buy to also learn from them? I ask this, because I don't know any!

No hard feelings! >:(

Blue Skies!
-----------------------------
Mario Santos
Portugal

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are there any videos of the French team, that we can buy to also learn from them?


I really dunno, ask that in the talkback forum to see what you get.

About the other stuff, I just sent you a PM with some explaining and an apology. Don't want to keep it in the forum cause might give an excuse to somebody to feed our miscommunication and will break one of HH's rules, and yep I know tha rules, I have 400+ posts and none of the posts I have made have been deleted so far (knock on wood).

Hope we can leave all this behind. :)

HISPA 21
www.panamafreefall.com

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Style is looking good and accuracy is getting on the correct aircraft, right? :)

So your instructor likes Maubeuge because they have more 'style.' I personally like Airspeed and Majik better because they have prettier colored canopies....which obviously make them better canopy pilots. :)

Dude, Maubeuge rocks and that 42 is outstanding! Congrats to the Frenchies on that accomplishment. But keep in mind too, that a fast round is dependent upon a fast draw. The REAL comparision would be to have Majik, Vertical, Maubeuge, GK Gold, XL, and the Norgies do the same round. :) That would be the jump of the century. :) Watch out at Nationals. :)

arlo:ph34r:
============
The night before I saw that I was talking to my instructor about the 4-way teams and he was telling me that he liked the french better than the US team cause they have more style than the airspeed team (i think thats what he told me). ============

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Hi Arlo,

Nice humorous posting! B|

I wasn't able yet to find the draw for that competition where "Perris Maubeuge NPC" did the 42 points jumps, the new WR after FAI approval, but I 've noticed that on every round of that competition, except for round 4, "Perris Maubeuge NPC" has had the highest scores... on round 4, they have scored a 12 (don't know the reasons... may be some busts, brainlock, glitch, who knows?), far behind from "Maubeuge Lapalisse Est" scoring a 16 and from "Maubeuge Lapalisse Ouest" scoring a 15 (see http://www.ffp.asso.fr/competitions/02PUJAUTVR.htm).

I agree with your opinion "that a fast round is dependent upon a fast draw. The REAL comparision would be to have Majik, Vertical, Maubeuge, GK Gold, XL, and the Norgies do the same round". Although they scored an AWESOME 42, on the entire competition they still have shown some lack of consistence... posting a 12, no matter for which reason, isn't definitelly common on a world-class top team!

My main critic to the French Team is that they just show-up making something public when they perform better the same thing others performed in the past in different conditions, or in this case where they performed a WR.

This might be a good strategy for them (hiding themselves from outside evaluation), but is a completely different approach from the one used by the US top teams, who have been contributing with their share of expertise to make FS improve in 2-3 years more than it did in 10 years (notice that averages being posted now for a 10 round competition, are becoming consistently between 22 and 23).

At the end of this month, AS Vertical, Perris Maubeuge and most likely Majik (I'm not sure about them), will beat against each other at Russia on a Shamrock meeting... and most likely, we'll have a real test at the next World Cup at Ampuriabrava (Spain)... then we will see if the French will prove that they are really the best of the World, as they have been trying to show with their "marketing campaign"!

Blue Skies! ;)

P.S. - Btw, I liked that conclusion about having prettier colored canopies, making them better canopy pilots...
-----------------------------
Mario Santos
Portugal

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Mario-

I believe the draw was B-F-L-A-N...not sure, but I think that's right.

As far as Russia goes, Majik is indeed going, but I don't think the French are because of conflict between that meet and their Nationals. Still will be a great meet. :)

blues,
arlo:ph34r:

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So your instructor likes Maubeuge because they have more 'style.' I personally like Airspeed and Majik better because they have prettier colored canopies....which obviously make them better canopy pilots


Not quite, colors don't have to do about canopy skills, maybe if you post the canopy colors in the canopy controll and swoop forum you will get more answers about it, mm... maybe I could be wrong and colors can make you a better pilot, but don't really think so.:)

Remember to read all the posts, you must of missed the post where I said smooth.B|

HISPA 21
www.panamafreefall.com

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Kurt at the NSL has the video of the 42 point jump, he watched it and said there was a bust in there the judges missed, but he had to watch it in slow motion to see it, so easily missed. He expects to post it today or tomorrow. probably tuesday because he looked pretty tired when I saw him in the airport last night :)www.skyleague.com

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Kurt at the NSL has the video of the 42 point jump, he watched it and said there was a bust in there the judges missed, but he had to watch it in slow motion to see it, so easily missed. He expects to post it today or tomorrow. probably tuesday because he looked pretty tired when I saw him in the airport last night :)www.skyleague.com


Hi,
Just to let the forum know that FAI has ratified the following Class G (Parachuting) record:
====================================================================
Claim number 7405:
Sub-class G-2 (Group jumps)
Competition / Team records
General Category
Type of record : G-2-C : Formation Skydiving, longest sequence (4-Way)
Course/location : Coupe de France de Vol Relatif 2002 (Pujaut, France)
Performance : 42 formations
Team : France Maubeuge NPC (France)
Parachutists : Davide MOY, Erwan POULIQUEN, Marin FERRE, Julien LOSANTOS, Laurent PECHBERTY
Date: 07.07.2002
Previous record : 39 formations (23.09.99 - Arizona Airspeed Team, USA)
====================================================================
This is the B-F-L-A-N (Stairstep Diamond-Open Accordian-Adder-Unipod-Crank) jump (Round 8 of the mentioned competition), done from a Pilatus Porter.
Blue Skies! ;)
-----------------------------
Mario Santos
Portugal

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