0
riggerrob

Stand up to lose altitude?

Recommended Posts

If your looking to save money on the camera, look online at [url] www.etronics.com [url]
I bought a sony pc-9 that retails most places for $1200 for $999 at etronics. I never charge my students for the video, I do it as a courtesy, even dubbing it onto a tape if they have one, I always say "no money, it;s on me", and they inevitably end up offering to cover a pack job or two which I can't seem to turn down for some reason........LOL pant legs inflating? Duh, where were you when we went over "The poor man's skydiving plan?" Sit flying is in shorts and someone ELSE'S long sleeve t-shirt. (someone else's cause when you do enough jumps with it, the seems tear under the armpits and you don't want to f--k up your own clothes......LOL). Poor man head down is an old pair of jeans and a wife beater, er, um "tank top"......LOL I took the plunge and finally ponied up the dough for a decent jump suit, glad i did. I was working in Hawaii last year so I stopped by Da Kine Rags shop and Chuck hooked me up huge with a custom flame design. I fly the same with it, no better, no worse, just better fall rate control.
"I live to EFS"
Tom

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
If you sit fly with ski pants, it'll take you three days to get down to the ground! The visual is too much.........
we had a DZ "70's party this past fall and I was shopping in a second hand thrift store and I found this Leopard print pimp suit. Fake alligator fabric, baggy pants and a matching shirt. It made a great pimp outfit, and Its great for free flying. so i wear it on the DZ to jump in sometimes. The tandem students get a kick out of it. The whole suit cost 20 dollars.
"I live to EFS"
Tom

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I must agree with Paula and tigra on this one. Big way RW organizers will axe you in a heartbeat if you are standing or sitting on the way to a formation - the only jumpers who can get away with that kind of thing are highly experience freefliers who have let the organizer and the rest of the group know they plan to do so prior to the dive.
There's waaaay to much going on in a large dive for anyone to veer from the established dive plan. If you can't get to the formation using basic belly flying skills (like diving, dropping down by getting small as was explained in a previous post, etc) then you really have no business being on a large RW dive.
pull and flare,
lisa
--
What would Scooby Doo?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Jay-Z ain't the only one big pimpin' these days!! LOL
As for being a vidiot, everyone has a different jump number for starting to jump with a camera. I say, just like anything else, if you feel your ready, your ready. You'll know when the time comes. From your 4 billion other posts on here......it seems like you have your head on straight and have the right attitude, so I'm sure yo'll do fine, whenever you decide to jump a camera. Just make sure (especially if it's a make shift set up) that you have a single point release system, so if things go bad, you only have one extar release to deal with, instead of fumbling for a button attachment on each side as an example. And of course practice, practice, practice your new emergency procedures with the helmet. (I only say that last part becuase I knew a jumper that went in last year due to a camera helment/suspension line entanglement. He had a football style chin cup with two buttons on each side. That's not to say a two button system won't work, but hey, the quikcer it comes off the more time you have to deal with the mal, right?
It's a distant picture, but you can kind of see the bonehead camera set up i jump.
"I live to EFS"
Tom

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
"highly experience freefliers"
Exactly....LOL. Don't I fall in that category...j/k
I don't have any fear of jumping a camera. No big deal really...as you said just have a plan for mals. Besides..I'll be starting with just a side mount PC-5 in a box so that keeps it pretty safe and simple. I heard of someone recently picking up a PC5 on sale at Best buy for $800 and some dollars. I need to go by and Check the Service Merchandise going out of business sale. I do need to work on that camera step exit. The last one was pretty funny.......
"I only have 125 jumps, so I don't know shit..right?"-Clay

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Clay will you be paying your own slot on these *coaching* dives? I think in this case jump numbers DO count and I don't think somebody with 125 jumps should be coaching. Personally if I was going to get RW coaching I would get it from an established RW skydiver, same with freeflying - at this stage I don't think you are either. Nothing personal and I am sure you are a very good skydiver (for 125 jumps), but I don't think ANYBODY with that few jumps should be coaching.
I don't think someone with 125 jumps should be wearing camera either, but like you said that is a whole different thread.
Will
"Don't die until you're dead"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
"Clay will you be paying your own slot on these *coaching* dives?"
Probably not.....I have been really wreslting with this question. The DZO's seem to think that slot+pack job is plenty fair. I don't like using packers so I will gladly pack my own. But...the course is not cheap and you do get evaluated on your dives. There is some oversight by the course director. If you don't have the skills you don't pass. Period.
As for experience.....Yeah I am a little light. But I am damn good for the amount of jumps I have.(OK Stop laughing) Remember...Chuck taught me..LOL Plus....we're talkin about students here, fresh off AFF. They don't know smack and I'm only doing a few jumps with them. I think, teaching from a curriculum, I can do them a great service. Make them better safer skydivers. Teach them the things they need to survive beyond the "Pull your string" they got in AFF. If a guy with 150 jumps can be picked up for the USAPT I think I can jump with students. Whether they should pay my slot...I don't know......:(
"I only have 125 jumps, so I don't know shit..right?"-Clay

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
OK.. reality check....
Video is great. But it should not be the basis of coaching.
At this level, we're talking about the equivalent of the Coach 1 rating in CSPA.
The most important thing you must learn how to do as a Coach 1, IMHO much more important then specific flying thechniques, is observation. Observation techniques, while in flight, are crutial to see and understand what is going on with your "coachee". Relying on a camera is lazyness. Having a camera as a back up or addition is a nice to have, but should not be a requirement. Remember, the coachee is speding his jump ticket to get coached, no videoed.
I would actually STRONGLY recomment against jumping with a camera on Coach 1 jumps unless you are a very experienced jumper and camera flyier. Remember: you will be in the air in close proximity (you dont dock on Coach 1 ratings) to a very green jumper. Adding the complexity of a camera in there makes the jumps more dangerous for you AND the coachee.
I dont know what USPA has as far as theoritical courses as part as their coaching syllabus. CSPA requires you to do a 2 day theory course with the National Coaching Asscociation for C1, and then the C2 level is another 2 days.
Remster
Muff 914

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
RE: "OK...reality check...."
My decision to fly coach jumps with video was based on one single criteria. "Will it benefit the student if I get video?" The answer is yes, so I do it. I do it for free, I don't ask for any money, and I A) Checked with the DZ Safety Advisor to ask their advise and they approved it. and B) I asked the other paid videographers if they minded me doing it because in essence I could have been taking money away from them by offering to do a video for free. They too said it was totally okay. With that said, I only have 420 jumps, I'm not a skygod, but I am a damn solid coach, I fly my ass off and can stay with light jumpers as well as heavy jumpers. I'm also a videoflyer. Now as for your "the video should not be the basis for coaching" comment.......Your right is shouldn't be the "basis" andit's not, it's a "compliment" to the coaching. I can debrief a student all I want, telling him his right leg is pitched outward causing a minor spin, but then to actually be able to sit him or her down and show them the specific body posture in the air, it's an invaluable training tool. I understand your concern and your comments, but I definitely disagree with your post. As for what a coach can or can't do, according to USPA, the coach may not touch the parachute container at any point during the skydive, but allowing teh student to dock on you or you docking on them is definitely allowed. It may be different for you in Canada, not being able to dock, but that's not the case here. And another thing at what point did I ever say that I "relied on my camera" for my coaching. You've never jumped with me, so don't comment on my coaching, calling me lazy because I use video as an added tool is just plain ignorant. Nor did I ever mention it being a requirement. And yes, the coachee is spending the money for the jump ticket, so in my mind they should get the best coaching possible for their money, and if video can add a benefit for them, which in most cases it does, then they are getting more for their money. So, while you "STRONGLY recommend against jumping with a camera", I STRONGLY recommend each jumper make an individual informed decision instead of making a generalized statement based on limited information. As for me, I evaluate each student on the ground before we jump to decide whether or not to bring video. If I feel the student will fixate on the video and not focus on the dive, then I won't bring it. If it's a questionable case, I simply ask the student saying "Look, a video might help you understand your debrief, but I'm concerned you might focus to much on the video and not the dive. Can you still concentrate on the dive if I film it?" If they say yes, I'll bring it, if they question it or say no, I'll leave it on the ground. Enough said.
"I live to EFS"
Tom

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Yikes Tom!!! What the heck made you think I was replying to you!!!!!
I was replying to a certain 125 jump wonder (hi Clay!) who is already thinking of straping a camera for his coaching jumps....
But I guess I must have struck a nerve or something! lol
I'll stick by my post: learn to coaching/observing without a camera. Once you can brief, jump, observe all that there is to observe, REMEMBER it, and debrief without one, then strap it on.
Wrt the USPA / CSPA difference: if a Coach 1 equivalent in the states can dock on a student, then even more reason to wait till you are shit-hot before straping on a camera. Maybe you are shit hot Tom, I never said you're not (as you pointed out, I dont know you.... I dont know Clay either, but I'm willing to stick my neck on the chopping board and state that he probably isnt shit hot yet... no offence Clay)
Remster
Muff 914

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Remi....I see your concern but lets remember something. I'm not talking about some huge, crazy I Max set up on my head. I'm talking about a PC-5 in a Dbox. No ring sites no other obstructions. It's really a pretty minimal amount of distraction. The benefit it gives to the student is well worth the minimal extra effort. Just my .02C
"I only have 125 jumps, so I don't know shit..right?"-Clay

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Not to beat a dead horse but I think there is a huge difference between "Flying Camera" and doing a skydive with a PC5 on the side of your helmet. I know it's a whole new skill set to film 4 way or do a proper tandem video. I'll just be doing the former for now....:)"I only have 125 jumps, so I don't know shit..right?"-Clay

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Oh, and I almost forgot.....
I am a shot hot skydiver!! Yahoo!!! And modest too!!!!!!
In all seriosness though Remster, I get what your saying, and afetr rereading yoru post,I see it wasn't aimed at me. For the record though, I did a lot of coach jumps without video at first, so I know what I'm doing, and everyone, including my AFF level jumpmasters would tell you, I have an unusual knack for in flight recall during debriefs. From altitude of movement execution, to whether or not their shoe laces are single knotted or double knotted, I have a photographic memory when it comes to stuff like that on skydives. I freaked out my AFF Level 1 JM when I debrief the jump with her and said to her (after my first jump ever mind you......) "At 6400ft you winked at me with your left eye, twice." It's just a gift I have. LOL!!!
"I live to EFS"
Tom

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Well I WILL beat this dead horse :
Clay, I am not flaming you or attacking you, but THERE IS NO WAY IN HELL THAT SOMEONE WITH 125 JUMPS SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO COACH LOW(ER) TIME JUMPERS!!!
There is no substitute for experience. I don't care how good you think you are - somebody with say 400 jumps has a lot more experience than you at jumping out of a plane and saving their ass. Also, you do mostly freeflying and yet now with 125 jumps you think you can coach RW??? And you want to strap a camera to your head as well?
If you really want to help low timers then why don't you just do fun jumps with them (paying your own slot)??? Jesus, am I the only person who gets really concerned that people with 125 jumps want to/ are allowed to coach newbies fresh off AFF?
For both your safety and that of the coachees I would suggest you wait until you are a bit more experienced.
Like I said, I'm not flaming you, I respect that you want to help newbies, but you becoming a coach now is not a good idea.
Will
"Don't die until you're dead"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Skreamer,
I hate to do this, but I have to disagree with you.
I'll talk about the CSPA coaching program, coz its the one I know.
C1 is specifically a rating based on providing basic coaching. In theory, all you need is 50 jumps (as I remember), but most peple take it at 100-200 or so jumps. Its the 1st step in a coaching progression: you need C1 to take the Instructor A rating or C2 rating, and then on the PFF. Things a C1 migh do include observing a 10 sec delay progression student, or do a no-contacts drill dive with a self supervised student. They have a real important role in a club.
The C2 rating is the "heavy duty" one Minimum req is 300 jumps, but most take the rating in the 300-500 range. You need to fly well for this one.
I dont know how it translate into USPA (I can only imagine they copied part of the CSPA program and got rid of some good parts.. ;))
Remster
Muff 914

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
"THERE IS NO WAY IN HELL THAT SOMEONE WITH 125 JUMPS SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO COACH LOW(ER) TIME JUMPERS!!!"
Well....all I can say is, that is something you can complain to the USPA about. For many years we have had S/L JM's that put students out for both S/L and their free fall delays. You only needed 100 jumps and some additional training to get a S/L JM ticket. The coaches aren't doing any more or less.
As far as my RW skills. True. I haven't flow much RW in the past 75 jumps but last time I did a straight belly dive back in Nov I did just fine. 8 way I believe launched out of a Casa. We turned several points and I had one of the harder slots cause I had to fly to the middle into side bodies. I did fine......Aviatrr might even have it on video. I know Mouth, Aviatrr, Skymama, and I think Watcher was on that dive. We just move things a little faster here in the States....good or bad...*shrug*
"I only have 125 jumps, so I don't know shit..right?"-Clay

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
No Will, what I'm saying is:
Quote


you said
Clay, I am not flaming you or attacking you, but THERE IS NO WAY IN HELL THAT SOMEONE WITH 125 JUMPS SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO COACH LOW(ER) TIME JUMPERS!!!

What I'm saying is there is a way in hell for someone with 125 to coach lower time jumper... I never said anything about cameras and Freefly and RW.....
Remster
Muff 914

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

0