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danielcroft

Fluid Wings Helix 79 / VK79 / Hybrid Leia 79

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Helix 79 RDS slider / VK79 RDS slider / Hybrid Leia (HL) 79 RDS slider - 2.2:1

TL:DR
The openings on the Helix are significantly slower than either the VK or HL so, for people who want slower opening in this level of wing (with a removable slider) the Helix definitely is a good option. For me, the VK and HL are about the same in this regard.
Flight characteristics of the Helix: it feels smaller than the VK79 and HL79 and is very responsive to harness and riser input. Rear riser barrel rolls work! Yes!
Landings (I'm doing 270ºs at a field elevation of ~1300ft - Skydive Elsinore): To me, the Helix feels pretty similar to the HL in terms of having super power rear risers but has a shorter recovery arc than either the VK or HL. The VK still shuts down better than either the HL or Helix - YMMV.
RDS slider attachment is awkward and takes more time than either VK or HL.

The openings, for me, are a little slow and have a tendency to go off heading. I'm in the habit of packing slow because I jump RDS slider PD canopies (yep, not recommended) but the Helix opens slow enough that I need to pack faster openings.

I'll update at some point and I still have the demo Helix for a bit longer and need to test out the faster opening pack jobs.

Happy to answer questions if peeps have them, remember though that I'm no CP guy so I'm not pushing for tenths or meters, just smooth, consistent stand up landings.

https://vimeo.com/album/3515955

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Thanks for the insight. I've got a Helix 79 demo coming in two weeks and am really looking forward to playing with it. I got to make a few jumps on one of the prototype 90s after FLCPA Comp 3 and it was a blast.

I prefer the Fluidwings RDS. I've got a stock VE90 with one of Scott's removable sliders so that may be why. Feels like less of a PITA trying to pull it off the rings.

I hear you on the Comp openings with an RDS. Man they take delicate packing. Can't say they don't open quickly though.

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It's clean coming off the rings for sure and it's not prone to the VK's slider hang ups which is good but I'd say the Fluid Wings slider takes me twice as long to attach than my VK slider.

I've learnt to pack nice, slow openings to make up for the RDS slidered VC (that's why PD doesn't recommend it, I'd say) and have dialed that back a little for the VK (and, as it turns out, the Leia as well).

Like I said, I'm not a fan of high performance wings opening that slow but, it's certainly really fun to fly once it's open. The guys at Fluid did a great job.

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Well, I've sent the Helix back to Fluid Wings.

Once I adjusted the way I was packing to promote a faster opening, the wing opened very nicely and was quite controllable. In flight, it's a lot of fun and very responsive, certainly on the same level as the VK and Leia. I'd say it lands more like the Leia but with a shorter recovery arc. The shorter recovery arc requires more precision that I'm not super good at providing the wing. Rears feel strong when you get it right, although it doesn't shut down as well as the VK for me.

I'd say the Leia and VK are more similar than the Helix and VK in terms of the way they fly so, if you've been considering a wing in this category and feel that the Leia suits you better, you'd be doing yourself a huge disservice in NOT demoing the Helix. I love flying different wings so, I'd say the same even if you preferred the VK to the Leia but, you know, you're all grown ass people. :D

For me, keeping in mind the limited experience I have on the Leia and Helix, I'd probably have to say I'd take a Leia over the Helix because I seemed to gel with it a little easier but I don't feel like the Helix is worse by any means and, people sensitive to faster openings should put the Helix at the top of their list, IMO. If I factor in the wait times on the Leia, I'd *actually* order a Helix. YMMV.

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TL:DR The Helix is shorter for sure.

To me (again, I'm not a CP guy, I'm a fun jumper who swoops... poorly :)), the Helix feels similar at the start of the recovery arc and then often surprises me at how quickly it recovers in the bottom end. I attribute this to inexperience with the wing, firstly but also with it being a faster recovery arc than either the VK or Leia. Both of those wings felt relatively familiar to my VC84 (when considering the downsize/loading) whereas the Helix feels quite different. I have done about 10 jumps on a VC79 which is really only enough to know what it tastes like but added to the 250 or so I have on the VC84, I feel like I was getting an accurate flavor.

I'd love to see what you think about it once you've had a chance to jump it. Most of the people I know who've jumped it rave about the openings (I'd agree, with the qualification that it requires non-OCD pack jobs or a better pilot than me) and enjoy the way it flies. I have a friend who has heaps more jumps than me who put a few on the Helix. He normally jumps a VE75 (might be a VC, I don't remember) and his impressions and mine were on par except that he loved the openings from the get go but he trash packs (in his words). Given that he and I are among the very few who've jumped all three, I'm really interested to see what other people think and how they compare these wings.

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I've heard people saying that VK has actually shorter recovery arc than VC, but when they got some experience on VK then they said the exact opposite. It just needed a tweak or two in their technique.

Just wondering, maybe Helix also needs some tricks to lenghten the recovery arc?

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skow

I've heard people saying that VK has actually shorter recovery arc than VC, but when they got some experience on VK then they said the exact opposite.


+1 for me on that. When I first got the VK, figuring out how to slow the rotation to keep it from starting to recover before I wanted it to made it feel like a shorter recovery. The VE seemed to be more simple to "tune" the dive by adjusting the rotation rate compared to the VK. I've since figured it out. Now I turn same sized VK and VE at the same altitude.

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What you said jives with the two demo jumps I did on the Helix 90. I started my 270 at the same altitude as I did on my VC84 but managed to come out high twice. I attributed it to the canopy being more receptive to the roll input of the harness and therefore me fighting to slow down the turn, but I'll definitely pay more attention when I get it.

I'll definitely chime in once I've gotten it. I'm hoping to put at least 10-15 jumps on it, if not more depending on how long they let me keep it. The ability to "trash pack" would be nice. I've gotten used to having to treat my VC84 like it's a live bomb while packing it for terminal. It was a relief last weekend when I put my stock 90 on and got "normal" openings.

That said, I won't be able to compare it to the other two as I haven't jumped either of them. I spent the first part of the year working on the 84 and the time since CP Nats to work on the 450 (stupid bump up to open class). Not enough time in the day and not enough money in the bank unfortunately.

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skow

Just wondering, maybe Helix also needs some tricks to lenghten the recovery arc?


Very likely, hence why I'm always saying I'm no expert. If my dive angle was closer to 90º on the final whip, I'd probably find the recovery a little more in line with the VK but I think the over all point is, for me, I found the Helix harder to be consistently mediocre on. :D

Zlew

+1 for me on that. When I first got the VK, figuring out how to slow the rotation to keep it from starting to recover before I wanted it to made it feel like a shorter recovery. The VE seemed to be more simple to "tune" the dive by adjusting the rotation rate compared to the VK. I've since figured it out. Now I turn same sized VK and VE at the same altitude.


And for me, I always turned the VK at the same altitude as the VC, just assumed I was getting it wrong when it didn't work as well. ;)

hokierower

What you said jives with the two demo jumps I did on the Helix 90. I started my 270 at the same altitude as I did on my VC84 but managed to come out high twice. I attributed it to the canopy being more receptive to the roll input of the harness and therefore me fighting to slow down the turn, but I'll definitely pay more attention when I get it.


I didn't think that the roll rate was the issue for me, but it depends on how you're doing your turn, right? I feel like the roll rate increase from these wings will not only bring you around faster but also increase your dive angle, no? I guess if you're maximizing your dive angle then it's not as much of a change but I know I'm not thanks to the flysight.

hokierower

I've gotten used to having to treat my VC84 like it's a live bomb while packing it for terminal.


HA HA HA, so true. I'd suggest avoiding that with the Helix but, you're a grown ass man...

I'm really stoked to have the chance to jump all these wings in the same sizes to see what they're like and I think my experience is useful for people who aren't CP focussed but much less so for people who are. It comes down the the Helix openings and required precision and, the Leia's lack of stopping power. I can say confidently that the VK is a better wing for me and why but that may not be true for others.

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Quote

I didn't think that the roll rate was the issue for me, but it depends on how you're doing your turn, right? I feel like the roll rate increase from these wings will not only bring you around faster but also increase your dive angle, no? I guess if you're maximizing your dive angle then it's not as much of a change but I know I'm not thanks to the flysight.



Absolutely! On my 270 I had a slow "roll-in" transition to start my turn off. If you do it to fast, you get vertical too soon, and the canopy would start to recover since you don't have the rotation to keep it in a dive. You'd then plane out higher since the turn was quick and didn't burn off the altitude that the slower turn would.

Quote

HA HA HA, so true. I'd suggest avoiding that with the Helix but, you're a grown ass man...

I'm really stoked to have the chance to jump all these wings in the same sizes to see what they're like and I think my experience is useful for people who aren't CP focussed but much less so for people who are. It comes down the the Helix openings and required precision and, the Leia's lack of stopping power. I can say confidently that the VK is a better wing for me and why but that may not be true for others.



Got the email from Helix today! 79 is shipping tomorrow so I'll have all this weekend to play with it...almost tempted to try it at the NECPL comp but I need to make up for a dismal Comp 2 performance.

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My issue (beyond going too fast in the top end, which is true for whichever wing I fly... lol), was more that, once I finish the whip around at the end, the recovery from that was relatively a lot faster than VK or Leia for me.

If you jump the Helix, you have the perfect excuse for poor performances: "I haven't dialed this wing in yet"... :D

Let me know if you get the yellow one, the 79 I had was serial number "0009". :D

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