Gate sensor

[ORANGENBLUE 0]

Is any one using gate sensors with a audible alarm to judge verts? If so who makes them? Where did you get it? Did you make it? Is it laser, infrared, etc?

We have had a few close calls with verts this year and if it isn't too expensive it would be nice to have.

[superstu 0]

they're pretty expensive and i guess they need software updating because we didn't even use it for the last PST event. video is still the most reliable from what i've expereinced.

Slip Stream Air Sports
Do not go softly, do not go quietly, never back down

[dragon2 0]

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they're pretty expensive and i guess they need software updating because we didn't even use it for the last PST event. video is still the most reliable from what i've expereinced.

Eh, no way it is?!

If the setup for the sensor system is right (ie, no shaky 15ft long poles to mount it on) it is 200% better than video.

We have a set of sensors that have 2 sensors on each end (for judging people who get their entire body lower than 1.5m, like JC managed), the sensors have a light + sound, both can be switched on/off when needed (usually no horns for training purposes on our DZ, to spare the neighbours) and they trip a computer program so you get instant scoring for speed and also for "water gates" if we use the low sensors over land instead of dragging water.

We have high-speed sensors so even a downwinder by a world champ gets triggered.

No WAY video beats that

In fact, for a lot of events we don't even use "backup" video for entry gates anymore because it was never needed anymore anyway. For the big events (Bussloo) we still have backup video so we can show the jumper the system was right LOL

It's not that hard to make but the sensors themselves are hard to get and somewhat expensive. Hint: our system is for rent

ciel bleu,
Saskia

[AggieDave 6]

Would you mind posting or PM me the manufacture of the sensors you use with a general lay out of how you put them together?

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[dragon2 0]

Ask Henny (Parashoot), he thought it up and put it together.

ciel bleu,
Saskia

[bob.dino 0]

I wonder if that's the system that was brought out to Australia last year? Seemed to work well.

[Vectracide 0]

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Ask Henny (Parashoot), he thought it up and put it together.

Who is this and do you have any more specific contact info for me? PM me if ya like.

Thanks
Brad
NW CPC Organizer

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Controlled and Deliberate.....

[dragon2 0]

Tried a search?
http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=2525462;sb=post_latest_reply;so=ASC;forum_view=forum_view_collapsed;;page=unread#unread

ciel bleu,
Saskia

[shunkka 0]

we had audible sensors (video as well) on the spanish champoinship... they rent the sensors and the software for the competiton from a guy... iºll ask the name and iºll post the details later

-------------------------
"jump, have fun, pull"

[ParaShoot 0]

It was my system that has been used in Emupriabrava, Voss, Picton, Lillo, Bussloo (Teuge), Kolomna (2005) and several other meets.

I'm on the road (actually at the Swoop Comp in Fehrbellin). When I get the time I'll post here some more info about the system.

Henny

** Know what you say but don't say all you know. **

[ORANGENBLUE 0]

Thanks!

[Vectracide 0]

Hey Henny,

Any info on your system? I am really trying to get something put together before our next comp on the 14th.

TTYS,
Brad

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Controlled and Deliberate.....

[ParaShoot 0]

There are several requirements for a swoop sensor system. When I was developing and building (and improving) my system I made a list:

- Fast enough to detect a toe at about 120 km/h. Easy to calculate the detection speed but it’s about one thousand of a second.
- When the beam is crossed an alarm (light and/or sound) is needed for 1 to 3 sec to confirm crossing the gates.
- When the sensor is triggered the signal will be very short. Not enough to switch a relais for an alarm. Therefore the signal needs a pulse lengthening system
- Power preferably 12V to be mobile.
- Width between sensors at least 12 mtr
- Easy to setup, align and adjust
- Steady so it’ll stay in operation even when there’s a lot of wind
- No interference with sunlight in mirror or receiving sensor when light changes during the day
- Because it’s easy to fly under the IPC height of 1½ mtr a second sensor is needed half way
- To measure speed the signals of the sensors of the entry gates and exit gates need to be connected to a measuring system (f.e. Notebook). Interface by serial or USB.
- Software to measure the speed and show it in a reasonable way.

A sensor system is therefore not just a sensor that’s on the market. The measuring systems on the market are all for other purposes. The speed is not the biggest problem but detecting a toe at that speed.

The sensor itself with the above specs is not on the market. I was lucky to find a manufacturer that was willing to build me a special sensor. With this sensor I build a complete system. This is working really well but very expensive. If I want more sensors they are still special made and as a friendly turn but only about one in a few months because they’re made in between a change-over of the production line when they’re running these specific components.

[kamalasound 0]

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The sensor itself with the above specs is not on the market. I was lucky to find a manufacturer that was willing to build me a special sensor. With this sensor I build a complete system. This is working really well but very expensive. If I want more sensors they are still special made and as a friendly turn but only about one in a few months because they’re made in between a change-over of the production line when they’re running these specific components.

I am absolutely not convinced of what you are saying.
The Italian Swoop Tour has purchased and uses a super efficient system that has been tested in all conditions and speeds. I personally used it when testing skies as a downhill competitor and it never has failed once. It has a smal portable computer that registers and prints all sort of data. The sensors can be set at 15 metres but there is also a model that goes up to 30 metres apart. The system btw is wireless.
Check the web site
www.microgate.it
4000$

[dragon2 0]

Looks interesting.

Do you have just the one set of sensors at 1.5m (like the drawings on the website show) or is it possible to have 2 connected sets like we have - first one to break the beam triggers the pc? To judge people coming in below 1.5m?

Wireless is cool.

Any way to hook up stuff like a large screen for instant scoring for spectators to see? A horn so spectators/competitiors/judges can hear a valid gate score?

Can it print out/save a list of all names with scores or is it just a list of scores that needs to be lined up with the names by someone?

ciel bleu,
Saskia

[kamalasound 0]

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Do you have just the one set of sensors at 1.5m (like the drawings on the website show) or is it possible to have 2 connected sets like we have - first one to break the beam triggers the pc? To judge people coming in below 1.5m?
Any way to hook up stuff like a large screen for instant scoring for spectators to see? A horn so spectators/competitiors/judges can hear a valid gate score?
Can it print out/save a list of all names with scores or is it just a list of scores that needs to be lined up with the names by someone?

You can have 2 connected sets if you want.
You can hook up all the stuff you need as well as print and save names.
Our system, the basic one, has one set of sensors but we had them custom set to a very high speed therefore no one has ever gone so fast and low to not have them signal. We have a simple printer therefore we need to line up names and scores but the system has a very sifisticated pc implementation that is expensive though.
This system is used all over the world in speed skiing and has been tested in all conditions. The only real competitors are Alge and Tag Heure but their systems are even more expensive.

[dragon2 0]

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we had them custom set to a very high speed therefore no one has ever gone so fast and low to not have them signal

? Going fast has nothing to do with going low? You really need the low sensors, trust me

ciel bleu,
Saskia

[kamalasound 0]

The sensors are activated when the competitor passes through their immaginary line therefore the faster it goes through the more sensitive they have to be. Same issue regarding the size of the object you are going through with. Risers will activate the sensors because we had the system custom set to our needs speeding the interval between the impulse. An HMA 350 line set might not activate the sensors if led by Jay but I would not want to be as low as that.!!!

[dragon2 0]

Are you sure risers will trigger it? Have you tested that? If so, great
Another issue we had is this: for speed, the competitor can slide the 2nd gate, therefore his feet will be first and he'll trigger the lower sensor. By the time his upper body would have triggered the top sensor some more time has passed.

ciel bleu,
Saskia

[Fast 0]

Quote

Quote

The sensor itself with the above specs is not on the market. I was lucky to find a manufacturer that was willing to build me a special sensor. With this sensor I build a complete system. This is working really well but very expensive. If I want more sensors they are still special made and as a friendly turn but only about one in a few months because they’re made in between a change-over of the production line when they’re running these specific components.

I am absolutely not convinced of what you are saying.
The Italian Swoop Tour has purchased and uses a super efficient system that has been tested in all conditions and speeds. I personally used it when testing skies as a downhill competitor and it never has failed once. It has a smal portable computer that registers and prints all sort of data. The sensors can be set at 15 metres but there is also a model that goes up to 30 metres apart. The system btw is wireless.
Check the web site
www.microgate.it
4000$

Just the photoelectric eye can be something like this I would think. Clicky That sensor per the fact sheet has a 2ms detection time at distances up to 500ft apart. That is two thousands of a second. I know, not quite 1ms, but... who knows.

Allen bradley also makes a sensor that can be up to 10m apart that has a response time of 900µ seconds. Which is just under 1/1000th of a second. You can order it right from thier website too.

All of the other stuff is just a problem of knowing some basic electronics.

~D
Where troubles melt like lemon drops Away above the chimney tops That's where you'll find me.
Swooping is taking one last poke at the bear before escaping it's cave - davelepka

[kamalasound 0]

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Are you sure risers will trigger it? Have you tested that? If so, great
Another issue we had is this: for speed, the competitor can slide the 2nd gate, therefore his feet will be first and he'll trigger the lower sensor. By the time his upper body would have triggered the top sensor some more time has passed.

The risers will trigger it and we have tested it more than once.
Good observation regarding the sliding on speed rounds.!!

[raymod2 1]

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for speed, the competitor can slide the 2nd gate, therefore his feet will be first and he'll trigger the lower sensor. By the time his upper body would have triggered the top sensor some more time has passed.

Electronic gates also render ineffective the technique of sticking your legs out as you pass through the exit gate. But I don't see that as a problem. Just a slight change in the rules.