Nick Batch swoops 665 feet

[CanuckInUSA 0]

I haven't seen anyone mention this here yet, but I recieved an email the other day which told of Nick Batch swooping 665 feet during competition last month in Germany. Here's the content of the email I recieved:

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Nick swoops JVX Hybrid 665ft in competition!

Nick Batch nearly beat the current FAI distance world record flying his new DAEDALUS JVX HYBRID 79 with a huge 665ft swoop during the Distance event of the German swoop competition October 1, 2006 at Skydive Leipzig in Roitzschjora, Germany. The current distance record which is held by Jay M. (Canada) was set at Mile Hi Skydiving at over 5,000ft above sea level. Nick fell just a few feet short of the record swooping his JVX at only 300ft above sea level!

The competition included 5ft gates (1.5m), electronic scoring system and electronic gate buzzers. The competition was a intro to the 2007 GSO (German Swooping Open) that will take place at the same DZ in May. Jim Slaton gave daily seminars at the event and unique instruction on competition swooping to the European pilots. Swoopers came from all over Germany and as far away as Spain to participate in the event.

Dang Nick how did you do? and do it at sea level (or close enough to sea level). I have a long way to go before I can even dream of swooping that far. Kudos for Nick though and I hope to see him (and others) at a swoop comp next season.

Try not to worry about the things you have no control over

[SkymonkeyONE 3]

Weights? It was an overseas meet; did they have weight restrictions?

[mgattini 0]

It has been posted here for a few days, in " best swooping canopy" and also you can hear all about it in Jim's website....

[flyfactory.de 0]

Hi Chuck.
We sure have weight restrictions... overseas... We have the same rules as you guys "overseas" have...
But I don´t know (!) if this specific jump was made in accomodation to the weight restrictions.
Off topic - sorry .... are there any infos when the new z-brace canopy will be out? I´ve seen it already flying with a nice pic in a british skydiving magazine.
BlueS
Patrice

[AggieDave 6]

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are there any infos when the new z-brace canopy will be out? I´ve seen it already flying with a nice pic in a british skydiving magazine.

If you're talking about PD's new offering, there's some pretty good rumors going around about something being released at PIA. It could be something as simple as the new magnetic RDS release, though.



EDIT: after some PMs, let me clarify. The magnetic RDS thing is a joke, the rumor about a new canopy at PIA isn't.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[shadowswoop97 0]

Yes the weight rules were in affect and I was wearing the allowed maximum for my weight which is 35 pounds.

[flyfactory.de 0]

Yes I was taklking about PDs new weapon...
I´m pretty enthousiastic to see this thing. Even though it might be so expensive... hopefully not.
If the canopy will be released at PIA, is it normal that it will be sold in 2007 or could it take another couple years to be on the market?

@ Shadowswoop: Nice job!!! Tobi told me about your swoop and was pretty impressed.

[odendan 0]

To add another question to the mix, what were the winds doing?

whips n' chains n' hand-grenades with a little ugly on the side.

[piisfish 135]

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To add another question to the mix, what were the winds doing?

wiiizzzzzzzz, wiizzzzzz

scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM

[skydiverek 54]

Video here: www.canopypiloting.com/nick665.mov

[marks 0]

like I said on the phone to you, congrats on the bad ass swoop nick. now get out there and do it again.

[proswooper 2]

The wind conditions were almost identical to when Jay made the record at mile high. the only real difference is that nick was at only 300ft above sea level and was flying a 79 JVX. it truly is an impressive feat!!

[cpoxon 0]

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Video here: http://www.canopypiloting.com/nick665.mov

Nick, how high are you getting when you go back up in the first part of the video?

This JVX is sail material? Does that offer any advantage over "normal" ZP? i.e. more lift when popping back up?

Skydiving Fatalities - Cease not to learn 'til thou cease to live

[raymod2 1]

Quoting from Jim Slaton at canopypiloting.com:

"5-8 cross/downwind"

[Spizzzarko 0]

This puzzles me as to why PD may be releasing their z braced canopy. Is the JVX giving them so much comeptition that they feel the need to trump their own excellent canopy? PD is still winning a lot of the comps, and there are more and more velocities out there. I bet I can safely say that there is probably less than 100 people in the world jumping JVX's currently. I know they are gaining popularity, but is that any reason for PD to release their Z brace? I'm also sure they have to know that daudelus is probably reday to release their z brace as soon as PD does, so it offers no clear edge to any high performance canopy manufacturer. PD states that the velocity costs the most to manufacture and that it makes up the smallest amount of sales of their product line. For them to release it would be like them releasing the reserve canopy of the thinner material. Their reserves (in my opinion) are the best on the market, and if they released teh thinner material the only person they would be competing with would be themselves. The same goes for daudelous if they release the JSX. They would only do harm to themselves. I don't think the current competition pilots have fully utilized the canopies on the market. Just look at it, with Nick going so far at sea level. He's a very talented flyer, and will give the PD folks a good run for their money, but are they that scarred of Nick that they have to release a Zbraced canopy? I'm sorry but I just don't see the business sense in releasing the Z-braced canopies to the public, and if the factory dudes are flying them in competition without releasing them to the public then it is an unfair advantage in competition. If they do that then they should compete in the unlimited class, and any world records broken should be noted as having an unfair advantage. I feel that experimental canopies not released to the public should not be able to compete for records. Now if the canopy is a stock canopy that the pilot has modified some how or another then that is fine because everyone would have the ability to make those mods, but using a specifically made canopy for the purpose of a record that no one else will ever be able to achieve in the course of natural competition is fraudulent if you ask me.

[chachi 0]

no offense but it always amazes me when some average dude questions a companies marketing strategy when they well and truly have no clue. what you hear and what is the truth will forever be different and trying to pretend to understand the canopy market as an average skydiver is pretty far fetched to begin with.

the reality is that as much as the velocity is the smallest part of their market share the spin off from having their pilots win is what they are after. all the katana's being sold, all the higer loaded sabre2's, that is the true market. pump people up to transition from their regular line to the top notch. if PD feels even for a second they are losing any momentum it is in their companies best interest to release the hounds so to speak. how do you think they can justify the tremendous cash outlay for the factory team? it is simple, because swooping is the most visible coolest thing in the sport and it drives parachute sales.

i would also want to know how why you feel that if they have their competition pilots using them in competition how it constitutes an unfair advantage? the average guy can go buy a gsx1000 and compete in ama super bike but he would not have the same advantages of the factory bike. is he at an unfair advantage? yes but that's what becoming the best and factory sponsored allows you.

[swooper81 0]

why doesn't PD just make a super velocity? i mean from what i've read that's what a JVX is right, a super vx? put some HMA on there, tweek the trim, and there you go, right? but looking at the end results this year, a velocity pilot was 1st in every major tour including the PST.

of course this all simple to do, especially for some one who hasn't even flown a xbraced yet

[shadowswoop97 0]

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why doesn't PD just make a super velocity? i mean from what i've read that's what a JVX is right, a super vx? put some HMA on there, tweek the trim, and there you go, right? but looking at the end results this year, a velocity pilot was 1st in every major tour including the PST.

of course this all simple to do, especially for some one who hasn't even flown a xbraced yet

the JVX is not a super VX it is a new cell design nose shape trim settings and more differences than you might think.

[proswooper 2]

Not directed at Swooper81

The PD Factory team has not been jumping 'stock' velocities for years now.

The unfair advantage is that if joe blog makes an identical swoop in every way possible to mr factory pilot he will still lose. whats the point in competing? you have to swoop better than a factory pilot just to get the same results!! tell me if you think thats fair.

what i love about the JVX is that for me, in florida where even small local competitions involved competing against the PD factory team, I can at least have a chance of winning. since i started flying the JVX i saw that for some reason overnight i started beating the PD factory pilots and nothing but the canopy had changed. I was a die hard Velo pilot too!

Racing cars have engine restrictions so that the competitions come more down to skill and preparation not whos got the best toy. IMO swoopiing should have an even playing field. The JVX does that.

For years i had friends who were excellent pilots but they refused to compete because the factory teams had an unfair advantage. Now at least three of them started competing because they got HMAs on their velos or got a JVX or something.

sorry for the rant just my opinion

[skygod7777 0]

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put some HMA on there, tweek the trim, and there you go, right?

there are velocity's out there with hma lines, and the factory team has them.....i'm not 100% sure if the pd guys have a different trim with there hma lines or not, but one would think they do.

later

[AggieDave 6]

Just like in other similar sports (racing makes a great comparison) even though you can't buy the top of the line race car/bike from the factory, you can get the production model and make it the race version.

Same with the Velo. You can make your Velo a competition Velo, to a point. Would it be nicer if PD offered it from the factory? Sure. Does it make me lay awake at night in wonder and annoyance? Nope.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[Spizzzarko 0]

"no offense but it always amazes me when some average dude questions a companies marketing strategy when they well and truly have no clue."

And what clue do you have about PD's marketing? I was just applying common business logic to the situation and speculating out loud.

"how do you think they can justify the tremendous cash outlay for the factory team? it is simple, because swooping is the most visible coolest thing in the sport and it drives parachute sales."

Sure it is an advertising expense and I'm sure it has paid off for them very well, but it also makes you wonder if there is any funds from PD's price increase going to support these dudes and their exploits? Again I am just speculating out loud. Some people have a tendency to get defensive about their canopy manufacturer.

"i would also want to know how why you feel that if they have their competition pilots using them in competition how it constitutes an unfair advantage?"

If you asked PD nicely to sell you a canopy just like Jay Moledski's that he used to break the world record, I'm sure they would send you a stock 103. Now the question is: Do you think that canopy was stock? I personally do not. "Rumor" has it that there were several modifications done to that canopy to include:

1. No bridal attachment point.

2. Line attachment point excess binding tape sewn into the canopy.

3. HMA lines (at the time PD did not offer HMA on their velocities)

4. Multiple layered bottom skin (I have heard this but do not know if it is factual. I can see where it would be benefitial though.)

So this discussion boils down to the fact of fairness. The average Joe off the street swooper has no option to buy these modifications from PD. Sure he can do a few of these mods himself like cutting the bridle attachment point off, and getting aftermarket HMA lines, but other than that there is really not much more he could do to that canopy (use of an RDS is given). You go on to compare this to motorbikes (I think). I fell that swooping should be compared to stock car racing. There is only so much you can modify on those cars to still be legal. If a racer wins a race then they tear his car appart to see if it was modified beyond the specified rules. If so then the racer is deemed to have an unfair advantage. Also in Jay Moledski's record swoop he was wearing a sizable amount of weight to load that 103 up to a higher loading. We all know that the bigger the wing you have the farther you can go given that you are able to achieve the speed. Well now th erules are limiting the amount of weight to even out the playing field. If it continued to go the way that it was then it would be an ironman contest to see who can jump with the most weight. Eventually it would get so rediculous, that people would be jumping with a 120 velocity in a tandem rig so they could strap all the weight on, if they old ways were left unchecked. In my opinion, canopies used for world records in competition should be limited to what the manufacturer will sell to the general public. Now if they want to have a Gee-Wizz class of super modified canopies that will swopp 2,000', fine that's cool in my book, but I feel that the competition record should be the one that counts.

[proswooper 2]

The PD factory canopies (since the world cup in lake wales) have differences that go beyond the lines. differences that you cannot get with after market rigger mods.

[skygod7777 0]

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The PD factory canopies (since the world cup in lake wales) have differences that go beyond the lines. differences that you cannot get with after market rigger mods.

right, i've heard this.....pretty sure you told me to, i think, i don't know, can't remember.

later

[chachi 0]

while racing may have engine limiters the factory boys ALWAYS get the upgraded suspension, tires, and team to assist them in winning the day. while racing cars may not be the best comparison to canopy piloting there should be advantages to being a factory pilot.

HMA was really the only difference in the stock velocity to the one the factory pilots were using and to be honest i can't believe someone just didn't measure their lines and go make an HMA set way before PD started selling them. or add length, or change the trim. there are no equipment checks so you have all the power to do what you will to make your canopy fly better.

that said most of my comments were about marketing and how to sit in your arm chair and think you know the marketing of a canopy manufacturer and when is the right time to release a new canopy is silly.