CanopyPiloting 0 #1 June 12, 2006 News from www.canopypiloting.com The JVX and Velocity tied for the fastest time (2.76 seconds) during the Speed event of the PST's Mile Hi Canopy Cup competition. In addition, the JVX and Velocity tied for the longest swoop (436 feet) during the distance event. Even with the PST enforcing the new weight control rules Paul Rousoww had the longest single swoop (550 feet) of the competition flying his Daedalus JVX 92 but he slightly skimmed the surface of the water during the run which disqualified it as an official score. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Treejumps 0 #2 June 12, 2006 Thanks for the report, it is very interesting for those looking for new competition canopies. So you are saying that the 6 year old 21 cell Velocity design and the latest and greatest 27 cell pure swoop machine have more or less equal performance. Very interesting. Who was flying the Velo? I understand that Jeffro won overall, what was he flying? Cya Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydivenagasaki 0 #3 June 12, 2006 QuoteI understand that Jeffro won overall, what was he flying? He was flying a Xaos but I couldn't say for sure whether it was a 21 or 27...I think 27 "and if you don't like it then 'Hey Fuck You'" --The Beastie Boys-- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cessna54tango 0 #4 June 12, 2006 nice to see that a cha-hos won. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanuckInUSA 0 #5 June 12, 2006 QuoteThanks for the report, it is very interesting for those looking for new competition canopies. So you are saying that the 6 year old 21 cell Velocity design and the latest and greatest 27 cell pure swoop machine have more or less equal performance. Very interesting. Who was flying the Velo? I understand that Jeffro won overall, what was he flying? Cya I think we can all agree that it is the pilot first before the wing (as an example myself the least experienced person in this swoop comp finished at the back of the pack even though I am on a JVX versus someone like TJ or Jeffro who would finish near the front regardless of what wing they were on). But you shouldn't criticize something that you may not have tried yet. The JVX is an awesome wing and a real pleasure to fly. Give it some more time and you will start to see what it is capable of doing. Oh, I will be reverted back to my Velo on (most) zone accuracy runs as I just generated way too much speed on that 2nd zone accuracy run to think that I could shut it down before I reached the end of the positive scoring zones. Either that or I just need to jump it more and learn how to control it better. Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkymonkeyONE 3 #6 June 12, 2006 Jeffro flies a Xaos 27 and he won the meet. The best competitors are going to do the best under whichever wing they are most practiced under. The best competitors are going to do well no matter what is over their head. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marks 0 #7 June 12, 2006 QuoteJeffro flies a Xaos 27 and he won the meet. The best competitors are going to do the best under whichever wing they are most practiced under. The best competitors are going to do well no matter what is over their head. overall is overall. afterall.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Treejumps 0 #8 June 12, 2006 Yo Chuck, "The best competitors are going to do well no matter what is over their head." My point exactly. I see lots of folks chasing gear to get better results, but pilot skill is always going to make a far bigger difference than little gear tweaks. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #9 June 12, 2006 QuoteI see lots of folks chasing gear to get better results, but pilot skill is always going to make a far bigger difference than little gear tweaks. You can only go so fast with a Yugo, though. Would you feel like that gear makes a relative difference, but not as much as people think?--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GQ_jumper 4 #10 June 12, 2006 overall is overall. afterall.. Quote damn, that wuz deep i'm gonna go ponder that one for a whileHistory does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or the timid. --Dwight D. Eisenhower Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites CanuckInUSA 0 #11 June 12, 2006 Let's keep the Bonfire remarks in the Bonfire. Back on topic: Last time I checked, the event which occured in Colorado this last weekend was a full blown Pro Swooping Tour event attended by some of the best canopy pilots in the world (as well as a few advanced amateur competitors). I think we know why Jim started this thread (he's proud of the JVX) but since when did we want to hold back people competing on the PST with their gear selections? Shouldn't people competing at the elite level be allowed the freedom to choose what they want to fly and how they want to fly it (as long as they don't scare the judges too much). Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites superstu 0 #12 June 13, 2006 QuoteSo you are saying that the 6 year old 21 cell Velocity design and the latest and greatest 27 cell pure swoop machine have more or less equal performance. so are you saying that the people that have had a chance to perfect their skills over the last 6 years on the velocity were now caught by people that have been flying the JVX not even a full year? that's pretty interesting if you think about it. the velocity is an awesome canopy there is no doubt about it, but as more and more JVX pilots perfect their technique the competition will be tighter and tighter. it's still the pilot, as jeffro demonstrated, that makes the difference. some of the pilots at this competition definitely were NOT on their game and some, like Paul R, just got unlucky by the smallest of margins. and at this competition the margin was so small the difference between the top 10 spots after day 1 was about 10 points. hell, the difference between 2nd and 3rd was .23 points, i know cause i was in 2nd after the 1st day. just food for thought...stuSlip Stream Air Sports Do not go softly, do not go quietly, never back down Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Treejumps 0 #13 June 13, 2006 so are you saying that the people that have had a chance to perfect their skills over the last 6 years on the velocity were now caught by people that have been flying the JVX not even a full year? that's pretty interesting if you think about it. Good point! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites marks 0 #14 June 13, 2006 QuoteQuoteSo you are saying that the 6 year old 21 cell Velocity design and the latest and greatest 27 cell pure swoop machine have more or less equal performance. so are you saying that the people that have had a chance to perfect their skills over the last 6 years on the velocity were now caught by people that have been flying the JVX not even a full year? that's pretty interesting if you think about it. the velocity is an awesome canopy there is no doubt about it, but as more and more JVX pilots perfect their technique the competition will be tighter and tighter. it's still the pilot, as jeffro demonstrated, that makes the difference. some of the pilots at this competition definitely were NOT on their game and some, like Paul R, just got unlucky by the smallest of margins. and at this competition the margin was so small the difference between the top 10 spots after day 1 was about 10 points. hell, the difference between 2nd and 3rd was .23 points, i know cause i was in 2nd after the 1st day. just food for thought...stu I have learned just to shut my mouth on this subject. but ya. .23 points between 2nd and 3rd after half the comp was over and the scores were in the 360's. that's preaty tight. nice swoopin stu.and Jim, you SHOULD be proud of the JVX. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites RMURRAY 1 #15 June 13, 2006 JVX pilots will dominate. just a matter of time. PD makes a good reserve though... rm Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkymonkeyONE 3 #16 June 13, 2006 QuoteJVX pilots will dominate. just a matter of time. PD makes a good reserve though... rm JVX pilots may dominate at some point, but I can promise you that point won't come until the Athlete's sponsors start buying that canopy for them. Lets be real here: Equipment manufacturers are always vying to get the best competitors flying their canopies. Those sponsored athletes are going to jump the best offering a company can come up with. NONE of those people are going to arbitrarilly blow off their sponsorship and jump another canopy unless they are: a) fed up with their current deal, or b) have been courted by another company, or c) they have lost their deal altogether and have to scamper for another deal. Some people in that last category might then chose to switch to the JVX (or another canopy) which they must pay full price for. I can only think of very, very few instances where the top-level fully-sponsored pilots changed canopies in the past few years. Then, it was a Precision to Icarus trade and in JC's case it was an Icarus to PD trade. As far as I know, the only fully-sponsored "independant" team who's deal is not tied directly to a canopy manufacturer is Red Bull. Those guys can jump anything they like, so long as the manufacturer can sew that logo on bottom. Some of you younger guys that kicked ass last year are no doubt sporting various degrees of sponsorship now. Some of you might even be sporting some degree of Daedalus sponsorship. One thing I can almost guarantee, though, is that if you are currently operating on an un-signed 50% sponsorship by one company and another competing company offers you a full ride, you are going to take the ride so long as it's another proven canopy. That's the way it works, folks and you are very naive if you believe otherwise. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Treejumps 0 #17 June 13, 2006 More good points Chuck. I still doubt the competitive performance edge of any given canopy. In the end it is all about dialing in any of the excellent wings available (JVX included), and practice, pracatice, practice. A good example is Tagle switching from VX to Velo, and within months he was winning everything. Why? Because he is a damn good pilot, period. Jeffro won on a Xaos 27, which is substantially the same as a VX or JVX; 27 xbraced cells with skinny lines. Jeffro is just a kick ass canopy pilot. At the highest levels of performance pilot skill is the true competitive edge. Everyone loves the wing that carries them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites polarbear 1 #18 June 14, 2006 Just out of curiosity, how have competitors been dealing with the new weight regulations? Are people flying smaller canopies and maintaining the high wingloadings we saw last year, or sticking with the bigger wings at lighter loadings? "Holy s*** that was f***in' cold!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites marks 0 #19 June 14, 2006 QuoteJust out of curiosity, how have competitors been dealing with the new weight regulations? Are people flying smaller canopies and maintaining the high wingloadings we saw last year, or sticking with the bigger wings at lighter loadings? smaller wings. that is from what I have seen. I wish I could afford a wing 6- 7 square feet smaller than I have now. then I would have one also. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites AggieDave 6 #20 June 14, 2006 Quote I wish I could afford a wing 6- 7 square feet smaller than I have now. then I would have one also. You don't have a rigger friend with a hot knife? Easy fix. Ok, seriously, although not on the pro level I've had a bit of a problem with the CPC level with the weight thing. I've lost a little weight so my wingloading is closer to 1.8:1 then the 1.9:1 it used to be, BUT I'm too big and fat to be allowed the use of weights. My rig is also .7lbs under the 25lbs weight limit. Its a stock rig with a reserve, cypres and main. Nothing special. I can see its a conspiracy against normal sized people in a sport full of short-little scrawny guys.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites marks 0 #21 June 14, 2006 QuoteQuote I wish I could afford a wing 6- 7 square feet smaller than I have now. then I would have one also. You don't have a rigger friend with a hot knife? Easy fix. Ok, seriously, although not on the pro level I've had a bit of a problem with the CPC level with the weight thing. I've lost a little weight so my wingloading is closer to 1.8:1 then the 1.9:1 it used to be, BUT I'm too big and fat to be allowed the use of weights. My rig is also .7lbs under the 25lbs weight limit. Its a stock rig with a reserve, cypres and main. Nothing special. I can see its a conspiracy against normal sized people in a sport full of short-little scrawny guys. you will be made an exception if necessary. I am 100% sure of that. "there is a place for EVERYONE in swooping." --jim slaton. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ntacfreefly 0 #22 June 14, 2006 Your bigger loaded wing will go further than the same smaller wing at the same loading. Being able to load a 150 at 1.9 is plenty advantage To the mind that is still, the whole universe surrenders. ~ Lao-Tzu It's all good, they're my brothers ~ Mariann Kramer Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites crazydiver 0 #23 June 14, 2006 QuoteQuote I wish I could afford a wing 6- 7 square feet smaller than I have now. then I would have one also. You don't have a rigger friend with a hot knife? Easy fix. Ok, seriously, although not on the pro level I've had a bit of a problem with the CPC level with the weight thing. I've lost a little weight so my wingloading is closer to 1.8:1 then the 1.9:1 it used to be, BUT I'm too big and fat to be allowed the use of weights. My rig is also .7lbs under the 25lbs weight limit. Its a stock rig with a reserve, cypres and main. Nothing special. So go smaller on your canopy choice. Even one downsize will have much more lift and power than what most average sized folks are jumping. Cheers, Travis Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites AggieDave 6 #24 June 14, 2006 QuoteSo go smaller on your canopy choice. Even one downsize will have much more lift and power than what most average sized folks are jumping. That's in the works, something should be ordered by the end of the season...the $$$ thing is the kicker.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites justchrisdsp 0 #25 June 14, 2006 i load my mamba 150 at a little under 1.8 and i have been getting some pretty good distance for a guy that sucks at swooping. you should try one of those, demo one and you will love the speed and distance you can get out of it. im sure if someone my size with a lot more skill was jumping it they could easily get some competition winning type runs with it The only bad skydive is your last! chris "sonic wookie" harwell Piedra-belluda-roja Rodriguez Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 Next Page 1 of 2 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. 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CanuckInUSA 0 #11 June 12, 2006 Let's keep the Bonfire remarks in the Bonfire. Back on topic: Last time I checked, the event which occured in Colorado this last weekend was a full blown Pro Swooping Tour event attended by some of the best canopy pilots in the world (as well as a few advanced amateur competitors). I think we know why Jim started this thread (he's proud of the JVX) but since when did we want to hold back people competing on the PST with their gear selections? Shouldn't people competing at the elite level be allowed the freedom to choose what they want to fly and how they want to fly it (as long as they don't scare the judges too much). Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
superstu 0 #12 June 13, 2006 QuoteSo you are saying that the 6 year old 21 cell Velocity design and the latest and greatest 27 cell pure swoop machine have more or less equal performance. so are you saying that the people that have had a chance to perfect their skills over the last 6 years on the velocity were now caught by people that have been flying the JVX not even a full year? that's pretty interesting if you think about it. the velocity is an awesome canopy there is no doubt about it, but as more and more JVX pilots perfect their technique the competition will be tighter and tighter. it's still the pilot, as jeffro demonstrated, that makes the difference. some of the pilots at this competition definitely were NOT on their game and some, like Paul R, just got unlucky by the smallest of margins. and at this competition the margin was so small the difference between the top 10 spots after day 1 was about 10 points. hell, the difference between 2nd and 3rd was .23 points, i know cause i was in 2nd after the 1st day. just food for thought...stuSlip Stream Air Sports Do not go softly, do not go quietly, never back down Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Treejumps 0 #13 June 13, 2006 so are you saying that the people that have had a chance to perfect their skills over the last 6 years on the velocity were now caught by people that have been flying the JVX not even a full year? that's pretty interesting if you think about it. Good point! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marks 0 #14 June 13, 2006 QuoteQuoteSo you are saying that the 6 year old 21 cell Velocity design and the latest and greatest 27 cell pure swoop machine have more or less equal performance. so are you saying that the people that have had a chance to perfect their skills over the last 6 years on the velocity were now caught by people that have been flying the JVX not even a full year? that's pretty interesting if you think about it. the velocity is an awesome canopy there is no doubt about it, but as more and more JVX pilots perfect their technique the competition will be tighter and tighter. it's still the pilot, as jeffro demonstrated, that makes the difference. some of the pilots at this competition definitely were NOT on their game and some, like Paul R, just got unlucky by the smallest of margins. and at this competition the margin was so small the difference between the top 10 spots after day 1 was about 10 points. hell, the difference between 2nd and 3rd was .23 points, i know cause i was in 2nd after the 1st day. just food for thought...stu I have learned just to shut my mouth on this subject. but ya. .23 points between 2nd and 3rd after half the comp was over and the scores were in the 360's. that's preaty tight. nice swoopin stu.and Jim, you SHOULD be proud of the JVX. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RMURRAY 1 #15 June 13, 2006 JVX pilots will dominate. just a matter of time. PD makes a good reserve though... rm Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkymonkeyONE 3 #16 June 13, 2006 QuoteJVX pilots will dominate. just a matter of time. PD makes a good reserve though... rm JVX pilots may dominate at some point, but I can promise you that point won't come until the Athlete's sponsors start buying that canopy for them. Lets be real here: Equipment manufacturers are always vying to get the best competitors flying their canopies. Those sponsored athletes are going to jump the best offering a company can come up with. NONE of those people are going to arbitrarilly blow off their sponsorship and jump another canopy unless they are: a) fed up with their current deal, or b) have been courted by another company, or c) they have lost their deal altogether and have to scamper for another deal. Some people in that last category might then chose to switch to the JVX (or another canopy) which they must pay full price for. I can only think of very, very few instances where the top-level fully-sponsored pilots changed canopies in the past few years. Then, it was a Precision to Icarus trade and in JC's case it was an Icarus to PD trade. As far as I know, the only fully-sponsored "independant" team who's deal is not tied directly to a canopy manufacturer is Red Bull. Those guys can jump anything they like, so long as the manufacturer can sew that logo on bottom. Some of you younger guys that kicked ass last year are no doubt sporting various degrees of sponsorship now. Some of you might even be sporting some degree of Daedalus sponsorship. One thing I can almost guarantee, though, is that if you are currently operating on an un-signed 50% sponsorship by one company and another competing company offers you a full ride, you are going to take the ride so long as it's another proven canopy. That's the way it works, folks and you are very naive if you believe otherwise. Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Treejumps 0 #17 June 13, 2006 More good points Chuck. I still doubt the competitive performance edge of any given canopy. In the end it is all about dialing in any of the excellent wings available (JVX included), and practice, pracatice, practice. A good example is Tagle switching from VX to Velo, and within months he was winning everything. Why? Because he is a damn good pilot, period. Jeffro won on a Xaos 27, which is substantially the same as a VX or JVX; 27 xbraced cells with skinny lines. Jeffro is just a kick ass canopy pilot. At the highest levels of performance pilot skill is the true competitive edge. Everyone loves the wing that carries them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
polarbear 1 #18 June 14, 2006 Just out of curiosity, how have competitors been dealing with the new weight regulations? Are people flying smaller canopies and maintaining the high wingloadings we saw last year, or sticking with the bigger wings at lighter loadings? "Holy s*** that was f***in' cold!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marks 0 #19 June 14, 2006 QuoteJust out of curiosity, how have competitors been dealing with the new weight regulations? Are people flying smaller canopies and maintaining the high wingloadings we saw last year, or sticking with the bigger wings at lighter loadings? smaller wings. that is from what I have seen. I wish I could afford a wing 6- 7 square feet smaller than I have now. then I would have one also. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #20 June 14, 2006 Quote I wish I could afford a wing 6- 7 square feet smaller than I have now. then I would have one also. You don't have a rigger friend with a hot knife? Easy fix. Ok, seriously, although not on the pro level I've had a bit of a problem with the CPC level with the weight thing. I've lost a little weight so my wingloading is closer to 1.8:1 then the 1.9:1 it used to be, BUT I'm too big and fat to be allowed the use of weights. My rig is also .7lbs under the 25lbs weight limit. Its a stock rig with a reserve, cypres and main. Nothing special. I can see its a conspiracy against normal sized people in a sport full of short-little scrawny guys.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marks 0 #21 June 14, 2006 QuoteQuote I wish I could afford a wing 6- 7 square feet smaller than I have now. then I would have one also. You don't have a rigger friend with a hot knife? Easy fix. Ok, seriously, although not on the pro level I've had a bit of a problem with the CPC level with the weight thing. I've lost a little weight so my wingloading is closer to 1.8:1 then the 1.9:1 it used to be, BUT I'm too big and fat to be allowed the use of weights. My rig is also .7lbs under the 25lbs weight limit. Its a stock rig with a reserve, cypres and main. Nothing special. I can see its a conspiracy against normal sized people in a sport full of short-little scrawny guys. you will be made an exception if necessary. I am 100% sure of that. "there is a place for EVERYONE in swooping." --jim slaton. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ntacfreefly 0 #22 June 14, 2006 Your bigger loaded wing will go further than the same smaller wing at the same loading. Being able to load a 150 at 1.9 is plenty advantage To the mind that is still, the whole universe surrenders. ~ Lao-Tzu It's all good, they're my brothers ~ Mariann Kramer Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
crazydiver 0 #23 June 14, 2006 QuoteQuote I wish I could afford a wing 6- 7 square feet smaller than I have now. then I would have one also. You don't have a rigger friend with a hot knife? Easy fix. Ok, seriously, although not on the pro level I've had a bit of a problem with the CPC level with the weight thing. I've lost a little weight so my wingloading is closer to 1.8:1 then the 1.9:1 it used to be, BUT I'm too big and fat to be allowed the use of weights. My rig is also .7lbs under the 25lbs weight limit. Its a stock rig with a reserve, cypres and main. Nothing special. So go smaller on your canopy choice. Even one downsize will have much more lift and power than what most average sized folks are jumping. Cheers, Travis Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #24 June 14, 2006 QuoteSo go smaller on your canopy choice. Even one downsize will have much more lift and power than what most average sized folks are jumping. That's in the works, something should be ordered by the end of the season...the $$$ thing is the kicker.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
justchrisdsp 0 #25 June 14, 2006 i load my mamba 150 at a little under 1.8 and i have been getting some pretty good distance for a guy that sucks at swooping. you should try one of those, demo one and you will love the speed and distance you can get out of it. im sure if someone my size with a lot more skill was jumping it they could easily get some competition winning type runs with it The only bad skydive is your last! chris "sonic wookie" harwell Piedra-belluda-roja Rodriguez Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
