Bushmasta 0 #1 February 7, 2002 I recentely obtained my A license. I only have 36 jumps and looking to purchase gear. I'm 6'1, 220lbs. a couple of questions:1. Articulated Harness? worth it? needed?2. Hornet 230 for first main? 3. Tempo Reserve? ( guys at my DZ say that the hornet and tempo are cheap imatations and I should buy the name brand, Sabre 2 vs. Hornet and Raven-m vs. tempo. i will be buying new gear so i'm trying to stay within a budget)4. Any recommendations for dealer? I know Square1 and Paragear, but maybe someone a little more competitive? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flow 1 #2 February 7, 2002 Quote1. Articulated Harness? worth it? needed?Definitely gives more comfort, ask if you could test some rigs at your DZ with and without the rings, then decide if it's worth it.QuoteI only have 36 jumps and looking to purchase gear. I'm 6'1, 220lbs.2. Hornet 230 for first main? You didn't tell what kind of an canopy you have flown before and at what wingloading? You could also consider the 210 IMO.Quote3. Tempo Reserve? ( guys at my DZ say that the hornet and tempo are cheap imatations and I should buy the name brand, Sabre 2 vs. Hornet and Raven-m vs. tempoCheap imitation? Hornet was on the market atleast two, or was it three years before the Sabre2, and you could say that Sabre2 is an expensive imitation of Hornet. You can ask anyone who has flown both canopies that they are almost the same thing. Again, it's up to you if you think that Sabre2 is worth the +500$. And what comes to Tempo, go for it, seen two reserve rides this summer, both on Tempo, no complaints from the owner.j. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PalmettoTiger 1 #3 February 7, 2002 Quoteguys at my DZ say that the hornet and tempo are cheap imatations and I should buy the name brand, Sabre 2 vs. Hornet and Raven-m vs. tempo.Don't listen to the gear snobs. Like flow said, the Hornet has been out longer than the Sabre2 and it's just as good if not better. The Tempo had to pass the TSO testing, so you know it meets the same standards as other reserves. Has anyone ever heard of a reserve - by any manufacturer - actually blowing up when the jumper was within the placarded weight and speed limits? Hmm... I think there was a bulletin about certain RAVENS needing extra work. Shows you what the gear snobs know.PTigerI'm stepping through the doorAnd I'm floating in a most peculiar way Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Emmie 0 #4 February 7, 2002 You might want to try Rigs & Things Paraservice. The address is www.para-service.com. In my experience they have the most competitive prices outthere. You can get a hornet for $930, & a Tempo for $590. they also have great custumer service, Roy is the best. Good luck buying your gear. (Oh also you might also want to got he the enclave, www.enclave.com, go under the skydivingh index, click on gear, and it will show you a list of dealers) If you end up calling Roy tell him Marianna mentioned himI'm trying ot suck up so that he'd send me my gear earlier. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mountainman 0 #5 February 7, 2002 Hey there....I am 5'10" and 220. I bought new gear and I would definetely recommend the articlulated harness. They move so much better and are much more comfortable.As for dealer, you should look at http://www.para-service.com and http://www.skykat.com. Those are the places with the best prices and the service is great from both. Good luck with your choices!JumpinDuo.com...come and sign the guestbook. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 259 #6 February 7, 2002 Yup, it's real important to get the lowest possible price on your skydiving equipment. Let's keep WalMarting the gear dealerships into bankruptcy so in the future we can all buy gear at list price direct from the manufacturers.If you really want the lowest possible price buy used equipment. pull and flare,lisa--What would Scooby Doo? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 558 #7 February 7, 2002 Articulated harnesses help two types of jumpers.The first group is the tiny, super flexible girls doing freestyle.The second group is big guys stuffed into small airplanes.You fit in the second group.I am 6 foot tall and trying to keep my weight under 200 pounds. Both my rigs have hip rings because they make it easier to fold my long legs into Cessnas. Chest rings come in handy when you want to really crank that chest strap tight for head down diving. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scottbre 0 #8 February 7, 2002 QuoteYup, it's real important to get the lowest possible price on your skydiving equipment. Let's keep WalMarting the gear dealerships into bankruptcy so in the future we can all buy gear at list price direct from the manufacturers.If you really want the lowest possible price buy used equipment. Do I detect a bit of sarcasm?"Let the rabbits wear glasses. . . " Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
justinbuss 0 #9 February 7, 2002 QuoteYup, it's real important to get the lowest possible price on your skydiving equipment. Let's keep WalMarting the gear dealerships into bankruptcy so in the future we can all buy gear at list price direct from the manufacturersWas that the bitch or the sky talking?I must be lonely ... all the faces around me are ugly Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MarkM 0 #10 February 7, 2002 Hmm, I paid 20 bucks over online prices for a Z1 at Sebastian's Drop Shop. Do I get a cookie? At least the chick selling it to me was a babe. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skreamer 1 #11 February 7, 2002 QuoteDo I get a cookie?You will if you shop on-line!!!!"Don't die until you're dead" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Remster 24 #12 February 7, 2002 QuoteYup, it's real important to get the lowest possible price on your skydiving equipment. Let's keep WalMarting the gear dealerships into bankruptcy so in the future we can all buy gear at list price direct from the manufacturers.Yes Lisa, price is important.As consumers, its our right to shop around for what we consider the best deal (that usually is a combinaison of price, service, and a myriad of other factors). If a delaer isnt happy with the low prices another is selling gear at, i really feel sorry for them (yes, that was sarcasm too).The gear dealer you get that equipment from has a role, but consider this:- in most cases, the day to day servicing and maintenance of you rig will not be done by the dealer, but by a local rigger- the big issues will most often be dealt with the manufacturers directly.- if you jump at a big dz with a big dealer, great.. you probably be able to get most any brand. If you jump at a small dz that only has, say, a Sun Path dealer and a PD dealer, thats all you could get from him. If thats what you want great...But if you want something else, you re going to order your rig from another dealer accross the country, why not make sure its the best price possible?So based on that, if dealer A has the stuff I want at 5000, and dealer B at 4500, and I'm equally impressed with their help and knowledge, its not going to be a long decision process.Equally, is Rig A is 5000 and Rib B is 4500 and having demoed the canopies and containers, I'm equally happy with both setups, its not going to be a long decission either.You're right on the lowest possible price: yes, used is usually best. But I can bet I can find a javelin or Vector 3, Sabre 2, PDR rig for more then a Wings Hornet Tempo new.RemsterMuff 914 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rendezvous 0 #13 February 7, 2002 Articulated harness is quite worth it comfort wise. Besides It might have a better resale over the regular harness when you are ready for a rig change. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bushmasta 0 #14 February 7, 2002 Thanks everyone. I believe i will be going with para-service they have the other places like square1 and para-gear on prices. I don't mind paying for quality but i don't see why i should pay up to 300 differences between dealers. What's the big difference mini rings vs. standard rings? and the riser types? its confusing as to what to get? Help? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 14 #15 February 7, 2002 Why don't you call up the dealers and ask the question? The dealer that spends the time helping you will probally have better customer service during the sale.Murphy's Laws of Love - If the person isn't taken, there's a reason for that... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiveMonkey 0 #16 February 7, 2002 Mini rings look cooler, but can cause a harder cutaway due to less leverage. Speak to the gear dealers and they will tell all... my mind is like a canopy - 9 cells and I'm happy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 14 #17 February 8, 2002 Actually, if you want the lowest possible cost, check out Pier-Media in New York. The seem to be able to beat anyone in terms of price. They are located hereSearch the archives on the differences in the rings, lots been wrote on it.Let us know how you like the new gear.Murphy's Laws of Love - If the person isn't taken, there's a reason for that... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Spectrejumper 0 #18 February 8, 2002 QuoteWhat's the big difference mini rings vs. standard rings? and the riser types? its confusing as to what to get?Well, I'm 5'11", 225 lbs (so about 250 out the door) and I feel more comfortable with Type 8 risers (the big ones), and large three rings. I bought my rig when I had about 65 jumps, I have 515 now. My Javelin is holding up great, no problems at all. I didn't get the articulated harness, but I still find it very comfortable. My DZ has a Cessna 180, so I know all about being crammed into small planes. I had a Spectre 210, which served me very well. Depending on what you've been jumping you might want to stick with the 230, but I'd demo both if possible. I have a Dash M 249 for my reserve. I was going to get a PD, but it was a pack volume issue. I have no personal knowledge of any problems with Tempo reserves, but I didn't want the cheapest thing possible as my last chance. As far as the "they pass the same TSO" argument, Yugo's and Volvo's pass the same FMVSS requirements but that doesn't make them equal in the event of a crash. So this turned into a much longer post than I originally intended, but we're about the same size so I figured I'd let you know what works for me. YMMV. Mike D-23312"It's such a shame to spend your time away like this...existing." JMH Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiveMonkey 0 #19 February 8, 2002 Read the reviews of tempos and hornets on this site - there's not a bad thing said against them. my mind is like a canopy - 9 cells and I'm happy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kirils 1 #20 February 8, 2002 Remember what P.T. Barnum said...Skydiving is not a static excercise with discrete predictability... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skymedic 0 #21 February 8, 2002 QuoteVolvo's pass the same FMVSS you best not be dissing my volvo...marc"...a mind stretched with new idea's will never regain its shape" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 14 #22 February 8, 2002 Hahaha.... I think he's dissing the Yugo. Funny name... Yugo, it never seems to go any where.....There are things better than sex, and things worse than sex. But there is nothing exactly like it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Spectrejumper 0 #23 February 9, 2002 QuoteHahaha.... I think he's dissing the Yugo.Not really dissing either. Just trying to illustrate that just because two things meet a minimum federal standard they aren't necessarily equal. Although I'd much rather be in a Volvo, crash situation or not. Mike D-23312"It's such a shame to spend your time away like this...existing." JMH Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AndyMan 7 #24 February 9, 2002 I agree with your argument that all reserves passing the same TSO is a pretty weak argument.That said, for years the "smart choice" was a Raven Reserve. Nobody could go wrong with a Raven Reserve. Then the recall came around...I agree, I'll probably buy PD on my next one... But I think we should be careful about buying into the hype that one Product is so much better then others. I haven't seen any numbers that say the Tempo is more failure prone then any other Reserve._Am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jimbo 0 #25 February 9, 2002 QuoteRead the reviews of tempos and hornets on this site - there's not a bad thing said against them. Again, on the Yugo vs. Volvo thread, or maybe Tempo vs. Other reserves - there are a few 'bad' things written about the Tempo on this site. QuoteHad my 3rd reserve ride on a Tempo 2 weeks ago. Three different Tempo's. Two of them were 170's, the last one, a 150. All 3 of them did the job. I landed in one piece. BUT, all of them had a rather drastic turn in them. On the last ride, I had to take two wraps on the right toggle to keep the thing flying semi-straight. Three different riggers told me thats normal with a Tempo. I relagated the Tempo 150 to an old rig, and ordered a new PD 143R. It costs more, but, I'm loading it fairly hard, and PD makes a consistently superior product. I for one will pay the extra if for nothing else than peace of mind! QuoteTwo recent rides on 120 tempos. The 1st was near perfect great opening and soft landing. The second (different canopy) however was a bit scary. I had to fly the canopy with left toggle at my waist line to get it to fly stright. Had it been a main I would have cut it away. Landing was hard. Two reviews mentioning a 'built in turn', I realize it's not 100 reviews, but it's enough to make me wonder. I'll stick with my Raven thanks.-Jim Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
