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migliore

Falling out of a Harness

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Wow, Happy Halloween, this thread is back from the dead.

Vskydiver fell out of her harness once, hanging at 2 grand by her knees in the leg straps, just like on the monkey bars. She climbed back up into the rig. I know a lot of people say it can't happen. PM Vskydiver for the details. It'll make you think twice.



If you do not mind could you elaborate what may have put her in that position ie. sitfly..hard opening? Thanks

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If you do not mind could you elaborate what may have put her in that position ie. sitfly..hard opening? Thanks

Hard opening. She's not very big and very flexible. Her legs flew up, her butt slid out with her torso following. Pretty scary.

She's not the only person that has had that happen, but some people still think it's not possible.

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If you do not mind could you elaborate what may have put her in that position ie. sitfly..hard opening? Thanks

Hard opening. She's not very big and very flexible. Her legs flew up, her butt slid out with her torso following. Pretty scary.

She's not the only person that has had that happen, but some people still think it's not possible.



Crazy. I am glad she was able to get back in the harness. I can see it possible, on one of my deployments I remember my feet being head level. I think I pitched down when I reached for the BOC and it whipped me to the position (folded at the waist with my feet in my face). I however was no where near coming out of the harness but I can see plausible.

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"

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... I can get out of my seatbelt ... without disconnecting anything as well. I don't see that as a problem. ...

Car seatbelts are crap, a huge compromise of comfort and convenience over safety. You won't see F-1 or Nascar using that inertial-locking-shoulder-and-lap crap. Try slipping out of a correctly adjusted 5-point harness. ...

"

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Car seat-belts had to be dumbed-down to match the intelligence of the average car driver.
Given the low intelligence of the average car driver, add fatigue, alcohol, distractions in the form of cell phones, pets, make-up, other traffic, pedestrians, traffic lights, road signs, etc. .... it is a miracle that so few car drivers die!



A lot of cars now have pre-tensioners, so that they get cinched up if the airbags are fired. It is a very effective method of reducing injuries, as the slack in the belt is a very important factor in how far forward you'll get thrown/how hard you'll hit the wheel, etc. It should be standard equipment, but not yet.
People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

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Wow, Happy Halloween, this thread is back from the dead.

Vskydiver fell out of her harness once, hanging at 2 grand by her knees in the leg straps, just like on the monkey bars. She climbed back up into the rig. I know a lot of people say it can't happen. PM Vskydiver for the details. It'll make you think twice.



Did that happen on a student rig or one made for her? If it was her rig, what was your countermeasure - did you add a solid (not just bungee) strap to go across the leg straps?
People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

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Custom rig, very small backpack. She now has a non-stretch strap where many install bungees.



The non-stretch strap is so much more useful than a bungee. Here's a repost of a good article from Jan Meyer on the subject and how to get such a strap made and applied to a rig with no sewing to the rig itself:

http://www.makeithappen.com/spsj/fallout.html
People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

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Maybe I'm missing something but what the heck is a little bungee going to actually accomplish? I have the thing and it's like a shoelace...how could that save my 'ass' from going through, literally.

Thanks,

Jeff



My understanding is that it keeps the properly adjusted leg straps from sliding towards your knees where you would be more likely to fall thru. Of course it is not a weight bearing piece, it just keeps everything in the right position.

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Maybe I'm missing something but what the heck is a little bungee going to actually accomplish? I have the thing and it's like a shoelace...how could that save my 'ass' from going through, literally.

Thanks,

Jeff



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Flimsy little elastic bungees are designed to hold the leg pads in place (where your buttock cheek meets your leg) BEFORE they are loaded - during opening shock.
The alternative is leg straps sliping down - too low - before opening shock, then you are at risk of falling out and a little piece of stretchy bungee cord will make no difference.

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ShcShc11

http://www.chutingstar.com/newgear_en/swooper-belly-band.html

So by any chance would these be worth the cost for a newbie?



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Belly bands might help.
Belly bands definitely help when you are putting large containers on small students because they prevent the container from shifting sideways.

Butt bungees only came into fashion after hip rings and after those hip rings had been in service for a few years (mid-1990s). Then second-owners complained about leg straps wandering. Most of them were wearing harnesses specifically tailored for some-one bigger than them. Dough!
No wonder harnesses were sliding around on their own!
The solution was adding a little elastic bungee cord between the lower leg straps to hold them in place until opening shock.

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Yes,
Circa 1980, a local jumper (slender, fit young woman) got a custom-made Wonderhog with a butt strap similar to the butt strap in Jan Meyers' article. The extra butt-strap was seen on at the factory.

Fast forward to this century and Y-straps are now mandatory for tandem students. I prefer the Strong Y-strap because it is sewn to the leg straps. Sewing it to the leg straps reduces the "confusion of straps" during dressing. Sometimes that confusion is caused by the Y-strap sliding too far forward, forward of the leg pads?????? Sewing Y-straps also reduces the size of the "hole in the harness" that your butt might fall out.
In the long run, I would vote for a strap similar to Jan's but hand-tacked or zig-zag sewn to the leg pads by a field rigger.

As an aside, a few years back I took a tandem student who was missing part of one leg (amputated mid-femur) and was glad to tighten the Y-strap to ensure that the leg strap did not slip off the stump of his leg.

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jrjny

Maybe I'm missing something but what the heck is a little bungee going to actually accomplish? I have the thing and it's like a shoelace...how could that save my 'ass' from going through, literally.

Sorry to be so slow answering. I was out of town a bit.

The bungee merely keeps the leg straps in place, up high instead of sliding down the thigh. My wife and I both prefer a non-elastic strap (about the strength of a heavy pull up cord) as a more secure, partly load bearing addition. I like the idea of a true saddle strap even more.

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I know this one is from ages ago, but came across it again. I've had several used rigs over the years and this issue was always in the back of my mind, but I never actually tried it, though I'm tall and skinny so I presumed most of this would be applicable. I've given a lot of thought to bungies and webbing regarding how I might prevent this as well.

Just got a new rig in and figured I'd give it a shot and see, and came away quite surprised. I didn't have an issue with the top hole as expected with a new rig especially since I like a snug chest strap, but I definitely expected to be able to slip out of the bottom hole and was extremely surprised to not be able to, even after several minutes of trying with the main out of the container.

After determining what was preventing my rig from coming off, I have to give a shout out to the design by RI of the Curv, as I believe that to be the difference. Looking at the MLW, it attaches to the container several inches in from the side of the container on the back which is exactly the point that was catching and unable to pass beyond my armpits. It almost fits more like a belt rather than moving straight back from the hips. I was still able to easily slide the leg straps to roughly my knees, however getting the container over my head wasn't possible.

I have been a Vector 3 fan for a long time, and haven't tried this on a properly fitted Vector, so can't comment there, but definitely noticed this design difference and how much more snugly this fit on my back.

This may also be due in part to the fact that it's a new rig and who knows, after a few hundred jumps this may loosen up a bit. I'd be curious to know if any other owners of new Curv's notice anything similar.

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VTmotoMike08

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Maybe I'm missing something but what the heck is a little bungee going to actually accomplish? I have the thing and it's like a shoelace...how could that save my 'ass' from going through, literally.



My understanding is that it keeps the properly adjusted leg straps from sliding towards your knees where you would be more likely to fall thru. Of course it is not a weight bearing piece, it just keeps everything in the right position.



It's worth pointing out (apologies for further thread necromancy) that this is what the chest strap is for, as well. It's definitely not a load-bearing part of the rig, which can come as a surprise to a lot of people. It's just there to keep the main lift web, which is what really supports you, in the right place around your body.
--
"I'll tell you how all skydivers are judged, . They are judged by the laws of physics." - kkeenan

"You jump out, pull the string and either live or die. What's there to be good at?

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I was jumping a seriously jumped out ancient Wonderhog 2 that hung on me like a prostitute's nighty. As well as almost needing to duct tape it on it would beat me black and blue on every jump. I went straight from that to a new, custom made, Quasar II and just couldn't believe the difference. I knew it would be better of course, but not how much better. Comfortable opening and the chest straps form a sort of harness. Not that I'd try it but I suspect you could jump this rig without a chest strap and be ok.

Edit: and no, that is not a recommendation! Always fasten your chest strap then double check and check again just before exit.
Seriously, I was just making a point.

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Maybe its time for a rethink from the mfg's on the construction of the chest strap...

It wouldn't be hard to design it as load bearing for such a formation. Chest rings make that easier for this design/intent/use change.

Fail-safe routing design of the webbing at the main lift web would be an easy change from the old sandwich design. With that, I'd guess that the weak point is the PS70101-1 friction adapter (or its 1" little brother) . But if people are willing to have the heavier PS22019-1, that weak link could be removed from the picture (not sure if there is a 1" heavy duty).


I'd be curious to have the mfg's chime in here to discuss their current chest strap options and their strength to handle a second jumper hanging from it during say an inadvertant deployment... (worst? case scenario?)

Anyone?
JW
Always remember that some clouds are harder than others...

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