theonlyski 3 #1 March 21, 2012 Looking at the Sigma manual, it states: QuoteVideo and assumption of risk agreement: The student must view the waiver video and sign the waiver. Be careful to abide by all United Parachute Technologies & USPA provisions in the exemption, such as student’s age, etc... If the video machine is out-of-order or the tape is lost, it is the same as if the aircraft is inoperative. NO ONE may make a Tandem jump without seeing the waiver video and signing the waiver. Now, someone with a shit ton of tandems has told me that the waivers and video aren't required, something about the exemption having changed? This person told me that there are a few DZ's that don't show the video or make the stu sign the tandem rig waiver. Discuss?"I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890 I'm an asshole, and I approve this message Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RIGGER160 0 #2 March 21, 2012 In the tandem course I was told they have to watch it but when our old disk started skipping we couldn't find the video anywhere on UPTs website or anywhere else for that matter. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theonlyski 3 #3 March 21, 2012 It's listed here: http://www.unitedparachutetechnologies.com/PDF/LIST-006_Sigma_MicroSigma_Tandem_Price_List.pdf (DVD, “WAIVER” 25) Just curious what everyone else is thinking/saying about it. Thanks again for those pics the other day!"I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890 I'm an asshole, and I approve this message Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydived19006 4 #4 March 21, 2012 In my opinion, the waiver video helps to cover your ass, and the DZO along with the rig manufacturer. It wouldn't hurt to show the RWS video when using Strong gear.Experience is what you get when you thought you were going to get something else. AC DZ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wolfriverjoe 1,495 #5 March 21, 2012 MY understanding is that the video is purely a requirment of UPT. Other companies (Strong in particular) don't have it. I was part of a joint effort for a fundraiser deal where we had both Strong and Sigma rigs. We made everyone watch the video because there was no certainty who was going with whom at that point. My further understanding is that the secondary Tandem waiver (the one over and above the standard DZ waiver) isn't mandatory anymore . It's the one that states the tandem rig is considered an "experimental aircraft" and that it is operating under an exemtion to the rules that prohibit commercial operation of experimental aircraft. But even though the tandem exemption was lifted (it was, wasn't it??) and written into the regs, we still had people read and sign it just to add another layer. I certainly could be wrong in my understanding. If anyone knows differently, please let me know."There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy "~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billbooth 10 #6 March 21, 2012 The UPT Tandem "Waiver Tape" AND the written "Assumption of Risk Agreement" are MANDITORY, as per the UPT User Agreement, for each and every tandem jump made in the US, and any other country where a lawsuit might result from a tandem injury or fatality. It is utterly stupid to do tandem without the protections both the tape and the written agreement afford. You are also reminded that no one under the legal age to enter contracts, usually 18, but in some states older, are permitted to make a tandem in the US. Without these agreements there would probably be NO tandem jumping in the United States. I can't believe this question is even being asked. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theonlyski 3 #7 March 21, 2012 QuoteThe UPT Tandem "Waiver Tape" AND the written "Assumption of Risk Agreement" are MANDITORY, as per the UPT User Agreement, for each and every tandem jump made in the US, and any other country where a lawsuit might result from a tandem injury or fatality. It is utterly stupid to do tandem without the protections both the tape and the written agreement afford. You are also reminded that no one under the legal age to enter contracts, usually 18, but in some states older, are permitted to make a tandem in the US. Without these agreements there would probably be NO tandem jumping in the United States. I can't believe this question is even being asked. Thanks. This actually came from someone that I just bought a Micro Sigma from. Seemed to be wrong, but I know when I did my first tandem 4 years ago on a Sigma, I had to fill out the waiver and watch the video. I hope to be attending the Sigma and USPA TI course next week, just trying to gather all of the information (my DZ uses Strong dual hawks, which I've never really liked) so I can adjust our manifesting to keep legal with a Sigma in the rotation. By the way, this is my second UPT rig- love them! Thanks for all your hard work!"I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890 I'm an asshole, and I approve this message Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Snowwhite 0 #8 March 22, 2012 I guess it really doesn't matter what WE think does it? It really only matters what some lawyers, in some courtroom, with some jury's think, right? Which is easier, 15 minutes of video, or 3 years and countless dollars of litigation?skydiveTaylorville.org freefallbeth@yahoo.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #9 March 22, 2012 QuoteWithout these agreements there would probably be NO tandem jumping in the United States. I can't believe this question is even being asked. You and me both. It's different day Bill. Every asshat out there thinks they know it all.....---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Krip 2 #10 March 22, 2012 QuoteThe UPT Tandem "Waiver Tape" AND the written "Assumption of Risk Agreement" are MANDITORY, as per the UPT User Agreement, for each and every tandem jump made in the US, and any other country where a lawsuit might result from a tandem injury or fatality. It is utterly stupid to do tandem without the protections both the tape and the written agreement afford. You are also reminded that no one under the legal age to enter contracts, usually 18, but in some states older, are permitted to make a tandem in the US. Without these agreements there would probably be NO tandem jumping in the United States. I can't believe this question is even being asked. Mr Booth Thank you for correcting another "DZ rumor".One Jump Wonder Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpectreDriver 0 #11 March 23, 2012 Is the video being discussed the same one I remember from the early 90's?? What's the easiest way to get a copy of this video on DVD format? I can't find my VHS player anymore. Think wife may have sold it in a garage sale.... (The player, not the video.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
matthewcline 0 #12 March 23, 2012 QuoteThe UPT Tandem "Waiver Tape" AND the written "Assumption of Risk Agreement" are MANDITORY, as per the UPT User Agreement, for each and every tandem jump made in the US, and any other country where a lawsuit might result from a tandem injury or fatality. It is utterly stupid to do tandem without the protections both the tape and the written agreement afford. You are also reminded that no one under the legal age to enter contracts, usually 18, but in some states older, are permitted to make a tandem in the US. Without these agreements there would probably be NO tandem jumping in the United States. I can't believe this question is even being asked. Bill, This thread was started by a young prospective Candidate. He has been given incorrect info from one of your current T-I's and another poster has admitted his DZ didn't use the video and they are a UPT Sigma DZ, with a new USPA T-I/E ( one can presume a UPT I/E as well) on staff. You need to press harder in the enforcement of your end user agreements. I remember signing mine, even for the used rig, and following it, we never stood in court as defendants together, did we? I wold also suggest you make the UPT T-I's sign the same agreement. Ski started the thread because of the false information that is getting out there, that info is coming from rated individuals. Lets also face that the UPT web page could be a bit more current and easier to navigate for this CORRECT info. If I wasn't already banned there, i just learned of another DZ i will avoid and not recommend. MattAn Instructors first concern is student safety. So, start being safe, first!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiverDZO 0 #13 March 24, 2012 The authorative voice of reason. Thank God!Charlie Gittins MEI-I, CFI-I Sigma TI; AFF-I FAA Senior Rigger Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theonlyski 3 #14 March 24, 2012 Quote You and me both. It's different day Bill. Every asshat out there thinks they know it all..... Referring to me as said asshat? I think that's an incorrect statement to say the least. I came here asking for clarification, not just taking the word of someone as the law. Now that Bill has commented on it, I have it straight from the horses mouth. I also don't think I know it all... far from it actually."I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890 I'm an asshole, and I approve this message Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theonlyski 3 #15 March 24, 2012 If only there were some sort of examiner seminar to bring this up in, coming up soon. Thanks again Matt, for all the help along the way. Still wish I could've taken the course with you... No slack!"I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890 I'm an asshole, and I approve this message Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #16 March 24, 2012 QuoteQuote You and me both. It's different day Bill. Every asshat out there thinks they know it all..... Referring to me as said asshat? I think that's an incorrect statement to say the least. I came here asking for clarification, not just taking the word of someone as the law. Now that Bill has commented on it, I have it straight from the horses mouth. I also don't think I know it all... far from it actually. Was not referring to you at all, and my apologies to you if it seemed that way. If anyone I might have been referring to the person who gave you bogus information, but more to the general populous of skydivers that talks out of their asses rather than using their brains to ask questions from those that obviously have the correct answers.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
matthewcline 0 #17 March 24, 2012 Quote If only there were some sort of examiner seminar to bring this up in, coming up soon. Thanks again Matt, for all the help along the way. Still wish I could've taken the course with you... No slack! "No Slack", is that other battalion, you asshat. You will be fine, and will be in great hands with Bram. MattAn Instructors first concern is student safety. So, start being safe, first!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RIGGER160 0 #18 March 25, 2012 Matt i'm trying to figure out who you are refering to becuase I sure as hell hope you dont mean me. No where in my post did I say we did not show the tandem waiver DVD, it's not nice to make shit up P.S. Even though you are an asshat for saying the above statement, I still invite you out to our wonderfull DZ. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
matthewcline 0 #19 March 25, 2012 Quote Matt i'm trying to figure out who you are refering to becuase I sure as hell hope you dont mean me. No where in my post did I say we did not show the tandem waiver DVD, it's not nice to make shit up P.S. Even though you are an asshat for saying the above statement, I still invite you out to our wonderfull DZ. No thanks. Even if I wasn't banned, I won't lower myself to your level. What you call wonderful, is not too me. MattAn Instructors first concern is student safety. So, start being safe, first!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
