bfd 0 #1 March 6, 2008 just to let everyone know, and its about time, i called and confirmed that the tunnel in Niagara Falls Ontario is opening this afternoon. the website isnt quite updated yet, but you can call in for reservations. 905-356-9764 www.niagarafreefall.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Skyhighbird 0 #2 March 6, 2008 Quote just to let everyone know, and its about time, i called and confirmed that the tunnel in Niagara Falls Ontario is opening this afternoon. the website isnt quite updated yet, but you can call in for reservations. 905-356-9764 www.niagarafreefall.com FINALLY!!!!!!! Wanna Hug It Out, Lets Hug It Out..Bitch! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites frost 1 #3 March 6, 2008 So this is going to be a Las Vegas style tunnel... How much value for a training skydiver can a tunnel like this really have? This is an amusement ride at best, not a serious training tool. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites bfd 0 #4 March 6, 2008 who cares if it is just a vegas style "ride" as you put it.... any airtime for someone just learning is better than no time at all. especially right now when its 32º F and they`re calling for more snow Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites flyangel2 2 #5 March 6, 2008 Quote So this is going to be a Las Vegas style tunnel... How much value for a training skydiver can a tunnel like this really have? This is an amusement ride at best, not a serious training tool. Funny, when Bill Kitchen built and designed the SVO tunnel, it was for tourist and an amusement ride. Too bad skydivers didn't use it and the idea didn't catch onMay your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds. - Edward Abbey Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites frost 1 #6 March 6, 2008 I care. I am still "just learning". And i want to learn in a quality environment. Newer flyers who want to learn properly and efficiently should care too. If you weigh >200 lbs you'd be wasting your time and money trying to do quality freefly (or even RW) in weaker tunnels like SVO or Las Vegas or this new windtunnel without super baggy suits and making it harder to learn properly. May be SVO is stronger now, i dont know, but when i was there 5-6 years ago trying to sit was a pain and i was wearing TWO of their suits. I was bouncing up an down on the net. Point is: You want to have an amusement ride? Cool! here is your thing. Not putting it down, it just isnt for me, i wouldnt spend money there. You want to have a tunnel where you can actually learn to fly your body? Make the trip to NH or NC or another strong wind tunnel. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites diablopilot 2 #7 March 6, 2008 There has been something getting lost with the higher power tunnels. Sure they have opened up new areas of tunnel flying possible, but there is a creativity to flying that is getting lost when people are not challenged to fly at slower speeds. ---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites djd 0 #8 March 6, 2008 Quote There has been something getting lost with the higher power tunnels. Sure they have opened up new areas of tunnel flying possible, but there is a creativity to flying that is getting lost when people are not challenged to fly at slower speeds. Well said..... I flew in vegas and had the most fun i have ever had in any wind tunnel my cheeks hurt when i came out i was laughing that much.... to say you cant learn in these tunnels is just plane wrong, in a fast tunnel you learn to cheat body positions so much that it sometimes doesnt matter about body position as you will always have enough lift...in a slower tunnel you really learn to open up all yr body flying positions .... the tunnel community is a pretty small one in reality lets all kiss and make up.....lol Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites shug 0 #9 March 7, 2008 If you know fast air your a tunnel flyer, if you know slow air then your a tunnel flyer. If you love this stuff like no other and can have fun regardless, well than, your a tunnel rat... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Shaner 0 #10 March 7, 2008 OK, so what unreal level of freeflying are you doing??? It's not serious no!! Ask people like Ray Kubiak(aka shug) John Suiter, Norman Kent, or even Ramsey Kent, Mike Michigan, Olav Zipser, and the flyboyz, one of them may give you an answer you might respect. Your right, my 16 years was a total waste in those damn things. Maybe someday we'll all get stableOn Another note, HAVE AT IT NIAGRA FREEFAL!! Flying is better than typing, give it a try Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites likearock 1 #11 March 7, 2008 Quote There has been something getting lost with the higher power tunnels. Sure they have opened up new areas of tunnel flying possible, but there is a creativity to flying that is getting lost when people are not challenged to fly at slower speeds. Quite true. But it can be wastefully frustrating to try and learn sitfly when the speeds are low. Once you've learned it though, that's the time to challenge yourself at slower speeds. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites avenfoto 0 #12 March 7, 2008 QuoteSo this is going to be a Las Vegas style tunnel... How much value for a training skydiver can a tunnel like this really have? This is an amusement ride at best, not a serious training tool. common misconception. with the advent of bigger and faster skyventure-style tunnels, many skydivers have adhered to this train of thought. they are, however, wrong, unfortunately. ANY tunnel is a valuable training tool, and you can learn valuable lessons form each type. If you can learn to fly well at the slower airspeeds, or in slightly turbulent air, then you should excel when there is plenty of air or lift. Tunnels are an interesting machine. Instead of just falling faster, as you would in the sky, you must manipulate your desired body position to the available airspeed. This, in turn, creates a more knowledgeable bodyflier, and better skydiver. Not to mention, some of the funnest tunnels, are some of the "amusement ride at best" types. It is interesting, and dare I say, amusing, to watch the "skygod" types, with the " I have x amount of jumps, I can fly anything" get in the "crappy" tunnels and flail to no end. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites avenfoto 0 #13 March 7, 2008 QuoteNewer flyers who want to learn properly and efficiently should care too. Wrong again. If you take a new flier to the "crappy" tunnels first, they will learn to maximize lift, regardless of suit. When they graduate to a "better" tunnel , they should excel, having already learned how to generate lift from every available surface... look at the best tunnelfliers on the planet... see where they came from... (hint it starts with f, and ends with lyaway...) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites likearock 1 #14 March 8, 2008 QuoteQuoteNewer flyers who want to learn properly and efficiently should care too. Wrong again. If you take a new flier to the "crappy" tunnels first, they will learn to maximize lift, regardless of suit. When they graduate to a "better" tunnel , they should excel, having already learned how to generate lift from every available surface... look at the best tunnelfliers on the planet... see where they came from... That's the point though. They are the best tunnefliers on the planet. I'm sure some of them can learn headdown at 120 mph. For those of us who are mere mortals (and may be carrying a little extra weight), it can be very frustrating and expensive to try to master freefly positions at that speed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites NewClearSports 0 #15 March 8, 2008 Hi All, I'm one of the new instructors for Niagara Freefall. I am a freeflyer with about 1250 jumps, Profecient in Head down, sit, stand. I was on the Canadian HD Record. I love flying this tunnel, and well I can honestly say I suck compared to the other guys with previous tunnel experience. I would also like to say, I'm not a natural talent, I had to work hard at getting good in the sky, and it is a little hard to not be able to bust out big moves in the tunnel, but I have realized it is a brand new game. The new game flying the tunnel. Here it is - You have to fly in only 12FT diameter of air, and about 20 FT of Height, and most importantly fly with a fixed "fall rate" or air speed. (In the sky we can pick wichever speed suits us) This is alot harder than you might think!!! Really. I have such a new respect for tunnel fliers. These guys are Bad Ass! They are so dialed in it will blow your mind. When your in the sky and you do a flip, you think your down the tube, but when you go in the tunnel you will quickly realize your not! One last thing I like about this tunnel, is those SOFT CUSHONS. I know without a doubt, that I would have hurt myseft big time had I been in a Skyventure. Its IS alot of FUN, You WILL LEARN alot about flying your body. Hope to see you at the tunnel! Open today (Saturday, March 8th, 08) From 2pm to 7pm. Grand opening day. Walk in's are wellcome. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites diablopilot 2 #16 March 8, 2008 QuoteOne last thing I like about this tunnel, is those SOFT CUSHONS. I know without a doubt, that I would have hurt myseft big time had I been in a Skyventure. Probably not. The training and spotting methods are different to avoid that.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites likearock 1 #17 March 8, 2008 Good to hear the are experienced freefliers at your tunnel. I may just make it up there some day to try some of that low speed sit. I'm guessing only the real superstars can even think about going headdown there, am I right? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites brettski74 0 #18 March 8, 2008 QuoteNewer flyers who want to learn properly and efficiently should care too. I have to disagree with that statement, also. My first experience in a wind tunnel was at Aerodium in Latvia, which is a similar flying experience to the Niagara tunnel based on what I can make out. At the time, I was a "newer flyer" with only about 70 jumps. During the late autumn I got close to an hour of time in that tunnel but no jumps due to weather. While I was flying in the tunnel, I was often frustrated by the limitations imposed by wind speed and turbulence, by the big baggy suit I had to wear and was convinced that while it was some fun, I wasn't learning much about skydiving. That January, I went to Eloy and was surprised at how much better I seemed to be flying in the sky compared to my last jumps. Obviously, I learned a lot about bodyflight by flying in that tunnel without realizing it at the time. I doubt it's going to be useful as a training tool for serious 4-way teams and you should have different learning expectations in different types of tunnels, but to say that it has no training value for skydivers is narrow-minded and/or shortsighted. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites bfd 0 #19 March 8, 2008 Well....just got back from the tunnel in Niagara Falls. First several minutes of tunnel time ever. I have no complaints at all. Seeing as i`m a new skydiver with only several jumps under my belt, i cant really say whether or not this tunnel was good or bad....i`m not in a position to judge. But an hour ago, i was in a good relaxed boxman position and was practicing and working on bodyflight and stability. Concidering that its -5ºC and snowing like hell, i think thats pretty cool. Sure it may not be a skyventure tunnel, and i dont really care whether it is or not, i was still flying..... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites shug 0 #20 March 9, 2008 Word Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites NewClearSports 0 #21 March 9, 2008 Hey bfd. Do you remember your instructors name? Did you fly your skydiving suit or one of the tunnel suits? Glad to here you had fun! Cheers Mike Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites bfd 0 #22 March 9, 2008 i was in one of the tunnel suits...blue ones...it was myself and another younger guy that went together. I dont remember the instructors name, but he was a fairly skinny fellow, about 6 feet tall, very short dark brown hair, had a slight accent....could have been french or something, and he was wearing a med. blue skydive suit. i think he was wearing a red neck warmer too when he was in the tunnel. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites gimpboogie 0 #23 March 9, 2008 Quote who cares if it is just a vegas style "ride" as you put it.... any airtime for someone just learning is better than no time at all. especially right now when its 32º F and they`re calling for more snow 1st, please understand that my words are from that of a complete novice and someone who will use the tunnel as "someone just learning". I live in Ontario, merely 6 hrs from the Niagara tunnel. I'm going to NH tunnel with my coach (he has been skydiving a long time, his licence # is D472 and he is a world record holder so I trust his opinion and experience). He told me directly that the tunnel in Niagara is not good for skydivers. It would not be good for a novice. Perhaps someone who is not intending to use it as a learning tool, either a tourist or perhaps a skydiver bringing a friend/family in there for a "fun" time would be a good purpose for that tunnel. To me it is critical there is clean air, air flow is consistent and simulates FF as close as possible. Being complete novice, if I was to go into a tunnel such as the one in Niagara, I would be fooled by that experience and my AFF free fall will certainly be nothing like that tunnel experience. I would stretch to guess that going into a tunnel which does not give me a free fall experience as close as the real thing would be potentially dangerous. For I would not be prepared for "the real thing". Personally, I too would love to go to the one in Niagara, it is half the distance to travel, in Canada (no border crossing hassles... I'm still waiting for my passport to come) and propably the trip will be much less costly, giving me more $ for "the real thing"... but skydiving is not a sport where i would skimp on anything as important as these first critical dives that are coming up. Once I have been diving for a while, I'm sure I would not even think of the Niagara tunnel as an option... sorry for the long winded approach, but what i really wanted to get across that ESPECIALLY a beginner should be learning in the most optimum conditions... skydiving is not forgiving for too many 'oops" moments.. To become active member in the Bonus Days Club you must very narrowly escape eternal freefall ... one exciting time.)-Pat Works Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites NewClearSports 0 #24 March 9, 2008 That would be Sam from South Africa. Was your friend a jumper as well, or was he a 1st time flier? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites bfd 0 #25 March 9, 2008 it was my friends first time flying... and he loved it, wants to do it again Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 Next Page 1 of 2 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. 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Skyhighbird 0 #2 March 6, 2008 Quote just to let everyone know, and its about time, i called and confirmed that the tunnel in Niagara Falls Ontario is opening this afternoon. the website isnt quite updated yet, but you can call in for reservations. 905-356-9764 www.niagarafreefall.com FINALLY!!!!!!! Wanna Hug It Out, Lets Hug It Out..Bitch! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
frost 1 #3 March 6, 2008 So this is going to be a Las Vegas style tunnel... How much value for a training skydiver can a tunnel like this really have? This is an amusement ride at best, not a serious training tool. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bfd 0 #4 March 6, 2008 who cares if it is just a vegas style "ride" as you put it.... any airtime for someone just learning is better than no time at all. especially right now when its 32º F and they`re calling for more snow Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyangel2 2 #5 March 6, 2008 Quote So this is going to be a Las Vegas style tunnel... How much value for a training skydiver can a tunnel like this really have? This is an amusement ride at best, not a serious training tool. Funny, when Bill Kitchen built and designed the SVO tunnel, it was for tourist and an amusement ride. Too bad skydivers didn't use it and the idea didn't catch onMay your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds. - Edward Abbey Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
frost 1 #6 March 6, 2008 I care. I am still "just learning". And i want to learn in a quality environment. Newer flyers who want to learn properly and efficiently should care too. If you weigh >200 lbs you'd be wasting your time and money trying to do quality freefly (or even RW) in weaker tunnels like SVO or Las Vegas or this new windtunnel without super baggy suits and making it harder to learn properly. May be SVO is stronger now, i dont know, but when i was there 5-6 years ago trying to sit was a pain and i was wearing TWO of their suits. I was bouncing up an down on the net. Point is: You want to have an amusement ride? Cool! here is your thing. Not putting it down, it just isnt for me, i wouldnt spend money there. You want to have a tunnel where you can actually learn to fly your body? Make the trip to NH or NC or another strong wind tunnel. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #7 March 6, 2008 There has been something getting lost with the higher power tunnels. Sure they have opened up new areas of tunnel flying possible, but there is a creativity to flying that is getting lost when people are not challenged to fly at slower speeds. ---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
djd 0 #8 March 6, 2008 Quote There has been something getting lost with the higher power tunnels. Sure they have opened up new areas of tunnel flying possible, but there is a creativity to flying that is getting lost when people are not challenged to fly at slower speeds. Well said..... I flew in vegas and had the most fun i have ever had in any wind tunnel my cheeks hurt when i came out i was laughing that much.... to say you cant learn in these tunnels is just plane wrong, in a fast tunnel you learn to cheat body positions so much that it sometimes doesnt matter about body position as you will always have enough lift...in a slower tunnel you really learn to open up all yr body flying positions .... the tunnel community is a pretty small one in reality lets all kiss and make up.....lol Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shug 0 #9 March 7, 2008 If you know fast air your a tunnel flyer, if you know slow air then your a tunnel flyer. If you love this stuff like no other and can have fun regardless, well than, your a tunnel rat... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shaner 0 #10 March 7, 2008 OK, so what unreal level of freeflying are you doing??? It's not serious no!! Ask people like Ray Kubiak(aka shug) John Suiter, Norman Kent, or even Ramsey Kent, Mike Michigan, Olav Zipser, and the flyboyz, one of them may give you an answer you might respect. Your right, my 16 years was a total waste in those damn things. Maybe someday we'll all get stableOn Another note, HAVE AT IT NIAGRA FREEFAL!! Flying is better than typing, give it a try Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
likearock 1 #11 March 7, 2008 Quote There has been something getting lost with the higher power tunnels. Sure they have opened up new areas of tunnel flying possible, but there is a creativity to flying that is getting lost when people are not challenged to fly at slower speeds. Quite true. But it can be wastefully frustrating to try and learn sitfly when the speeds are low. Once you've learned it though, that's the time to challenge yourself at slower speeds. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
avenfoto 0 #12 March 7, 2008 QuoteSo this is going to be a Las Vegas style tunnel... How much value for a training skydiver can a tunnel like this really have? This is an amusement ride at best, not a serious training tool. common misconception. with the advent of bigger and faster skyventure-style tunnels, many skydivers have adhered to this train of thought. they are, however, wrong, unfortunately. ANY tunnel is a valuable training tool, and you can learn valuable lessons form each type. If you can learn to fly well at the slower airspeeds, or in slightly turbulent air, then you should excel when there is plenty of air or lift. Tunnels are an interesting machine. Instead of just falling faster, as you would in the sky, you must manipulate your desired body position to the available airspeed. This, in turn, creates a more knowledgeable bodyflier, and better skydiver. Not to mention, some of the funnest tunnels, are some of the "amusement ride at best" types. It is interesting, and dare I say, amusing, to watch the "skygod" types, with the " I have x amount of jumps, I can fly anything" get in the "crappy" tunnels and flail to no end. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
avenfoto 0 #13 March 7, 2008 QuoteNewer flyers who want to learn properly and efficiently should care too. Wrong again. If you take a new flier to the "crappy" tunnels first, they will learn to maximize lift, regardless of suit. When they graduate to a "better" tunnel , they should excel, having already learned how to generate lift from every available surface... look at the best tunnelfliers on the planet... see where they came from... (hint it starts with f, and ends with lyaway...) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
likearock 1 #14 March 8, 2008 QuoteQuoteNewer flyers who want to learn properly and efficiently should care too. Wrong again. If you take a new flier to the "crappy" tunnels first, they will learn to maximize lift, regardless of suit. When they graduate to a "better" tunnel , they should excel, having already learned how to generate lift from every available surface... look at the best tunnelfliers on the planet... see where they came from... That's the point though. They are the best tunnefliers on the planet. I'm sure some of them can learn headdown at 120 mph. For those of us who are mere mortals (and may be carrying a little extra weight), it can be very frustrating and expensive to try to master freefly positions at that speed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NewClearSports 0 #15 March 8, 2008 Hi All, I'm one of the new instructors for Niagara Freefall. I am a freeflyer with about 1250 jumps, Profecient in Head down, sit, stand. I was on the Canadian HD Record. I love flying this tunnel, and well I can honestly say I suck compared to the other guys with previous tunnel experience. I would also like to say, I'm not a natural talent, I had to work hard at getting good in the sky, and it is a little hard to not be able to bust out big moves in the tunnel, but I have realized it is a brand new game. The new game flying the tunnel. Here it is - You have to fly in only 12FT diameter of air, and about 20 FT of Height, and most importantly fly with a fixed "fall rate" or air speed. (In the sky we can pick wichever speed suits us) This is alot harder than you might think!!! Really. I have such a new respect for tunnel fliers. These guys are Bad Ass! They are so dialed in it will blow your mind. When your in the sky and you do a flip, you think your down the tube, but when you go in the tunnel you will quickly realize your not! One last thing I like about this tunnel, is those SOFT CUSHONS. I know without a doubt, that I would have hurt myseft big time had I been in a Skyventure. Its IS alot of FUN, You WILL LEARN alot about flying your body. Hope to see you at the tunnel! Open today (Saturday, March 8th, 08) From 2pm to 7pm. Grand opening day. Walk in's are wellcome. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #16 March 8, 2008 QuoteOne last thing I like about this tunnel, is those SOFT CUSHONS. I know without a doubt, that I would have hurt myseft big time had I been in a Skyventure. Probably not. The training and spotting methods are different to avoid that.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
likearock 1 #17 March 8, 2008 Good to hear the are experienced freefliers at your tunnel. I may just make it up there some day to try some of that low speed sit. I'm guessing only the real superstars can even think about going headdown there, am I right? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brettski74 0 #18 March 8, 2008 QuoteNewer flyers who want to learn properly and efficiently should care too. I have to disagree with that statement, also. My first experience in a wind tunnel was at Aerodium in Latvia, which is a similar flying experience to the Niagara tunnel based on what I can make out. At the time, I was a "newer flyer" with only about 70 jumps. During the late autumn I got close to an hour of time in that tunnel but no jumps due to weather. While I was flying in the tunnel, I was often frustrated by the limitations imposed by wind speed and turbulence, by the big baggy suit I had to wear and was convinced that while it was some fun, I wasn't learning much about skydiving. That January, I went to Eloy and was surprised at how much better I seemed to be flying in the sky compared to my last jumps. Obviously, I learned a lot about bodyflight by flying in that tunnel without realizing it at the time. I doubt it's going to be useful as a training tool for serious 4-way teams and you should have different learning expectations in different types of tunnels, but to say that it has no training value for skydivers is narrow-minded and/or shortsighted. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bfd 0 #19 March 8, 2008 Well....just got back from the tunnel in Niagara Falls. First several minutes of tunnel time ever. I have no complaints at all. Seeing as i`m a new skydiver with only several jumps under my belt, i cant really say whether or not this tunnel was good or bad....i`m not in a position to judge. But an hour ago, i was in a good relaxed boxman position and was practicing and working on bodyflight and stability. Concidering that its -5ºC and snowing like hell, i think thats pretty cool. Sure it may not be a skyventure tunnel, and i dont really care whether it is or not, i was still flying..... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NewClearSports 0 #21 March 9, 2008 Hey bfd. Do you remember your instructors name? Did you fly your skydiving suit or one of the tunnel suits? Glad to here you had fun! Cheers Mike Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bfd 0 #22 March 9, 2008 i was in one of the tunnel suits...blue ones...it was myself and another younger guy that went together. I dont remember the instructors name, but he was a fairly skinny fellow, about 6 feet tall, very short dark brown hair, had a slight accent....could have been french or something, and he was wearing a med. blue skydive suit. i think he was wearing a red neck warmer too when he was in the tunnel. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gimpboogie 0 #23 March 9, 2008 Quote who cares if it is just a vegas style "ride" as you put it.... any airtime for someone just learning is better than no time at all. especially right now when its 32º F and they`re calling for more snow 1st, please understand that my words are from that of a complete novice and someone who will use the tunnel as "someone just learning". I live in Ontario, merely 6 hrs from the Niagara tunnel. I'm going to NH tunnel with my coach (he has been skydiving a long time, his licence # is D472 and he is a world record holder so I trust his opinion and experience). He told me directly that the tunnel in Niagara is not good for skydivers. It would not be good for a novice. Perhaps someone who is not intending to use it as a learning tool, either a tourist or perhaps a skydiver bringing a friend/family in there for a "fun" time would be a good purpose for that tunnel. To me it is critical there is clean air, air flow is consistent and simulates FF as close as possible. Being complete novice, if I was to go into a tunnel such as the one in Niagara, I would be fooled by that experience and my AFF free fall will certainly be nothing like that tunnel experience. I would stretch to guess that going into a tunnel which does not give me a free fall experience as close as the real thing would be potentially dangerous. For I would not be prepared for "the real thing". Personally, I too would love to go to the one in Niagara, it is half the distance to travel, in Canada (no border crossing hassles... I'm still waiting for my passport to come) and propably the trip will be much less costly, giving me more $ for "the real thing"... but skydiving is not a sport where i would skimp on anything as important as these first critical dives that are coming up. Once I have been diving for a while, I'm sure I would not even think of the Niagara tunnel as an option... sorry for the long winded approach, but what i really wanted to get across that ESPECIALLY a beginner should be learning in the most optimum conditions... skydiving is not forgiving for too many 'oops" moments.. To become active member in the Bonus Days Club you must very narrowly escape eternal freefall ... one exciting time.)-Pat Works Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NewClearSports 0 #24 March 9, 2008 That would be Sam from South Africa. Was your friend a jumper as well, or was he a 1st time flier? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bfd 0 #25 March 9, 2008 it was my friends first time flying... and he loved it, wants to do it again Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
