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jonathan.newman

Anyone using a truly "Integrated Student Program"?

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SecondRound

Staying on track to integrate my training. Took 4 minutes of tunnel time at Perris Valley today. First question out of the tunnel was can I do more time and then added two more minutes. I came away with six minutes of freefall and a DVD to share with my coaches back at Wissota. Tyler was an awesome coach and the results were obvious on the DVD. I feel much more confident as I move to freefall after my S/L jumps.


added link to videos of both sessions http://youtu.be/YcuWJOwq2wc

http://youtu.be/IDf4IV7HfNI

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That's awsome dude!!!


Perhaps you could help out the original OP with some of your recent experiences, (fresh eyes) and your own questions about what is the most optimum thing and how to learn? I think you asked eailier on about getting on the phone, internet as compared with takeing the time for a visit? Etc?

C

Like how far would you drive to get coaching or wind tunnel time; "I feel much more confident," this is soo important for safety and fun!
But what do I know, "I only have one tandem jump."

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ChrisD

That's awsome dude!!!


Perhaps you could help out the original OP with some of your recent experiences, (fresh eyes) and your own questions about what is the most optimum thing and how to learn? I think you asked eailier on about getting on the phone, internet as compared with takeing the time for a visit? Etc?

C
Did 3 AFF jumps this weekend. Free fall is different with a rig on, but there is a definite confidence factor in having enough tunnel time to have a sense of holding a heading. Still, sorting out a poised exit from a C182 and getting to terminal does take getting used to.
As far as how far to travel, I drive two hours each way because I feel that strongly about the quality of the coaching I am getting. Travel to a tunnel is a good investment, but not as important as the coaching at the DZ. I was fortunate in that my regular vacation took me to the Perris Valley area, but if I had to do it over, I would make a special trip somewhere with a tunnel if there was any practical way to swing it.
One last thought, those 6 round jumps I made many years ago have made me appreciate modern gear. My worst landing so far was no worse than an average round landing and most have been much easier. My only problem has been that my landing gear switch is still spring loaded to the PLF position so I am still rolling some pretty gentle landinds.

Like how far would you drive to get coaching or wind tunnel time; "I feel much more confident," this is soo important for safety and fun!

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I've taught pure IAD and pure AFF, and also tandem & iad progressions to single JM AFF. I'm cool with the concept of 1 working tandem > IAD thru PRCPs > AFF to solo status, and could easily be convinced to ditch the tandem jump and just go IAD > AFF (although I do believe there's some value in a *working* tandem). These progression methods are far and away my preferred method of instruction.

That said, going back and forth between the programs is a bit fuzzier in the real world than it is on paper. If you have a student who has done a few IAD PRCPs and a couple single JM AFF jumps, at what point would you put him back in the IAD world? Clear and pull? 10 second delay? And what sense is there in program that says if we keep you in AFF, you must do three more jumps with an AFF instructor, but if we switch you to IAD, you can solo freefall right now? If we back them up a level to make them demonstrate progressively longer freefalls, we're just milking them for money and making the student process last longer than it should.

For this reason, I haven't ever transitioned a student on AFF back to the IAD realm except to let them knock out their C&P on a low altitude day.

Edit: I take that back. I have (rarely) had students in AFF phase do an IAD style jump, but not so much for "progression" purposes as to simply deal with a student-specific issue, e.g. canopy control sucking and weather not conducive to AFF, or freefall sucking (multiple failures) indicative of a good candidate for the "slower" progression of IAD or S/L style methods.

Blues,
Dave
"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!"
(drink Mountain Dew)

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[q

That said, going back and forth between the programs is a bit fuzzier in the real world than it is on paper. If you have a student who has done a few IAD PRCPs and a couple single JM AFF jumps, at what point would you put him back in the IAD world? Clear and pull? 10 second delay? And what sense is there in program that says if we keep you in AFF, you must do three more jumps with an AFF instructor, but if we switch you to IAD, you can solo freefall right now? If we back them up a level to make them demonstrate progressively longer freefalls, we're just milking them for money and making the student process last longer than it should.





My personal experience was one of moving between methods along with some tunnel time. What worked for me was having the same gifted instructor who used the various methods to teach specific skills. I feel that my learning was enhanced by a building block approach which included clear objectives and coaching. It definitely is not a one size fits all approach and does require a gifted Instructor who uses techniques the way a good chef uses ingredients. I just hope I don't end up a half baked Skydiver.

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What about a student that comes from another DZ, mid progression, and they have 4-5 AFF jumps, and your DZ only provides S/L progression. This is when I feel the ISP really proves valuable, as long as the previous instructors have kept track of which Category of Training they were on. Then it is as simple as opening the SIM and looking at transition training. you just pick up where they left off.

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SecondRound

My personal experience was one of moving between methods along with some tunnel time. What worked for me was having the same gifted instructor who used the various methods to teach specific skills. I feel that my learning was enhanced by a building block approach which included clear objectives and coaching. It definitely is not a one size fits all approach and does require a gifted Instructor who uses techniques the way a good chef uses ingredients. I just hope I don't end up a half baked Skydiver.



Yeah, that's a fun way to do things when you have all the ratings and a good student. It isn't without risks though, as it can be tempting to get a bit off script, and diligence is required to make sure no learning objectives are lost in the shuffle. Also, it works best when the student sticks with one instructor, or a set of similarly-minded instructors who can easily communicate with each other. Otherwise, it can be difficult for a subsequent instructor to pick up where his predecessors left off. The ISP helps a lot in this regard, by allowing some standardization of non-standard progressions. Without it, explaining such a "dynamic" series of jumps to a more rigid instructor when a student goes south to finish their training in the off-season is annoying.

Blues,
Dave
"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!"
(drink Mountain Dew)

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