18 18
quade

DB Cooper

Recommended Posts

5 minutes ago, Robert99 said:

Hayden reportedly had to go to court to get his remaining back pack parachute from the FBI.  Also, the FBI reportedly paid Hayden about $40 for the parachute that Cooper jumped with.  So just exactly what is your problem here.

Finally, you answer the question and demonstrate that you have no idea what we have been discussing. You don't see a problem because you have no idea what is going on.

If you had actually read my post.. the packing cards DON'T match. The packing card found in the pocket of the back chute left on the plane doesn't match the card in the chute returned to Hayden. That means Cooper did not jump with either of Hayden's chutes. So, which chute did Cooper jump with???

 

I am not going to waste any more time explaining this to you, the info has already been posted in this thread or better you can do your own homework. 

From your last few posts you have so much messed up that I am not interested in unwinding for you.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
(edited)
3 hours ago, Robert99 said:

Hayden reportedly had to go to court to get his remaining back pack parachute from the FBI.  Also, the FBI reportedly paid Hayden about $40 for the parachute that Cooper jumped with.  So just exactly what is your problem here.

Hayden did not go to court. I did a two-hour interview with him on this parachute 'thing'. He says NWA contacted Boeing Flight Service, and they contacted HIM. He volunteered his two bailout rigs, but not for free. He specified to NWA they were to be a RENTAL only and he wanted them returned if possible. He said he did get a check later from NWA for the rental, but NWA bailed on buying him new chutes, because NWA said the FBI was holding all remaining chutes as evidence, and NWA refused to pay a rental on those chutes forever. 

So...Hayden dismissed the whole thing for a long time. But after some years, he got tired of it, especially after 2008 when the case went heavy in the news and on social media (like Dropzone) again. He paid a lawyer (no court) to send an official letter to the FBI asking his chute be returned. When I asked him about the OTHER chute, he said, "Well, that's the one Cooper jumped with. No use asking for it back now..." (And who would pay anyway? I think NWA was out of business by then.) 

I'm just quoting what HE said. His story on chute ownership matched exactly what Agent John Detlor's report said, and Hayden didn't know until after the interview that I had that report sitting right in front of me. So I tended to believe his version of events. Why would he only ask for one chute to be returned if the FBI was holding two, right?

Two FBI agents met up with him in a parking lot and returned the chute to him, the one he later donated to the Washington State History Museum. He said they were very curt about it, and hardly said a word. 

EDIT: I said Hayden got a lawyer to write a letter, and this happened AFTER 2008. My bad. I do NOT know when Hayden actually had his chute returned to him, because I did not ask. I assumed it was around that time because Bruce Smith and I interviewed Hayden close to the same time. I called up Hayden for additional questions AFTER I saw the post by Bruce, the one on Mountain News with pictures. But I never asked Hayden exactly when he arranged for the chute's return. The rest of my post is accurate. 

Edited by RobertMBlevins

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, FLYJACK said:

Finally, you answer the question and demonstrate that you have no idea what we have been discussing. You don't see a problem because you have no idea what is going on.

If you had actually read my post.. the packing cards DON'T match. The packing card found in the pocket of the back chute left on the plane doesn't match the card in the chute returned to Hayden. That means Cooper did not jump with either of Hayden's chutes. So, which chute did Cooper jump with???

 

I am not going to waste any more time explaining this to you, the info has already been posted in this thread or better you can do your own homework. 

From your last few posts you have so much messed up that I am not interested in unwinding for you.

 

 

Flyjack, just for the record how about posting a picture of or listing the source for the following:

1.  The packing card for Hayden's parachute that was returned to him.

2.  The packing card for Hayden's parachute that went missing.

3.  The packing card for the parachute that was left on the airplane.    

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
(edited)
8 hours ago, Robert99 said:

Flyjack, just for the record how about posting a picture of or listing the source for the following:

1.  The packing card for Hayden's parachute that was returned to him.

2.  The packing card for Hayden's parachute that went missing.

3.  The packing card for the parachute that was left on the airplane.    

Go find it yourself, I have posted it and explained it many many times,,, just search this forum or go find it yourself.

You are ignorant, rude and have disrespected me for a long time,, the problem ROBERT99 is you.. you are incapable of reason.

I explained repeatedly the difference between packets and bundles and the confusion and misunderstanding it created,, YOU and GEORGER could not understand a simple fact and from that position of ignorance you attacked and ridiculed me.. YOU STILL DON'T GET IT.

 

So, forgive me if I don't give a crap.. I don't have the patience to unwind the misinformation, inconsistencies and sheer conjecture you have expressed as fact in your recent comments here and elsewhere. You have hardened opinions backed up with and elixir of arrogance and ignorance.

 

DO YOUR OWN HOMEWORK...

 

 

 

 

Edited by FLYJACK

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am trying to sort the conflicting information about the McChord parachutes... other than Tina's interview statement, McChord chutes are not mentioned in the FBI files.

 

1) Cooper asked for chutes from McChord? Himmelsbach.

2) Cooper rejected chutes from McChord and requested sport chutes? When and how, conflicts with 4.

3) Cooper chose the military chute? Conflicts with 2 

4) Tina told Cooper the chutes were coming from McChord, Cooper noted the distance to McCord? Cooper thought they were coming from McChord.

 

If Cooper thought they were coming from McChord then when did he reject them and how?.. how can he be expecting them from McChord (fact) then reject them for sport chutes.

IMO, something is being hidden here.... it makes no sense.

I don't think Cooper did reject them.. it is made up. For some reason the FBI decided to obtained the chutes elsewhere and told Tina/Cooper they were coming from McChord as Cooper had requested. 

 

So, why did the FBI not get chutes from McChord? The static line chute excuse is a red herring. Surely, McChord would have bailout rigs.

 

Are there any other sources of information??

 

sources..

FBI part 26 #8883

In one of the conversations she had with him, she re-
marked that the parachutes were coming from McChord Air Force
Base at which time he remarked that it was only about twenty
minutes from McChord to the Seattle-Tacoma airport and which
was apparently an accurate estimate., 
 

Himmelsbach..

"He specifically asked for parachutes from nearby McChord Air Force Base, showing some familiarity with the area.”

 

Tina interview.. FBI files

While waiting on the ground at Sea-Tac for the parachutes, the hijacker became annoyed and Miss MUCKLOW told him the parachutes were coming from McChord. The hi-jacker then said, “McChord is only 20 minutes from Tacoma; it doesn't take that long."

 

News report..

Cooper at first had ordered two parachutes, which were brought out from McChord. They were the military type, which must be opened wtth a static cord linked to the plane. It would open the chute after western Washington state to a 200-foot fall. 
Cooper then ordered two more. Airline officials did not say whether Cooper specific the type, but the second set were sports models, obtained at a skydiving field east os Seattle. A sports ‘chute would allow a man to free-fall several thousand feet before opening the parachute.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
(edited)
12 hours ago, RobertMBlevins said:

 

EDIT: I said Hayden got a lawyer to write a letter, and this happened AFTER 2008. My bad. I do NOT know when Hayden actually had his chute returned to him, because I did not ask. I assumed it was around that time because Bruce Smith and I interviewed Hayden close to the same time. I called up Hayden for additional questions AFTER I saw the post by Bruce, the one on Mountain News with pictures. But I never asked Hayden exactly when he arranged for the chute's return. The rest of my post is accurate. 

Hayden got his chute back in 1975... He only requested one because he thought the FBI only had one (of his) left.

parachutereturnedhayden.jpeg.771ca91174665e96eef315f3eb255481.jpeg

haydenaskchutes.jpeg.41feb60965d79860bc6c7417f65fa424.jpeg

 

Edited by FLYJACK

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It is a myth that Cooper removed the packing card..

Cooper was handed chute "instructions" from Tina and threw them away.. this got conflated ,, there is no source or evidence that Cooper removed a packing card. The packing card for the back chute left on the plane was found inside the pocket.

 

377 quote..

"Ckret told me ages ago that he was unaware of any witness statements about Cooper locating and reading rigger data cards on any of the rigs."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 hours ago, Andrade1812 said:

It's available on Kindle and in hard copy on Amazon. If you pm me I can dropship a copy to you. I used to give out the pdf version but I'm currently editing another edition, so I've stopped doing that until I finish the revisions.

I know of a show that you could go on to promote your updated book.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
(edited)

Here it is...

Emerick picked out the front chutes himself...

So, how did Emerick pick a dummy chute with an X on it?? Sound reasonable?

https://www.newspapers.com/newspage/21027116/

"According to Linn Emrick, who supplied one of the four parachutes handed over to the hijacker, one of the two parachutes apparently used in the jump was inoperable. Emrick, of Sky Sports Inc., Issauah, Wash., said the 'chute was for ground practice only and the canopy was sewn shut. "I didn't know It when I went over, and picked it out," he said,"

https://www.newspapers.com/newspage/435301054/

One of two missing parachutes would not have worked, it was disclosed yesterday. Linn Emrick, a sport parachutist who supplied it, said he inadvertently picked a "ground training" chute when airport officials asked him for one to supplement two chutes furnished by the Air Force. The other supplementary chute was supplied by Renton Aviation. Its manufacturer said it would "work fine.”

 

Edited by FLYJACK

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
(edited)

Okay, stop. Stop NOW. Hold the train, let the signal light stay red...

Two from McChord AFB. 
Two from Norman Hayden.
Two from Linn Emerick. 
Two more from Earl Cossey. 

We have now doubled the number of chutes supposedly delivered to the airport...the only thing that seems to be consistent in all of these reports, interviews, files, etc. is that only four chutes were actually provided to the hijacker. In other words, Mucklow only dragged four chutes on board the jet. This situation is pretty confusing to all parties I would say. 

Look...asking people to search previous posts can be done, I will admit. But one time a few years ago I got the semi-intelligent idea of trying to create an entire PDF (including all links and pictures, using Adobe Acrobat 10) of this thread. (The idea was to preserve all links, pictures, files, and written posts in case this thread was ever deleted permanently.)

Well...it didn't work and the main reason is if you tried to convert this entire thread from 2008 until now into a single paper document, it would take over 10 full reams of paper to do so. A ream of paper is a standard office-size box of copy paper with 5,000 sheets in each ream box. :shockedcat: The Adobe worked on this problem several times for 24 hours or more each time...and failed to produce a final product. It was just beyond the capacity of any reasonable computer or Adobe program at that time. Imagine five big boxes of paper sitting on the floor next to you, each with ten standard blocks of 500 sheets in each box...and then ANOTHER five boxes sitting on top of them. 

This gives you an idea of what people have to do in order to search out posts here. In other words, it can be done, but sometimes it ain't easy. 

Edited by RobertMBlevins

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
(edited)
31 minutes ago, RobertMBlevins said:

Okay, stop. Stop NOW. Hold the train, let the signal light stay red...

Two from McChord AFB. 
Two from Norman Hayden.
Two from Linn Emerick. 
Two more from Earl Cossey. 

We have now doubled the number of chutes supposedly delivered to the airport...the only thing that seems to be consistent in all of these reports, interviews, files, etc. is that only four chutes were actually provided to the hijacker. In other words, Mucklow only dragged four chutes on board the jet. This situation is pretty confusing to all parties I would say. 

No, step back,

Four delivered to plane.. two fronts and two backs.

 

Two backs sent in from Hayden confirmed.

Two fronts from Sky Sports/Emerick confirmed.

 

Hayden's two accounted for based on packing cards.. What did Cooper use?

One of Hayden's left on plane..

 

Cooper used one from either..

Two from McChord (unconfirmed).

Two from Cossey (suspected).

Edited by FLYJACK

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, FLYJACK said:

So, how did Emerick pick a dummy chute with an X on it?? Sound reasonable?

According to that info, it sounds like Emrick only supplied one of the front-mounts, the other coming from a Renton Aviation.

But to the question, that doesn't sound reasonable to me at all. Emrick was a skydiver (was he an instructor?) and the drop zone owner. He set up the dz and owned all the student gear. He would absolutely know the difference between all the rigs and training aids. For him to say he didn't realize it at the time sounds like a cover-yer-ass statement.

Pure speculation here... I speculated earlier that perhaps the dummy reserve was given to Cooper to discourage him from making Tina jump. But Emrick probably didn't know anything about that situation at the time. Same for the later notion of Cooper becoming something of a folk hero. Emrick is asked for a chute to give to a hijacker in an era when there were a fair amount of politically motivated hijackings done by terrorist types. Perhaps he gives that dummy reserve because it's the cheapest, most disposable thing he's got, and who gives a crap if it doesn't work and the guy goes in.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
(edited)
Quote

 

Cooper used one from either..

Two from McChord (unconfirmed).

Two from Cossey (suspected).

 

Two from Hayden

Two from Sky Sports

Cossey claims he had chutes sent either from his house, or from Sky Sports...but by cab. We already know Linn Emerick provided two to the WA State Patrol, so NO CAB INVOLVED. Cossey claims a cab. That means four chutes between Emerick and Cossey. 

Two more from Hayden

Two more from McChord. That makes EIGHT parachutes. Someone has not been truthful. 

I just got the phone number sent to me of the guy from Sky Sports. I will call him tomorrow. I would do it now but it's the dinner hour and I need tonight to run up questions for him in advance. 

If you have any of your own questions, try to keep them simple and post them up by tomorrow at 10AM Pacific (Seattle time). I will add them to the list. Calling him in the early afternoon tomorrow, no work scheduled for me tomorrow and the guy is retired. I will ask his permission to record the call, otherwise I will take notes. If he allows a recording, I will do a transcript. If he doesn't, I will list the questions I asked and provide his answers to them. 

Edited by RobertMBlevins

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, dudeman17 said:

According to that info, it sounds like Emrick only supplied one of the front-mounts, the other coming from a Renton Aviation.

But to the question, that doesn't sound reasonable to me at all. Emrick was a skydiver (was he an instructor?) and the drop zone owner. He set up the dz and owned all the student gear. He would absolutely know the difference between all the rigs and training aids. For him to say he didn't realize it at the time sounds like a cover-yer-ass statement.

Pure speculation here... I speculated earlier that perhaps the dummy reserve was given to Cooper to discourage him from making Tina jump. But Emrick probably didn't know anything about that situation at the time. Same for the later notion of Cooper becoming something of a folk hero. Emrick is asked for a chute to give to a hijacker in an era when there were a fair amount of politically motivated hijackings done by terrorist types. Perhaps he gives that dummy reserve because it's the cheapest, most disposable thing he's got, and who gives a crap if it doesn't work and the guy goes in.

I'm thinking some of the same things as you dudeman.  I've said it before and will repeat it. Storing a dummy chute anywhere near a real chute is akin to storing cyanide tablets in your medicine cabinet next to your aspirin.  You just don't do it.

Something about a dummy chute smells bad to me.  Sending Cooper a dummy chute is not something out of the realm of possibility.  The FBI had snipers ready to shoot him, why not try to kill him with a dummy chute, or like dudeman said, try to make it so he can't take a hostage?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
(edited)
1 hour ago, CooperNWO305 said:

I'm thinking some of the same things as you dudeman.  I've said it before and will repeat it. Storing a dummy chute anywhere near a real chute is akin to storing cyanide tablets in your medicine cabinet next to your aspirin.  You just don't do it.

Something about a dummy chute smells bad to me.  Sending Cooper a dummy chute is not something out of the realm of possibility.  The FBI had snipers ready to shoot him, why not try to kill him with a dummy chute, or like dudeman said, try to make it so he can't take a hostage?

Maybe it was a delay tactic.. with the X on it they thought Cooper would notice, realize it was a dummy and perhaps request a replacement. They didn't expect him to use it.

Hard to believe Emerick would grab a dummy by mistake..

The good front reserve was also from Sky Sports..

From CitizenSleuths..

FBI Transcript: “ORANGE CHEST PARACHUTE, 24 FOOT RIP STOP, TYPE SN DA5853912. DATE OF MANUFACTURE 10/59. OWNER-SEATTLE SKY SPORTS, ISSAQUAH, WASHINGTON INSPECTED AND REPACKED 9/16/71 BY E.J. COSSEY. THREE SHROUD CORDS CUT”

 

Edited by FLYJACK

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
(edited)

From Bruce Smith interview with Hayden..

"In addition, Barry supports Norman’s claim that as far as they know, both back chutes were identical.  In fact, Norman seemed a bit dismayed about bureaucratic in-accuracies when I read aloud the FBI description of the two back parachutes and their many differences."

 

FBI..

 1.  Civilian luxury type, tan soft cotton material outside, 26 foot while canopy inside.  The parachute inside is a military parachute.  The parachute has a  foam pad cushion and a fray mark down the rib on the back from rubbing on metal.

 2.  A military backpack parachute, standard olive drab green on outside, a 28 foot white canopy on inside.  He (Norman Hayden) stated that this parachute also has a foam pad cushion.

 

Hayden also said he never spoke to the FBI about the chutes though they quote him in the files.

The FBI descriptions match Cossey's description of his two chutes, not Hayden's.

Cossey claimed a Pioneer and a modified NB8..

 

 

Edited by FLYJACK

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here is my take on this putting together the incomplete and seemingly conflicting info we have so far.. it may change if more info can be found.

 

Cooper asks for two military back chutes from McChord. 

Cooper updates his demand to 4 chutes - two back and two chest reserve chutes. 

McChord is contacted but for some reason McChord can't get the right chutes. (maybe the FBI wanted back chutes with no D rings for the chest reserve and dummy so they couldn't be used)

Hayden is contacted, he sends by cab two identical back chutes, both packed by Cossey May 21, 1971. 

Cossey is contacted, he sends in a Pioneer and an NB8 from his home by cab. 

Linn Emerick is contacted at Issaquah Sky Sports he grabs a front reserve and a dummy front reserve, the police transport them. Both packed by Cossey. 

The FBI tells Crew/Tina chutes are coming from McChord, Cooper still believes chutes coming from McChord. 

Chutes arrive at a staging area and are mingled, the two front reserve chutes, Hayden's Pioneer and one of Cossey's chutes are sent to the plane. 

Cooper tosses instructions sent with chutes.. he did not remove/look at the packing cards.

Cooper leaves behind a Pioneer back chute and the good front reserve.

Cooper jumps with one a back chute. The front dummy goes missing.

Cossey is told by the FBI that a Pioneer was left behind, he assumes Cooper used his modified NB8.

(The Pioneer left behind was Hayden's based on the packing date, Cossey thought his Pioneer was left behind)

Hayden believing Cooper used his chute requested the one left behind on the plane, it was returned to him in 1975.

The packing card for the chute Hayden received back doesn't match the packing card found in the pocket of chute Cooper left on the plane. Both of Hayden's chutes are accounted for after the hijacking. Hayden claimed both his chutes were identical. The FBI description of the chutes matches Cossey's description of his chutes, not Hayden's.

 

 

Cooper used one of Cossey's back chutes.. He assumed it was the NB8 based on the fact that a Pioneer was left behind which he thought was his other chute.. it was Hayden's.

----------------

Cossey may have messed with reporters, perhaps he was instructed by the FBI to hold back some info but I really doubt he spent decades lying to the FBI, a serious felony easily exposed by them. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
(edited)

First...stop believing everything you read by Bruce Smith. He sometimes embellishes the truth a bit, as they say. He also turns on people he interviews if he doesn't get out of them what he thinks he 'deserves'. He has outright LIED saying I threatened him at the last Ariel Cooper Celebration, when in reality I was busy cooking for over a hundred people. He has showed up at my door uninvited and pounded on it demanding answers to this or that...while 100% absolutely KNOWING I was off on a camping trip in the Olympics. (How did he know? He acknowledged the comment I made on Mountain News just prior to the trip that I would be up there that week.) He scared the shit out of Gayla (she was sleeping on the couch when he came to the door) and it would not be a good thing for him should he do that a second time. Let's leave it at that. 

On a side note, let's not forget that Smith is a follower of the Biggest Religious Scam in the Northwest, and claims he's been existentially abducted by aliens, not once, but several times. He lives alone in a tiny trailer, near their HQ, and the one time I got worried about him and did a welfare check...he lied to everyone about the circumstances of that.

Give me a BREAK. ¬¬

Then he insults Gayla and says she's old and homely. Gayla is a former Miss Vista, CA, runs her own successful business, and here is a recent picture below of both she and her mother. She is well over sixty in the picture. Her mom is a bit more than eighty. You figure it out. 

The bottom line is that if you are looking for credibility in the Cooper case, there are SOME things you can say are acceptable from Bruce. But he is inconsistent at best. 

Let's move on to Earl Cossey...

gaylaAndMom.jpg.49428eabe1b199bc9eff9e0a0e7803f3.jpg

Cossey didn't just 'mess with reporters'. He told the FBI and anyone else who would listen that the Amboy chute discovered back in 2008 could NOT be Cooper's because he had looked at it, and that it was made of silk and not nylon. "Like the ones I gave Cooper," he said. Total baloney. Chute was not made of silk. A simple test with a Bic lighter would have determined that. The date on the chute shows it was made during a time there was virtually NO silk in the United States at that time, i.e. the end of World War 2, a time where nylon was the primary ingredient for parachutes because almost all silk had been coming from Japan. Why would Cossey do this? One good reason *might* be that if he actually identified a certain chute as being Cooper's, eventually real ownership would be established, and it might be discovered he was BS'ing both the FBI and the media for decades. 

What we have here is a conflict between Cossey and Norman Hayden. Both men claim to have sent more or less the same two chutes to SeaTac Airport. Yet...it is only Norman's version of events that actually appears in the known FBI records, aka the Agent John Detlor report. As far as Cossey possibly bulls$*&tting the FBI and the media, the FBI isn't going to prosecute him for anything for doing that. HE was not being investigated, or charged with anything. They would simply blow him off if they didn't believe him. 

I will definitely get to the bottom of some of these issues tomorrow. As I said, if you have any questions you want answered when I make that phone call...post them now (or by tomorrow noon) or forever hold your peace. 

Edited by RobertMBlevins

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bruce's interview with Hayden is solid, he quoted Hayden and published it..

You have no evidence anything in that interview is false or you would have pointed it out,, attacking somebody's cred in general isn't a good argument when you can't show a falsehood. What is important in that interview are the statements by Hayden.

My take fits all the evidence we have, it may not be exact but it is close..

 

You make a serious error, repeatedly, there is NO conflict between Hayden and Cossey. Their stories are compatible from each of their perspectives at the time.. Neither knows if their chutes went on the plane.. they both assumed.

You actually think the FBI doesn't care if a major witness lies in a high profile case for decades undermining the case.. seriously.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
(edited)
34 minutes ago, FLYJACK said:

Bruce's interview with Hayden is solid, he quoted Hayden and published it..

You have no evidence anything in that interview is false or you would have pointed it out,, attacking somebody's cred in general isn't a good argument when you can't show a falsehood. What is important in that interview are the statements by Hayden.

My take fits all the evidence we have, it may not be exact but it is close..

You make a serious error, repeatedly, there is NO conflict between Hayden and Cossey. Their stories are compatible from each of their perspectives at the time.. Neither knows if their chutes went on the plane.. they both assumed.

You actually think the FBI doesn't care if a major witness lies in a high profile case for decades undermining the case.. seriously.

Your take on the evidence depends on the credibility of BOTH Bruce Smith, AND Earl Cossey. Both of them are proven to have either lied multiple times (Smith), or gone public with at least one major thing in the case that is absolutely not true. (Cossey and the Amboy chute)

Lots of folks either lied, or simply BS'd the FBI during their investigation of the Cooper case. The baloney was so thick sometimes coming from different witnesses that you would need wings to stay above it. None of them were prosecuted, even though some witnesses blamed their own friends, acquaintances, or family members for the hijacking. 

One thing you notice about Cossey is that after the Amboy chute fiasco, the FBI never really consulted him again about anything Cooper. Maybe they finally figured him out about five minutes after they dumped that chute in his driveway for examination. Also notice there are no official FBI records stating that Cossey provided any chutes to the hijacker. During all those years they went to him occasionally for this or that, he was about the only guy they had who COULD identify any chutes discovered. They probably knew he BS'd the media occasionally about ownership and "I sent two to the airport by cab," but they chose to ignore it as harmless. Besides, he was the only guy they had for ID of chutes. 

The more likely story is that after Amboy...they just put out to the media a general statement that the Amboy chute wasn't Cooper's with a flimsy 'by a preponderance of the evidence...,' without mentioning Cossey's baloney silk claim...and gave up on him for good. 

I did watch the video you posted of Emerick's stepdaughter. Okay, that's fine. I want to talk directly to a guy who worked at Sky Sports at the time of the hijacking, and afterward...and who was in a position of authority there. Trust me. I will get to the bottom of things as long as this person has a good memory. He is already aware I will be contacting him, and what it is all about. 

 

Edited by RobertMBlevins
'stepdaughter' not stepfather.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, RobertMBlevins said:

Two from Hayden

Two from Sky Sports

Cossey claims he had chutes sent either from his house, or from Sky Sports...but by cab. We already know Linn Emerick provided two to the WA State Patrol, so NO CAB INVOLVED. Cossey claims a cab. That means four chutes between Emerick and Cossey. 

Two more from Hayden

Two more from McChord. That makes EIGHT parachutes. Someone has not been truthful. 

I just got the phone number sent to me of the guy from Sky Sports. I will call him tomorrow. I would do it now but it's the dinner hour and I need tonight to run up questions for him in advance. 

If you have any of your own questions, try to keep them simple and post them up by tomorrow at 10AM Pacific (Seattle time). I will add them to the list. Calling him in the early afternoon tomorrow, no work scheduled for me tomorrow and the guy is retired. I will ask his permission to record the call, otherwise I will take notes. If he allows a recording, I will do a transcript. If he doesn't, I will list the questions I asked and provide his answers to them. 

Could you ask if he remembers a very big guy that everyone called "Bear"?  He was a person heavily involved in the skydiving crowd at that time. He may have had some involvement with the chutes related to Cooper.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
(edited)
10 hours ago, RobertMBlevins said:

Your take on the evidence depends on the credibility of BOTH Bruce Smith, AND Earl Cossey. Both of them are proven to have either lied multiple times (Smith), or gone public with at least one major thing in the case that is absolutely not true. (Cossey and the Amboy chute)

Actually, no it doesn't whatsoever. It helps sort it out, but it doesn't rely on it. 

The key evidence is the packing cards not matching proving Cooper didn't take either of Hayden's chutes. No way around that. Dismissing Cossey and Bruce doesn't make any difference.

If he didn't take either of Hayden's chutes...  to distill your argument.. he took one of Hayden's because Cossey and Bruce are not credible and Hayden is,, that isn't an argument, it is ridiculous. So, if he didn't take one of Hayden's and in your opinion didn't take one of Cossey's then what did Cooper jump with?? Rejecting Cossey's chute isn't an argument that resolves this.. Attacking Cossey and Bruce's interview is a straw-man. 

I really find dismissing Bruce's interview, especially quotes from Hayden as false without any evidence completely reckless and even irrational. Much of that interview is backed up by the evidence. None is inconsistent.

The Amboy chute has nothing to do with this. We don't know why Cossey said what he said, there may have been a reason for it we are unaware of..

The context we have to understand is the perspectives of Cossey and Hayden at the time,, neither had any knowledge of each other or the chutes after they sent them in, they are expressing their opinions, their assumptions not facts. It isn't a matter of one is correct and the other is lying. Both are expressing their perception that doesn't mean either is lying.

Edited by FLYJACK

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, haggarknew said:

Could you ask if he remembers a very big guy that everyone called "Bear"?  He was a person heavily involved in the skydiving crowd at that time. He may have had some involvement with the chutes related to Cooper.

What do you know of Bear, and how?

PM me if you prefer.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, FLYJACK said:

Actually, no it doesn't whatsoever. It helps sort it out, but it doesn't rely on it. 

The key evidence is the packing cards not matching proving Cooper didn't take either of Hayden's chutes. No way around that. Dismissing Cossey and Bruce doesn't make any difference.

If he didn't take either of Hayden's chutes...  to distill your argument.. he took one of Hayden's because Cossey and Bruce are not credible and Hayden is,, that isn't an argument, it is ridiculous. So, if he didn't take one of Hayden's and in your opinion didn't take one of Cossey's then what did Cooper jump with?? Rejecting Cossey's chute isn't an argument that resolves this.. Attacking Cossey and Bruce's interview is a straw-man. 

I really find dismissing Bruce's interview, especially quotes from Hayden as false without any evidence completely reckless and even irrational. Much of that interview is backed up by the evidence. None is inconsistent.

The Amboy chute has nothing to do with this. We don't know why Cossey said what he said, there may have been a reason for it we are unaware of..

The context we have to understand is the perspectives of Cossey and Hayden at the time,, neither had any knowledge of each other or the chutes after they sent them in, they are expressing their opinions, their assumptions not facts. It isn't a matter of one is correct and the other is lying. Both are expressing their perception that doesn't mean either is lying.

One thing to remember is that Cooper put on the harness/chute quickly and with ease, and did not need any instructions.  He has been accused of doing things haphazardly, but this part of the hijacking does not indicate someone who was winging it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

18 18