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DB Cooper

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16 hours ago, FLYJACK said:

Didn't say they were..

Carr's case knowledge hasn't moved in over a decade.. like yours..

The Cooper case is in a Cooper traffic jam. A literal stand off. Until that is solved, nothing can or will happen. And you are part of the traffic jam. You wont relent or move your damned car! My guess is, something will have to move it for you! The road block isnt going to fix itself. Attitudes is how and why it happened in the first place!  Nothing I can do about it - Im just a spectator.

Communication about the Cooper case has broken down completely.

Flyjack, you may think you have more case-knowledge than anyone else, but the fact is there is no way on Earth to test it!  That much is abundantly clear. The case has become nothing more than one person's speculation heaped on the next persons, with no way to resolve anything. The word for this is: gridlock. The competing forces that started back in 2008 have reached gridlock.

When you run out of food for whatever reason, Simon says: go to the store !

 

Edited by georger
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29 minutes ago, georger said:

The Cooper case is in a Cooper traffic jam. A literal stand off. Until that is solved, nothing can or will happen. And you are part of the traffic jam. You wont relent or move your damned car! My guess is, something will have to move it for you! The road block isnt going to fix itself. Attitudes is how and why it happened in the first place!  Nothing I can do about it - Im just a spectator.

Communication about the Cooper case has broken down completely.

Flyjack, you may think you have more case-knowledge than anyone else, but the fact is there is no way on Earth to test it!  That much is abundantly clear. The case has become nothing more than one person's speculation heaped on the next persons, with no way to resolve anything. The word for this is: gridlock. The competing forces that started back in 2008 have reached gridlock.

When you run out of food for whatever reason, Simon says: go to the store !

 

Not true,, things are and have been progressing just not publicly.

There is no traffic jam,, you have manufactured one to intellectualize your own perceptions..

You complain about it but do nothing yourself.

This is a very difficult case to fill in 50+ years later... there are blank spots that might never get resolved.

I don't care if you disagree, but when you lie you disrespect me, this forum and the case.

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7 hours ago, FLYJACK said:

Not true,, things are and have been progressing just not publicly.

There is no traffic jam,, you have manufactured one to intellectualize your own perceptions..

You complain about it but do nothing yourself.

This is a very difficult case to fill in 50+ years later... there are blank spots that might never get resolved.

I don't care if you disagree, but when you lie you disrespect me, this forum and the case.

Likewise, Im sure.

Whatever he said!  Any thoughts on how matter came into being and which Angel rules Earth? Can you divulge a name ? 

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May have been posted before, but it's the full scan of the Inflight NWO magazine for Nov-Dec 71. Pretty cool map inside of it.

https://northwestairlineshistory.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/11/NWA_mag_Passages_1971-11.pdf

Also, what is this about? I'm assuming they're referring to how you can adjust the height of the flame on those Bic type lighters. 

cig.png

Edited by olemisscub

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On 2/7/2023 at 9:16 PM, olemisscub said:

I asked an AI program to "show me the face of D.B. Cooper". Not bad 

 

coopface.jpg

Someone should develop a Cooper AI, train it with all the availble data (FBI files etc.) and let it determine what kind of personality Cooper was and if he survived the jump. A sort of Cooper ChatGPT.

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17 hours ago, randy233 said:

Someone should develop a Cooper AI, train it with all the availble data (FBI files etc.) and let it determine what kind of personality Cooper was and if he survived the jump. A sort of Cooper ChatGPT.

AI just processes curated data, garbage in garbage out,,,

The Cooper case issue is lack of solid data...

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18 hours ago, randy233 said:

Someone should develop a Cooper AI, train it with all the availble data (FBI files etc.) and let it determine what kind of personality Cooper was and if he survived the jump. A sort of Cooper ChatGPT.

The ChatGPT products I've seen are interesting from a novelty standpoint, but there are other products out there that are more focused on what we would be looking at. Asking a program to determine his personality is not much different than all of us speculating on his personality.  AI or any data process relies on the availability of data and access to the data.  DNA is a good example.  Availability of the DNA is an issue, as we don't know if it even exists.  Then comes the access to it, if it even does exist, followed by access to other data such as genealogy sites who have taken DNA samples.  Cooper's DNA is no good to us unless we can compare it to other DNA samples.  His DNA might tell us ethnicity, maybe likelihood of having certain illnesses, etc. But we really need a full DNA profile, then access to that, then access to other DNA profiles.

For me, AI would be great if we had availability of data from 1971 (which we really don't).  Time cards of every male in the country, credit card receipts (not common in 1971), medical records (not scanned likely), bank statements, tax records, purchases like a car, etc.  In 2023 you could put together quite a bit about a person if you had access to this data, because it does exist, but in 1971 the data just does not exist anymore.  Once you had all this, you could then match it up with males of certain ages, etc. and then really narrow down a suspect list.  You really don't need AI for it, as there are programs and people that do it now.

AI right now is no the easy button, and if it does become that way, then we will be in a scary world.

To Flyjack's point, right now it is garbage in/garbage out.

There may be one or two revolutionary finds still out there, but I'm not optimistic.  The hair sample and maybe DNA from a fingerprint lift are the two that come to mind. Right now we are all still gathering readily available information and speculating.  I do think with the right access, the FBI could narrow down suspects using the DNA on the tie, but that requires a lot of changes to our civil liberties, and that just is not going to happen. We may get lucky and have some family member come forward, but that hasn't' happened yet.

Edited by CooperNWO305

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14 minutes ago, CooperNWO305 said:

The ChatGPT products I've seen are interesting from a novelty standpoint, but there are other products out there that are more focused on what we would be looking at. Asking a program to determine his personality is not much different than all of us speculating on his personality.  AI or any data process relies on the availability of data and access to the data.  DNA is a good example.  Availability of the DNA is an issue, as we don't know if it even exists.  Then comes the access to it, if it even does exist, followed by access to other data such as genealogy sites who have taken DNA samples.  Cooper's DNA is no good to us unless we can compare it to other DNA samples.  His DNA might tell us ethnicity, maybe likelihood of having certain illnesses, etc. But we really need a full DNA profile, then access to that, then access to other DNA profiles.

For me, AI would be great if we had availability of data from 1971 (which we really don't).  Time cards of every male in the country, credit card receipts (not common in 1971), medical records (not scanned likely), bank statements, tax records, purchases like a car, etc.  In 2023 you could put together quite a bit about a person if you had access to this data, because it does exist, but in 1971 the data just does not exist anymore.  Once you had all this, you could then match it up with males of certain ages, etc. and then really narrow down a suspect list.  You really don't need AI for it, as there are programs and people that do it now.

AI right now is no the easy button, and if it does become that way, then we will be in a scary world.

To Flyjack's point, right now it is garbage in/garbage out.

There may be one or two revolutionary finds still out there, but I'm not optimistic.  The hair sample and maybe DNA from a fingerprint lift are the two that come to mind. Right now we are all still gathering readily available information and speculating.  I do think with the right access, the FBI could narrow down suspects using the DNA on the tie, but that requires a lot of changes to our civil liberties, and that just is not going to happen. We may get lucky and have some family member come forward, but that hasn't' happened yet.

A fun way to see AI in action and for a layman is to watch the show Person of Interest. It's been off the air for a while, and of course was for entertainment, but the concepts are there.  The other good one is the movie Terminator. :)  Hopefully I'll be long gone off this earth before we get to that.

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44 minutes ago, CooperNWO305 said:

The ChatGPT products I've seen are interesting from a novelty standpoint, but there are other products out there that are more focused on what we would be looking at. Asking a program to determine his personality is not much different than all of us speculating on his personality.  AI or any data process relies on the availability of data and access to the data.  DNA is a good example.  Availability of the DNA is an issue, as we don't know if it even exists.  Then comes the access to it, if it even does exist, followed by access to other data such as genealogy sites who have taken DNA samples.  Cooper's DNA is no good to us unless we can compare it to other DNA samples.  His DNA might tell us ethnicity, maybe likelihood of having certain illnesses, etc. But we really need a full DNA profile, then access to that, then access to other DNA profiles.

For me, AI would be great if we had availability of data from 1971 (which we really don't).  Time cards of every male in the country, credit card receipts (not common in 1971), medical records (not scanned likely), bank statements, tax records, purchases like a car, etc.  In 2023 you could put together quite a bit about a person if you had access to this data, because it does exist, but in 1971 the data just does not exist anymore.  Once you had all this, you could then match it up with males of certain ages, etc. and then really narrow down a suspect list.  You really don't need AI for it, as there are programs and people that do it now.

AI right now is no the easy button, and if it does become that way, then we will be in a scary world.

To Flyjack's point, right now it is garbage in/garbage out.

There may be one or two revolutionary finds still out there, but I'm not optimistic.  The hair sample and maybe DNA from a fingerprint lift are the two that come to mind. Right now we are all still gathering readily available information and speculating.  I do think with the right access, the FBI could narrow down suspects using the DNA on the tie, but that requires a lot of changes to our civil liberties, and that just is not going to happen. We may get lucky and have some family member come forward, but that hasn't' happened yet.

AI would indeed be a great instrument if we had data on missing persons, criminal records and militairy records from that period. Combining it with FBI files, psychology, Meteorology etc. and you have a very powerful tool.

This would obviously only work if law enforcement and the FBI makes this data availble for this purpose. This way you can let an AI determine a lot of things, even let it come up with potential suspects (presuming Cooper had a criminal history or militairy background).

ChatGPT is more than a novelty though. The DAN jailbreak removes all the limitations that ChatGPT now has and after that it becomes a much more powerful tool. I used the DAN jailbreak for a while and ChatGPT felt almost sentient at times.

ChatGPT isn't perfect yet but it's potential is mind blowing. We are only at the beginging of the AI revolution.

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3 minutes ago, randy233 said:

AI would indeed be a great instrument if we had data on missing persons, criminal records and militairy records from that period. Combining it with FBI files, psychology, Meteorology etc. and you have a very powerful tool.

This would obviously only work if law enforcement and the FBI makes this data availble for this purpose. This way you can let an AI determine a lot of things, even let it come up with potential suspects (presuming Cooper had a criminal history or militairy background).

ChatGPT is more than a novelty though. The DAN jailbreak removes all the limitations that ChatGPT now has and after that it becomes a much more powerful tool. I used the DAN jailbreak for a while and ChatGPT felt almost sentient at times.

ChatGPT isn't perfect yet but it's potential is mind blowing. We are only at the beginging of the AI revolution.

I agree it is more than a novelty but right now the public is mainly only seeing what is in the general news articles, which are talking about kids using it to write school essays (hardly a strategic issue in my mind).  Google seems a little rattled though.

Good point about criminal records too.  Although I don't see Cooper as having a record, we could still benefit from data that shows who was incarcerated at the time, hospital records could show that too for medical or psych issues. One of the Zodiac suspects related to a phone call on live TV was ruled out due to him being in a facility at the time of the murders, although I am a little hesitant to say that Cooper could not have left a facility in the area for a few days of furlough.

If Cooper did this today we would of course have a bunch of video, but even if we didn't, just using the data we've been chatting about would help catch him.

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Interesting article on the JonBenet Ramsey case, interesting in that it seems that this document shows the actual DNA markers for the family and the possible suspects.  One could not load this into a genealogy site, but I think it might be able to be used to verify if someone's DNA matched. Seems odd that this would be published.

 

https://www.foxnews.com/us/jonbenet-ramsey-case-newly-unearthed-documents-reveal-dna-did-not-match-key-players-early-unsolved-slaying

image.png.97e97f58dc1fba2ba2ced898af08db7e.png

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On 2/9/2023 at 11:37 AM, randy233 said:

AI would indeed be a great instrument if we had data on missing persons, criminal records and militairy records from that period. Combining it with FBI files, psychology, Meteorology etc. and you have a very powerful tool.

This would obviously only work if law enforcement and the FBI makes this data availble for this purpose. This way you can let an AI determine a lot of things, even let it come up with potential suspects (presuming Cooper had a criminal history or militairy background).

ChatGPT is more than a novelty though. The DAN jailbreak removes all the limitations that ChatGPT now has and after that it becomes a much more powerful tool. I used the DAN jailbreak for a while and ChatGPT felt almost sentient at times.

ChatGPT isn't perfect yet but it's potential is mind blowing. We are only at the beginging of the AI revolution.

AI could kill off the internet, not knowing if things posted are from real people or AI clones ! Your post could be an AI bot !

Is Flyjack an AI bot ?

Edited by georger

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1 hour ago, georger said:

AI could kill off the internet, not knowing if things posted are from real people or AI clones ! Your post could be an AI bot !

Is Flyjack an AI bot ?

Forget the Internet, AI will destroy the human race!

Maybe SETI and ChatGPT should join forces in the search for Cooper? ;)

Edited by randy233

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13 hours ago, FLYJACK said:

tit727.jpeg.793ecf9f4d47f2155fe82ab35c382d51.jpeg

This has been my precise gripe against the direction the tie particle analysis has sent the case. There is a very simple explanation for why the particles keep leaning toward aircraft-related substances. You have to rule that out first before running off to Pennsylvania. And yet there was not a single control item tested from an single aircraft. Hold a shirt under the ventilation system and test that. Hold an object near an open rear door sending all those particles through the air and test that. Rub the old skydiving rig against a piece of clothing and test that--those things were in all sorts of environments. Anything

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2 hours ago, Math of Insects said:

This has been my precise gripe against the direction the tie particle analysis has sent the case. There is a very simple explanation for why the particles keep leaning toward aircraft-related substances. You have to rule that out first before running off to Pennsylvania. And yet there was not a single control item tested from an single aircraft. Hold a shirt under the ventilation system and test that. Hold an object near an open rear door sending all those particles through the air and test that. Rub the old skydiving rig against a piece of clothing and test that--those things were in all sorts of environments. Anything

The Ti on the 727 was both pure Ti and alloyed.. 

Ideally, you can do control testing but in this 50+ year old case that isn't very realistic.. while I agree with your point, it isn't practical.

Some of the particles may have been picked up on the plane.. what is in a 727 cabin dust? or exposure to the engine with the bulkhead door open?? the air bleed system??

Edited by FLYJACK

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3 hours ago, FLYJACK said:

The Ti on the 727 was both pure Ti and alloyed.. 

Ideally, you can do control testing but in this 50+ year old case that isn't very realistic.. while I agree with your point, it isn't practical.

Some of the particles may have been picked up on the plane.. what is in a 727 cabin dust? or exposure to the engine with the bulkhead door open?? the air bleed system??

Right, but there's a lot of territory between, "That was 50 years ago" and "therefore nothing can be checked." Start with any item from any airplane today. If you don't find the particles, go backward. If you do, stop this silly line of inquiry.

Go swab an antique parachute pack. Or hell, even a current one. This would at least address the goose chase around labs in PA. If you DON'T find a similar profile, keep looking. If you do...bail. 

We all know where those particles are the most likely to have come from. Start at most likely and work backward, not vice versa. 

Edited by Math of Insects

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