DB Cooper

[olemisscub 160]

3 hours ago, Math of Insects said:

I recall someone knowledgable saying the profile basically revealed every substance on earth and that even the outliers could be explained as aspects of other things there, so it wasn't meaningful investigatorily. I don't remember who that was, though.
 

If, and it’s a big if, Tom determines those 3 TiSb particles are actually alloys and not random fuzzballs, then it’s really going to be difficult to claim this is a random conglomeration of chemicals and elements. A non-commercial Ti(highSb) alloy shouldn’t be on anyone’s clothing in the tie era.

[FLYJACK 456]

45 minutes ago, olemisscub said:

If, and it’s a big if, Tom determines those 3 TiSb particles are actually alloys and not random fuzzballs, then it’s really going to be difficult to claim this is a random conglomeration of chemicals and elements. A non-commercial Ti(highSb) alloy shouldn’t be on anyone’s clothing in the tie era.

Nonsense.. there is nothing in that patent that indicates these particles (if alloys) are exclusive..

There was lots of high tech stuff going on in the 60's, industrial, military, electronics, NASA and weapons..

The patent does not prove exclusivity. That is a fallacy.

 

 

Edited December 1, 2022 by FLYJACK

[Slim King 29]

11 hours ago, FLYJACK said:

You still won't answer some of your claims.. that seems key to deception.

Other than the unreliable tapes, what proof do you have that Reca/Peca either knew of Cossey, knew him personally or colluded with him.

and when did Reca/Peca leave his family and go to Wa and when did he return to Mi.

Obviously you haven't done your research. I can't spoon feed you what is already on the record.

Edited December 1, 2022 by Slim King

[Slim King 29]

10 hours ago, FLYJACK said:

I found lots of 95% Al, 5% Mg particles on the tie, this is called Magnalium and it comes in different ratio's but this ratio is softer and in powder form is primarily used in pyrotechnics, explosives, flares, rocket fuel.. In ratio's of more MG it is used to form airplane and auto parts. More Mg makes it more brittle.

All these particles (this pic a sample, not all) indicate powder form exposure.. 

It may be from the "bomb".. flares or a firework..

Earlier, I had posted a match for many of the particles, a hand held sparkler.. It produces bright yellow white sparks.

So, pyrotechnics is a big use, commercial, military or retail,, 

but I am looking for other uses..

 

So it could have been from the Road Flares used in the fake bomb....

[georger 94]

5 hours ago, Nicholas Broughton said:

Tina described the red sticks as being six inches long which is not consistent with road flares. 

No she did not!  Stop making stuff up. Tina quoted said:

"eight cylindrical objects about six to eight inches long with four of the items being placed on top of the others and banded together with (black) tape. " (Interview 11-30 Mucklow)

BTW: Tina was the daughter of a career electrician .... she watched him and talked to him about his work as a kid ...

 

Edited December 1, 2022 by georger

[Slim King 29]

4 minutes ago, georger said:

No she did not!  Stop making stuff up. Tina quoted said:

"eight cylindrical objects about six to eight inches long with four of the items being placed on top of the others and banded together with (black) tape. "

Currently road flares are about a foot long. I don't think they were shorter in the 70's. I think they were about a foot long.

[FLYJACK 456]

1 hour ago, Slim King said:

Obviously you haven't done your research. I can't spoon feed you what is already on the record.

I have done research that is why I am asking you, you have no problem spoon feeding the forum endless Reca/Peca nonsense. I am just asking for some facts this time.

Your inability to answer is telling..

Again, what date did Reca leave his family in Mi and move to Wa,, and when did he move back.

and other than the unreliable tapes what evidence do you have that Reca/Peca knew of Cossey, knew him personally or colluded with him with the chutes.

Simple..

[FLYJACK 456]

On 6/13/2008 at 3:42 PM, Ckret said:

Back to the NB6, Cossey modified the chute, we know that from the 28' canopy. And when we spoke he said he placed the handle under the right armpit. The motion he showed me was that Cooper would have had to hook his right thumb in the handle and push straight out, like a bench press motion. Once fully extended, he would have had to rotate his fully extended arm up over his head.

Does this make sense? or did he just demonstrate right handed and he really meant left?

This is where Gryder mistakenly got the chute modification was moving the handle from left to right..

Cossey never said that, he said the pull was modified to out and up.

Further, Cossey was describing his own chute not Hayden's chute the one Cooper used.

[FLYJACK 456]

1 hour ago, Slim King said:

Currently road flares are about a foot long. I don't think they were shorter in the 70's. I think they were about a foot long.

The bomb could have been any type of pyro.. not limited to flares.

I have seen vintage road flares about 8" long.. 

but there are many types of flares.

 

[Slim King 29]

They loved to watch Peca Jump!!!! Jumping with a Santa bag might be pretty good rehearsal for jumping with $200,000.00

[FLYJACK 456]

20 minutes ago, Slim King said:

They loved to watch Peca Jump!!!! Jumping with a Santa bag might be pretty good rehearsal for jumping with $200,000.00

Your inability to answer is telling..

Again, what date did Reca leave his family in Mi and move to Wa,, and when did he move back.

and other than the unreliable tapes what evidence do you have that Reca/Peca knew of Cossey, knew him personally or colluded with him with the chutes.

[CooperNWO305 96]

21 hours ago, CooperNWO305 said:

Are the Vordahl elements and the Petersen elements the same part #s on the McCrone sheets? I've got all of those on separate tabs and was hoping someone could point me to who is using which ones.  The Crucible patent calls for Zirconium, Silver, Tin, and Aluminum along with the Titanium and Antimony that Petersen would have been in contact with.  Are all those found together?  I'm trying to understand what Zirconium is used for.  I feel comfortable analyzing quite a bit of subjects, but mettalurgy is one of those areas I'd feel more comfortable talking to a PhD about. But figure for laymans terms, someone on this group can probably get us in the right area.  It is all very interesting and I was going to chat with Tom Kaye, but on Citizen Sleuths he says "This data is complicated to look at. Please do not email asking how to interpret it."

For full disclosure, I wrote on my blog a number of years ago that I was skeptical of the Titanium being from some Top Secret area of research, given that Titanium was in such demand that we had to import it from the Russians during the Cold War.

No one has Eric's particles listed or the location the McCrone report???

[olemisscub 160]

31 minutes ago, CooperNWO305 said:

No one has Eric's particles listed or the location the McCrone report???

 

[CooperNWO305 96]

I don't have the Excel file handy. I was particularly interested in the Zirconium and partially interested in the Silver and Tin.  Is that further down the column?  As I remember each stub had something like 30-40 particles listed.

Are the Vordahl stubs the same as the Petersen ones or different?  Eric was talking salt, which I'm guessing is Na.  Where is that on these stubs (674 and 675)?

[olemisscub 160]

10 minutes ago, CooperNWO305 said:

I don't have the Excel file handy. I was particularly interested in the Zirconium and partially interested in the Silver and Tin.  Is that further down the column?  As I remember each stub had something like 30-40 particles listed.

Are the Vordahl stubs the same as the Petersen ones or different?  Eric was talking salt, which I'm guessing is Na.  Where is that on these stubs (674 and 675)?

I'm complete shit when it comes to going through the McCrone spreadsheets. They confuse the hell out of me so I'm of no use finding stuff in it. Chris Broer is the master of the McCrone spreadsheet. 

I guess I'm not sure what you're asking about whether the Vordahl stubs are different than Petersen's. Those 3 TiSb particles were the reason Ulis looked into RemCru. Those same 3 particles are what led us to Vordahl since he was the only person at RemCru verified to have come into contact with TiSb alloys during the tie era. 

[Eight Raleighs 12]

5 minutes ago, olemisscub said:

I'm complete shit when it comes to going through the McCrone spreadsheets. They confuse the hell out of me so I'm of no use finding stuff in it. Chris Broer is the master of the McCrone spreadsheet. 

I guess I'm not sure what you're asking about whether the Vordahl stubs are different than Petersen's. Those 3 TiSb particles were the reason Ulis looked into RemCru. Those same 3 particles are what led us to Vordahl since he was the only person at RemCru verified to have come into contact with TiSb alloys during the tie era. 

I have a philosophical question:

Do you and your fellow Remcru investigators anticipate feeling at least a wee bit of wistfulness if you indeed crack the Cooper case?

He is one of the last true American folk heroes. And that status is largely dependent upon the fact that the man is a phantom, a wisp.

(I would add that the folk hero status is also highly and perhaps mostly dependent upon persons such as yourself and everyone else here who is trying, without avail, to identify Dan Cooper.)

Edited December 1, 2022 by Eight Raleighs

[Slim King 29]

9 hours ago, FLYJACK said:

Your inability to answer is telling..

Again, what date did Reca leave his family in Mi and move to Wa,, and when did he move back.

and other than the unreliable tapes what evidence do you have that Reca/Peca knew of Cossey, knew him personally or colluded with him with the chutes.

 I get my information from "Coopers" friends, the testimony of Carl Lauren and his wife. Please actually read the books. I'm not going to waste time on this forum explaining what has already been revealed. Walter skipped out of state (Mi) after the Bob's Big Boy robbery (Where he gave the Waitress $100 as he fled) and was basically on the lamb. He took a job in Washington as a welder working for a CIA front corporation called Vinnell. He was employed at the dams construction site in 1971 when he hijacked the plane. The Dr. there reported that Walter had a broken leg the Monday after Thanksgiving weekend. Walter claimed it happened on the job but the Dr. didn't really agree. Walter had broken both legs and an arm in his history of barnstorming jumps. I would believe the tapes before I'd believe any bogus FBI 302. The FBI is leading you guys around by the nose.

 

[olemisscub 160]

5 minutes ago, Eight Raleighs said:

 

Do you and your fellow Remcru investigators anticipate feeling at least a wee bit of wistfulness if you indeed crack the Cooper case?

 

Not at all. I think most people who are interested in the Cooper case just want to know who he was. It's like saying that people who are into Bigfoot wouldn't want to see an actual Bigfoot. 

[Eight Raleighs 12]

3 minutes ago, olemisscub said:

Not at all. I think most people who are interested in the Cooper case just want to know who he was. It's like saying that people who are into Bigfoot wouldn't want to see an actual Bigfoot. 

Arguably the folk legend would grow if it is established that he survived and lived another 10, 20, 30 years.

It would just be a different legend, I suppose.

[FLYJACK 456]

4 minutes ago, Slim King said:

 I get my information from "Coopers" friends, the testimony of Carl Lauren and his wife. Please actually read the books. I'm not going to waste time on this forum explaining what has already been revealed. Walter skipped out of state (Mi) after the Bob's Big Boy robbery (Where he gave the Waitress $100 as he fled) and was basically on the lamb. He took a job in Washington as a welder working for a CIA front corporation called Vinnell. He was employed at the dams construction site in 1971 when he hijacked the plane. The Dr. there reported that Walter had a broken leg the Monday after Thanksgiving weekend. Walter claimed it happened on the job but the Dr. didn't really agree. Walter had broken both legs and an arm in his history of barnstorming jumps. I would believe the tapes before I'd believe any bogus FBI 302. The FBI is leading you guys around by the nose.

Carl isn't reliable. Carl said he lost contact with Reca/Peca for that time period. His info is either from Reca/Peca and made up or Carl made it up. 

You have lots of claims but no evidence.

So, Reca/Peca left Mi when,, in 1965? right after the robbery or when? later?, and he left his wife and kid in Mi to flee to Wa.. when did he eventually return to Mi? What abut his wife and kid in Mi, did they re-unite? if so, when? What years was Reca/Peca in Wa after leaving his family in Mi?

and you still have presented no evidence he knew of Cossey, knew Cossey personally or colluded with Cossey about the chutes despite claiming it over and over.

These aren't difficult questions.

 

[FLYJACK 456]

2 hours ago, olemisscub said:

 

One of these particles is not like the others..

The other two are close but don't match perfectly..

They don't even match the patent exclusively.

Edited December 1, 2022 by FLYJACK

[Eight Raleighs 12]

33 minutes ago, FLYJACK said:

One of these particles is not like the others..

The other two are close but don't match perfectly..

They don't even match the patent exclusively.

As we sit here today, on a scale of 1 being least likely and 100 being most likely, how likely do you think it is that one of the Rem-Cru "persons of interest" is Cooper?

[olemisscub 160]

9 minutes ago, Eight Raleighs said:

As we sit here today, on a scale of 1 being least likely and 100 being most likely, how likely do you think it is that one of the Rem-Cru "persons of interest" is Cooper?

lol, oh boy

[olemisscub 160]

Fun fact: Vordahl lost his job in August, 1971. His boss was a man named Don Cooper. 

[FLYJACK 456]

18 minutes ago, Eight Raleighs said:

As we sit here today, on a scale of 1 being least likely and 100 being most likely, how likely do you think it is that one of the Rem-Cru "persons of interest" is Cooper?

0.00001 %

The patent connection is way overplayed, that said I would have pursued it just to check,, but there is nothing there.

If that profile image is accurate that eliminates him right there..

Edited December 1, 2022 by FLYJACK