DB Cooper

[Slim King 29]

If you haven't noticed, I'm looking into the flight path. It's the number one thing that would exclude Peca. Instead of finding massive evidence to support V23 I find NO BLACK BOXES being released. I find no radar data BEING RELEASED. With about 100,000 hunters searching the area every year for over 50 years  I find NO EVIDENCE . The Cooper Vortex podcast has interviews with Joe Koenig, Vern Jones, Lisa Story, and several others that support the theory that the Flight Path was the invention of the FBI and is Not Correct.....

[FLYJACK 456]

16 minutes ago, Slim King said:

If you haven't noticed, I'm looking into the flight path. It's the number one thing that would exclude Peca. Instead of finding massive evidence to support V23 I find NO BLACK BOXES being released. I find no radar data BEING RELEASED. With about 100,000 hunters searching the area every year for over 50 years  I find NO EVIDENCE . The Cooper Vortex podcast has interviews with Joe Koenig, Vern Jones, Lisa Story, and several others that support the theory that the Flight Path was the invention of the FBI and is Not Correct.....

Then Joe Koenig, Vern Jones and Lisa Story are wrong..

If you can't find any evidence for the flightpath then you aren't looking in the right place.

Start here..

https://vault.fbi.gov/D-B-Cooper ?b_start:int=40

Let us know when you have finished reading...

Edited August 26, 2022 by FLYJACK

[JAGdb 27]

Only thing I would add to this would be to hold the Reca team and their story to the same standard regarding evidence.   As far as I know, they have produced no hard evidence to support their extraordinary claims.  Their story deviates drastically from what the generally accepted details are in this case.  The amount of people that would have to stay on script to cover up a flight path and drop zone deviation of this magnitude without slipping up or talking makes it highly unlikely.  And it would take not only law enforcement and intelligence people, it would require civilians (pilots and stewardesses, FAA radar operators, the passengers on the plane), to go along with whatever the cover up is.  

Make no mistake, everyone here is frustrated that things like the data from the flight data recorder or the data that the air force used (SAGE radar) has not been made public, but that doesn't necessarily mean that the plane went 100 miles to the east.  

[FLYJACK 456]

4 minutes ago, JAGdb said:

Only thing I would add to this would be to hold the Reca team and their story to the same standard regarding evidence.   As far as I know, they have produced no hard evidence to support their extraordinary claims.  Their story deviates drastically from what the generally accepted details are in this case.  The amount of people that would have to stay on script to cover up a flight path and drop zone deviation of this magnitude without slipping up or talking makes it highly unlikely.  And it would take not only law enforcement and intelligence people, it would require civilians (pilots and stewardesses, FAA radar operators, the passengers on the plane), to go along with whatever the cover up is.  

Make no mistake, everyone here is frustrated that things like the data from the flight data recorder or the data that the air force used (SAGE radar) has not been made public, but that doesn't necessarily mean that the plane went 100 miles to the east.  

The primary Sage computer data had to be converted to GEOREF by the Air Force to make a map,, that data was used to plot the points on the "FBI" map... those plotted points are data.

They later went back to the AF and were able to use a more modern method of conversion which reduced the error from 1 mile to 0.5 miles.. but it was virtually the same.. they very slightly altered their search area.

You have,,

305 crew

Chase plane COMMS and pilots

multiple ATC contacts and tracking

the crew COMMS

Ground COMMS

Air Force

NWA

There is no way the plane went East. Claiming a massive conspiracy is just a way to cover for Carl Laurin's error and bogus story..

 

[FLYJACK 456]

305 was not on autopilot, the plane was flying super dirty,, it would not be appropriate.

Ratazcak changed the flap settings and when Cooper was having problems with the stairs right before jumping he adjusted the level and speed... that confirms he was manually flying the plane as he stated. Further, Ratazcak felt Cooper on the stairs..

The statements in the FBI files by an agent about it being on auto pilot were very early Dec 2/71.

 

Yes, it matters because some are trying to claim Ratazcak did not feel Cooper on the stairs because it was on autopilot.. and therefore Cooper jumped further South.

He did feel Cooper, he was flying it manually and Cooper did not jump further South.

Edited August 26, 2022 by FLYJACK

[Slim King 29]

55 minutes ago, FLYJACK said:

305 was not on autopilot, the plane was flying super dirty,, it would not be appropriate.

Ratazcak changed the flap settings and when Cooper was having problems with the stairs right before jumping he adjusted the level and speed... that confirms he was manually flying the plane as he stated. Further, Ratazcak felt Cooper on the stairs..

The statements in the FBI files by an agent about it being on auto pilot were very early Dec 2/71.

 

Yes, it matters because some are trying to claim Ratazcak did not feel Cooper on the stairs because it was on autopilot.. and therefore Cooper jumped further South.

He did feel Cooper, he was flying it manually and Cooper did not jump further South.

FANTASTIC... Now you claim that the FBI has told a lie. That's exactly what I've been saying all along!!!!!

[FLYJACK 456]

5 minutes ago, Slim King said:

FANTASTIC... Now you claim that the FBI has told a lie. That's exactly what I've been saying all along!!!!!

oh brother,, it wasn't a lie, it wasn't from the FBI if you actually read and understood the evidence.

They stated what they were told by somebody at NWA who was likely assuming..

 

 

[Slim King 29]

18 hours ago, FLYJACK said:

oh brother,, it wasn't a lie, it wasn't from the FBI if you actually read and understood the evidence.

They stated what they were told by somebody at NWA who was likely assuming..

 

 

Disseminating false information then.....

[FLYJACK 456]

1 hour ago, Slim King said:

Disseminating false information then.....

Wrong again, it wasn't disseminated it was an internal communication between offices.. one agent was passing on what he heard from somebody at NWA.. it was not a conclusion, a lie or false information from the FBI.

Read the FBI files before you make inaccurate claims..

 

[Slim King 29]

1 minute ago, FLYJACK said:

Wrong again, it wasn't disseminated it was an internal communication between offices.. one agent was passing on what he heard from somebody at NWA.. it was not a conclusion, a lie or false information from the FBI.

Read the FBI files before you make inaccurate claims..

 

If it wasn't disseminated then how did we get it???????????? rotflmao

[olemisscub 160]

Just another day in the Vortex. Who needs a Belgian graphic novel when you've got an AMERICAN 1937 pulp novella hero pilot named Dan Cooper? Found this last night. Thank you, thank you. 

 

[FLYJACK 456]

2 minutes ago, Slim King said:

If it wasn't disseminated then how did we get it???????????? rotflmao

Yikes,, sure you aren't Blevin's Florida cousin...

The document was not created to be disseminated, 45 years later a due to a lawsuit it was released. The document was not created to be disseminated and it was part of an investigation, not a conclusion. 

[FLYJACK 456]

29 minutes ago, olemisscub said:

Just another day in the Vortex. Who needs a Belgian graphic novel when you've got an AMERICAN 1937 pulp novella hero pilot named Dan Cooper? Found this last night. Thank you, thank you. 

 

That is interesting, Cooper would have been around 10-15 years old at the time.. looks more like an adult piece..

Probably a random coincidence.. but worth looking into more. 

Was the Dan Cooper character in a recurring series of pieces or just the one..

Here is a link to it..

https://ia902905.us.archive.org/28/items/bill-barnes-air-trails-v-07n-04-1937-01/Bill Barnes Air Trails v07n04 [1937-01].pdf

and ironically,, there is an International Correspondence School ad in it... same as the matchbook.. 

 

The "Air Trails" publication ran for roughly 10 years and was reprinted in Canada..

http://www.philsp.com/mags/air_trails.html

Edited August 27, 2022 by FLYJACK

[olemisscub 160]

19 minutes ago, FLYJACK said:

That is interesting, Cooper would have been around 10-15 years old at the time.. looks more like an adult piece..

Probably a random coincidence.. but worth looking into more. 

Was the Dan Cooper character in a recurring series of pieces or just the one..

Here is a link to it..

https://ia902905.us.archive.org/28/items/bill-barnes-air-trails-v-07n-04-1937-01/Bill Barnes Air Trails v07n04 [1937-01].pdf

and ironically,, there is an International Correspondence School ad in it... same as the matchbook.. 

 

 

Coincidence or not, it's infinitely more likely to be the inspiration for our middle aged man's alias than a Belgian graphic novel, that's for sure. 

[FLYJACK 456]

30 minutes ago, olemisscub said:

 

Coincidence or not, it's infinitely more likely to be the inspiration for our middle aged man's alias than a Belgian graphic novel, that's for sure. 

Not necessarily, everyone is focussed on the French angle but the Dan Cooper comic was also published in Mexico, in Spanish for Latin America..  Cooper was described as swarthy and Latin American.. plus his demand was to fly to Mexico... 

but, I still think the name is a random coincidence..  we will never be able to find any connection beyond speculation.

It is still interesting..

Here is an article on the publication, it was out of NY,

https://thepulp.net/pulp-articles/i-flew-with-bill-barnes/

I am still trying to figure out if Dan Cooper was a character in only one edition or an ongoing character.. it looks like only that one issue.

Edited August 27, 2022 by FLYJACK

[olemisscub 160]

12 minutes ago, FLYJACK said:

Not necessarily, everyone is focussed on the French angle but the Dan Cooper comic was also published in Mexico, in Spanish for Latin America..  Cooper was described as swarthy and Latin American.. plus his demand was to fly to Mexico... 

but, I still think the name is a random coincidence..  we will never be able to find any connection beyond speculation.

It is still interesting..

Here is an article on the publication, it was out of NY,

https://thepulp.net/pulp-articles/i-flew-with-bill-barnes/

I am still trying to figure out if Dan Cooper was a character in only one edition or an ongoing character..

This Dan Cooper character was a one-off. 

[FLYJACK 456]

3 minutes ago, olemisscub said:

This Dan Cooper character was a one-off. 

Yes, I found other issues.. 

A character's name in a single article about an aviator, not a jumper like the comic and being used 34 years later sounds like a real stretch..  

but I think the comic is a stretch as well..

[FLYJACK 456]

This ad is hilarious...

A fake bomb you wire into a car for fun.... DOES NOT HARM THE CAR

Today, you get cancelled on social media or fired for telling the truth.

[olemisscub 160]

25 minutes ago, FLYJACK said:

Yes, I found other issues.. 

A character's name in a single article about an aviator, not a jumper like the comic and being used 34 years later sounds like a real stretch..  

but I think the comic is a stretch as well..

According to Find A Grave, there are less than 500 Dan or Daniel Cooper's listed on there if you do a search for graves of people born before 1950. That's not scientific but I don't think Dan Cooper is as popular a name as people might think it is. 

I'm a former prosecutor and current defense attorney. Most aliases are either extremely generic "John Smith" types or they are fictional characters like "Walter White" or "Michael Scott".

Media was extremely scarce during the depression. Someone who possessed this magazine would have read and re-read it countless times. Also, if you were to read the novella the author uses the name "Dan Cooper" as a gimmick. The entire story it's "Dan Cooper" punched the guy in the face or "Dan Cooper" laughed a sigh of relief. 

I think it's far more likely that if the name "Dan Cooper" WERE an alias based on a fictional character (and not based on an old friend or something) that it would be based on this character from the era of Cooper's childhood as opposed to some Belgian graphic novel that would have come out while he was an adult. It'd be like if you were to use an alias based on your favorite movie as a kid or something. People retain pop culture information far easier as children than they do as adults before life catches up to them. 

I don't think it matters that it isn't about skydiving. We know Cooper was knowledgeable about aviation. This was an aviation magazine. 

I think it's a bit interesting perhaps that the page right before the novella begins has this harrowing parachute rescue. Osmosis perhaps?

 

Edited August 27, 2022 by olemisscub

[olemisscub 160]

Flyjack, have you seen this 302 where this Cooper witness says Hahneman in no way resembles Cooper? Do you know which witness this would be?

 

[FLYJACK 456]

5 minutes ago, olemisscub said:

Flyjack, have you seen this 302 where this Cooper witness says Hahneman in no way resembles Cooper? Do you know which witness this would be?

 

Maybe Gregory.

That was the artist conception.. which was said to be poor.

 

Edited August 27, 2022 by FLYJACK

[Slim King 29]

Coopers handler gave him the name to use. An inside joke to the CIA guys......

Edited August 27, 2022 by Slim King

[olemisscub 160]

Just now, FLYJACK said:

 

Maybe Gregory.

That was the artist conception.. which was said to be poor.

 

Fair enough. Gregory would be your main witness in your Hahneman argument, right? He's the one who sent these to the FBI, I believe. 

 

[FLYJACK 456]

1 hour ago, olemisscub said:

According to Find A Grave, there are less than 500 Dan or Daniel Cooper's listed on there if you do a search for graves of people born before 1950. That's not scientific but I don't think Dan Cooper is as popular a name as people might think it is. 

I'm a former prosecutor and current defense attorney. Most aliases are either extremely generic "John Smith" types or they are fictional characters like "Walter White" or "Michael Scott".

Media was extremely scarce during the depression. Someone who possessed this magazine would have read and re-read it countless times. Also, if you were to read the novella the author uses the name "Dan Cooper" as a gimmick. The entire story it's "Dan Cooper" punched the guy in the face or "Dan Cooper" laughed a sigh of relief. 

I think it's far more likely that if the name "Dan Cooper" WERE an alias based on a fictional character (and not based on an old friend or something) that it would be based on this character from the era of Cooper's childhood as opposed to some Belgian graphic novel that would have come out while he was an adult. It'd be like if you were to use an alias based on your favorite movie as a kid or something. People retain pop culture information far easier as children than they do as adults before life catches up to them. 

I don't think it matters that it isn't about skydiving. We know Cooper was knowledgeable about aviation. This was an aviation magazine. 

I think it's a bit interesting perhaps that the page right before the novella begins has this harrowing parachute rescue. Osmosis perhaps?

 

 

It is interesting, but I have to push back, the Cooper comic was not really for children.. It became very sophisticated, highly technical and advanced, even political. The author had many global connections in the military and aviation world. It was read by adults who were military aviators or fans...   It was not a child's comic..

Cooper wasn't an aviator when that article was published... it was not for children.

I agree that alias's are usually pulled from past experiences, but a single article 34 years prior is a real stretch,, there are many other better possibilities. 

Edited August 27, 2022 by FLYJACK

[olemisscub 160]

3 minutes ago, FLYJACK said:

It is interesting, but I have to push back, the Cooper comic was not really for children.. It became very sophisticated, highly technical and advanced, even political. The author had many global connections in the military and aviation world. It was read by adults who were military aviators or fans...   It was not a child's comic..

Cooper wasn't an aviator when that article was published... it was not for children.

I agree that alias's are usually pulled from past experiences, but a single article 37 years prior is a real stretch,, there are many other better possibilities. 

 

Works even better. My suspect was 24 when it came out. Thats right, my Cooper was old. :-)

Edited August 27, 2022 by olemisscub