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DB Cooper

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early 70’s Bourbon nation's top hard liquor

 

https://www.newspapers.com/newspage/254107297/

 

"MUNCIE EVENING PRESS, THURSDAY, NOVEMBER 21, 1974 Vodka replaces bourbon as nation's favorite booze; lightness, mixability with flavors credited By RICHARD HUGHES NEW YORK (UPI) - Belly up to the bar, boys, and have a belt of vodka and orange juice. Vodka and orange juice? 'Fraid so. Vodka has just replaced bourbon as the nation's favorite hard alcoholic drink."

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19 hours ago, FLYJACK said:

If they broke the seal and opened it up,, would it need to be repacked by an authorized rigger?

Hayden got it back in 1975, repacked in 1982,,, Cossey packed it in 1971 applied his seal.

What were the packing regs??

 

17 hours ago, RobertMBlevins said:

No. I think he had it repacked later just for 'looks' more or less. Although I wondered what he was using for the chute requirement during this time, since I have to assume he was still flying.

Yes it would need to be repacked by a rigger to be legal. In the 80's the repack cycle was 120 days, in the late 60's - early 70's it might have been 90 days. (They have to be inspected and repacked whether they're used or not to be 'in date'.)

It was a few years before he got it back, I would imagine that he had replaced the rigs to keep flying. They weren't really all that expensive, especially for a guy with his own mfg. company who flies aerobatics for fun.

For Cossey to have packed Hayden's rigs despite their never having met might not be that odd. Hayden might have just had his flight service people handle that for him. (The people who took care of his airplane.)

When Haden did get it back... It might not be that odd that he didn't get it packed for a while. Whether it was opened or packed, he might have just put it in a closet until he figured out what he wanted to do with it. He probably already had other ones to fly with. And this rig was part of a notorious world famous caper, so he probably didn't want to use it and risk damaging it. So the question might not be why did it take so long to get it packed, but why did he get it packed twice? When did he donate it to the museum? If that was around '86, the date of the second repack, maybe the museum wanted it opened and repacked, just so they knew exactly what they were getting?

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On 6/13/2008 at 3:42 PM, Ckret said:

Back to the NB6, Cossey modified the chute, we know that from the 28' canopy. And when we spoke he said he placed the handle under the right armpit. The motion he showed me was that Cooper would have had to hook his right thumb in the handle and push straight out, like a bench press motion. Once fully extended, he would have had to rotate his fully extended arm up over his head.

Does this make sense? or did he just demonstrate right handed and he really meant left?

Here, Cossey told agent Carr that he had modified the chute...

Does this make any sense,,, that Cossey would modify one of two chutes sent to him to pack for somebody he doesn't know.

 

Carr also posted...

Ckret

Sluggo, 

The NB6 and the Pioneer were Cossey's chutes, he had them at his house, they weren't at Seattle Skysports. I asked Cossey why he packed a 28 foot canopy in the NB6 and he just shrugged. Kind of like, "it was my chute, I did it because I can." I like that guy, I could have talked to him all day but he grew tired of me in about an hour.
 
Edited by FLYJACK
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1 hour ago, dudeman17 said:

Flyjack, if you're interested, there's a good picture of a rigger's seal in this thread:

https://www.dropzone.com/forums/topic/271157-seeking-experienced-opinions-on-an-older-parachute-rig-from-a-storage-unit-auction/

Break the seal??

IMO, it seems unlikely the alternate SN/Date is from the pilot chute, I thought maybe some tag on the outside of the container somewhere. It wasn't the harness, that has a different date.

Edited by FLYJACK

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Robert, I say this with all due respect as constructive criticism. But it shows a flaw in your thinking.

You have this...

9 hours ago, RobertMBlevins said:

An email from the Seattle F.B.I. to our office admits that Agent Jarvis may have said those things, but perhaps he was just giving his opinion.

Yet you still assert this...

9 hours ago, RobertMBlevins said:

Either Agent Jarvis, a high-profile agent working at Quantico knows something no one else has admitted, or he was lying to impress his friends.

--------

10 hours ago, RobertMBlevins said:

It's going to be difficult for the Seattle FBI to explain all this away

That's exactly what they did.

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14 minutes ago, RobertMBlevins said:

Well, they tried to explain things...

That whole post just shows and solidifies the flaw in your thinking.

15 minutes ago, RobertMBlevins said:

The bottom line is that someone is lying.

That's not necessarily true. No one has to be lying. Jarvis could be stating an honestly held opinion. Bentz could be accurately relaying it to you. But Jarvis could be wrong, and it might not be the actual reason the FBI closed the case. If it was, why wouldn't they say so? And if there is a reason why they wouldn't say so, it doesn't necessarily prove Jarvis' opinion. It just can not be known.

The next step, I would think, would be to ask Jarvis why he said that. But I'm guessing you tried, and he wouldn't respond?

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5 minutes ago, RobertMBlevins said:

This is not the place for these discussions.

This is EXACTLY the place for these discussions (of Cooper evidence). This is exactly what this forum is here for. It's all that other crap that is out of place.

Look, clearly you and all the others have a history, and clearly you've pissed them all off. But, for the most part, I've considered that none of my business and have usually tried to give you the benefit of the doubt. But you get a narrative stuck in your mind, and you won't let anything, no amount of other evidence, no logic, no other opinions, sway your narrative. And that can be frustrating.

I wish you nothing but luck on the festival. Campout festivals can be fun, I used to go to a lot of them myself (live music related), and if I lived in the area, I'd probably go to it.

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Case in point...

30 minutes ago, RobertMBlevins said:

I will say this much. Jarvis wasn't giving his opinion.

Supposition on your part. Not factual.

30 minutes ago, RobertMBlevins said:

Bingo. On the record.

NOT on the record. OFF record comment made in confidence. Confidence that was betrayed.

1 hour ago, RobertMBlevins said:

After all, if you can't trust your buddies who work for the government and have these clearances, who CAN you trust? 

Apparently, his trust was misplaced.

 

NONE of which proves your point.

Edited by dudeman17

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Well, I've posted this before, but I guess I need to post it again.

This was a response that Bruce had received from Ann Dietrich Williams after he emailed her asking about a supposed suspect that the FBI had spent the previous 5 years investigating before closing the case. This was her response:

"As you know, I can't provide a name because of Privacy Act considerations. However, I will tell you that a tip we received in 2010 provided information on a person the FBI had not previously considered as a match to the NORJAK subject. Every other individual mentioned in tips over the last five or more years was someone the FBI had previously considered, and for whom investigative results did not support further consideration. I would caution you from saying we spent five years investigating, because the effort was much less involved. We received items belonging to the 2010 individual and sent them to our lab for forensic testing against the DNA and fingerprint profiles we have on file. Given much more urgent and higher profile demands on the Lab, only in January 2016 did the Seattle Division receive the results of that testing. It did not confirm a match between the 2010 individual and the hijacker.  There was tremendous media attention in 2011 to our investigation. I can't confirm or deny any claims about the identity of the individual we were considering, but I would suggest you review that media coverage."

Obviously, she is talking about LD Cooper. 

1. LD Cooper was the last suspect investigated by the FBI.

2. Curtis Eng told Marla that he thought LD was DB Cooper and that the FBI would be closing the case. 

3. John Jarvis NEVER said the name Kenny Christiansen.

4. The FBI put LD Coopers name out there publicly, even though he was dead. So why would they not put Christiansen's name out there if they thought he was Cooper? There is no way that the FBI would not name the guilty party if they knew who it was. NO WAY!

Edited by ParrotheadVol

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1 hour ago, RobertMBlevins said:

Someone HAS mentioned it.

 

4 hours ago, RobertMBlevins said:

There is no supposition.

That's EXACTLY what it is.

1 hour ago, RobertMBlevins said:

Maybe it turns out to be true.

And that's an admission.

------

You are so defensive, so quick to disagree with anything anyone says that you contradict yourself from post to post. Often within the same post, sometimes within the same paragraph. You really should be more objective.

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Even if a senior FBI agent thinks a particular suspect is Cooper that doesn't really mean anything. There is an FBI agent who thinks Sheridan Peterson is Cooper. Another says he shot and killed D.B Cooper decades ago (Richard McCoy). Curtis Eng ignored Tom Kaye's forensic findings and focused on LD Cooper until that fizzled into nothing. Himmelsbach may have at one point been convinced by Jo about Duane. FBI agents are real people with differing opinions and are fallible.

Edited by Andrade1812
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Bourbon was the top hard liquor drink in the early 70's...  it wasn't rare or exclusive.

The Dan Cooper comics were published in 16 languages... 

It wasn't just published in Spanish for Europe..  it was also published in Spanish in Mexico for Latin America.

Cooper demanded to fly to Mexico, he was described as swarthy Latin/Mexican in features and characteristics...  any potential connection to the Dan Cooper comic would lead to the Mexican Spanish version not the French version of the comic.

Edited by FLYJACK

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On 1/4/2021 at 7:18 AM, FLYJACK said:

The matchbook thing is drifting into the weeds...

When we put together the FBI files, Tina's interview and Tosaw's claim..

 

There were two matchbooks, Tina lit the last match from Cooper's matchbook and grabbed one from the plane. Sky Chef was the Airline caterer..  Tosaw claimed Tina described the first matchbook as the ICS one. Agents have admitted to withholding info. I can see the  FBI holding back the ICS info, only Cooper would have known this.

 

The take away is.. though not explicitly stated.. the Sky Chef matchbook most likely came from the plane, not from Cooper. Trying to match Cooper to an external Sky Chef source looks like a red herring.

 

The Sky Chef matches most likely came from the plane..

There were two matchbooks.. the ICS one and the Sky Chef one... Cooper's matchbook ran out and was tossed, he retrieved that one. The ICS one.

Tosaw….  Cooper used up his matchbook then Tina grabbed a company one from the cabinet. Cooper put the used matchbook in his pocket, Tina remembered the ad on the cover “Earn a High School Diploma”

Tina grabbed another matchbook from a cabinet and he "retained that one"... though not explicitly revealed, it had to be the Sky Chef matchbook as they were the caterer for the plane. Otherwise, there had to be three matchbooks involved..

The statements if accurate, evidence and logic indicate that the Sky Chef matchbook came from the plane. 

 

FBI files..

"He also wanted the empty matchbook cover from which he had been lighting his cigarettes and had thrown into the back pouch of the seat in front as she said she would do with trash. She indicated he had another book of matches the cover of which was blue and said, ''Sky Chef.”  from which she pulled matches to light his cigarettes. He retained this book of matches."

Edited by FLYJACK

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