DB Cooper

[georger 197]

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Ms AGGIE:

Only someone with some real 'stones' can call a 260 pound Texas Cop..."Ms."

Maybe JO is Cooper!

If someone is going to make a medical and psycological opininions of me regarding my posts and my search - that person needs to display their credentials or cease posting in that manner. I believe it is "criminal" to pose as a Dr. of anything.

All I am doing is trying to find that one simple something that is being missed that will end all of this and that is ALL that my post reflect.


This afternoon sitting on my front porch I threw a stone at a big dog taking a dump (Cow Pile) in my front yard. I had been hoping to catch the culprit and after 4 month there he was staring at me with his bulldog face.

I was on the phone with my daughter - she thought I threw the phone at the dog. She kept hearing sounds like the phone was being chewed on by the dog. She was saying "Git, Git", but what had really happened?

This morning I broke my toe and when I got up to chase the dog away I dropped the phone and it fell to pieces in the driveway.



Just a day in the life of a Crazy woman. Breaking toes and chasing dogs. By the way Cooper is very seldom mentioned until I get on the computer in the evening or if some new tidbit surfaces that needs to be checked out.





--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"Crazy is as crazy does" - Forest Gump

[georger 197]

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In a fall or in stiff wind these raincoats compress against the body. (like standing at the front of a ship in a trench coat). The coat could serve as an excellent windbreak.

georger,

As irritated as I get with Orange1’s constant harassment of Jo, I find myself coming to his defense (as a member of the sky ape/bird turd skydiving community… him, not me).

On this forum (thread) we have very few individuals who produce bona fides. Ckret is an experienced LE professional, and is one of the exceptions. Most posters don’t reveal any “areas of expertise” where they are considered “experts.” However, each of the sky ape/bird turd skydivers has their bona fides right in the left-hand margin (if you have your screen set up like mine).

Orange1, airtwardo, and AggieDave have at least 5988 jumps between them (I have no idea how many sangrio has, but I’ll bet it is a few). That makes them “experts in the field.”

Sluggo_Monster, snowmman, and georger have…… ummm let me see… carry the zero… subtract the j-operator… find the cube-root…. Oh yeah… ZERO jumps between them.

So to my way of thinking, when more than one “expert in the field” tells me that something is true… I believe them. I don’t feel like I have to “see it”, although, it would be nice if I could.

The reason that this thread is on this forum, on this web site, is because of the skydiving expertise. I understand why they get irritated at the whuffos. I wouldn’t be surprised if they removed access for all of us one day.

You have a unique way of investigating NORJAK and have made many positive contributions, please keep doing that. But, please… please… PLEASE… try not to irritate the sky ape/birds turds skydivers, by challenging their opinions in the areas of their expertise.

Just a little advice/request from Ckret’s creepy uncle Sluggo,

Sluggo_Monster

REPLY: I am well aware of their credentials and
appreciate it. It is precisely because of their solid
credentials that serious discussion and investigation
can take place. I would not be asking these questions of some random Joe on the street, any
more than they would. All I can ask for is some
tolerance as time hopfully will make things clear.
I would not be asking these questions anywhere else but here, and there is a reason for that. Ckret
knows why I am here. If the discussion ceases to
be productive then I will leave and perhaps watch
and say nothing. I am not trying to be irritating at
all. I am always open to a PM. But I appreciate your expressing your concern.

In fact you raise a good question: would any of the
highly experienced people here try a skyjacking?
Probably not. Why? Follow that line of thought -

Thanks - George

[georger 197]

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Yeah, that made me laugh. I was trying to figure out how I could have come across so effimently that Jo thought I was a Ms. Then I got mad. REAL mad. I'm married damnit, that's Mrs Aggie!

AggieDave

I don’t want to (try to) speak for Jo, but I think I know why she originally thought you were female.

If fact, the first time I saw your post, I thought the same, then I decided you were both male and female (two people, not a hermaphrodite).

Let me explain it like this:
“Aggie” looks a lot like “Angie.” So, at first glance my mind said this is Angie-something. Then on closer inspection it looked like “AngieDave,” so now I’m thinking of this nice skydiving couple who share an account (as many do, especially “Premium" or "Subscription” accounts). It was only after looking at your profile (or maybe I saw a post that mentioned Texas) that I realized you must be a Texas A&M alumni or fan. All of us aren’t into collegiate sports, or are familiar with the College and University mascots.

So screen names that start with Tide, Pirate, Dawg, Jacket, Volunteer, Razorback, War Eagle, Eagle, Gator, or Seminole do not necessarily immediately “hook-up in our brain.” Especially, if it isn’t apparent where you are located.

Make sense?

Oh, BTW, Jo has a pretty keen “sense of humor” that you guys don’t let come through. When you got “mad, real mad,” you became “Ms” forever (or at least as long as you are adversarial toward her). [That's IMHO]

Sluggo_Monster

REPLY: I leave no doubt about where I stand in this.
The minute Ckret says I am being 'irritating' then I
will be gone or something - does that satisfy you?

I trully am not trying to be irritating at all. I honestly
dont know where this is coming from or why. But I
am very aware you keep bringing it up.

George

[Orange1 0]

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Just a day in the life of a Crazy woman. --

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A person with delusional disorder can be quite functional and does not tend to show any odd or bizarre behavior aside from these delusions.
The delusions do not interfere with general logical reasoning (although within the delusional system the logic is perverted) and there is usually no general disturbance of behavior.

Sluggo, I am sorry you see me as constantly "harassing" Jo. Maybe that's what it looks like. From this end it is more a (clearly futile) attempt to try to get her to see some reason rather than waste her life on this wild goose chase. I don't think "feeding" her (snow's words) is actually being kind in the long run. [And remember it started out with me trying to find stuff to help Jo.] btw, not that it makes any difference, but while AggieDave is a he, Orange1 is a she.

To ... sorry can't remember who posted this - back on the raincoat topic - something about exit was mentioned in terms of whether the coat would blow up. Remember the truly experienced jumpers (I am not) who have jumped out of jets have posted about how, even with all their experience and being properly briefed, they still often/most cases tumbled on exit as the exit forces are wild. Remember - a coat over your handles on exit, and you have about 35 seconds to solve that problem and land safely. You saw Sangiro's post - with much less fabric involved he had to go to his reserve. IF Cooper jumped with a raincoat on it would have reduced his chances of surviving dramatically - and even more so if he was a novice with probably no clear way of trying to figure out exactly what the problem was or the best way of solving it without tumbling crazily all over the sky.

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[nigel99 143]

RE- trenchcoat.

As I understand a trench-coat extends to knee or ankle length and I can imagine that would seriously affect stability and would certainly hurt like hell to have that much fabric flapping around. I can't visualise how easily leg-straps would fit do maybe the fabric would be all bunched up?

I guees people like twardo who jump with the big flags may have an idea on what this is like - but then would you even want to do that as a high speed exit or long free-fall?

Perhaps to add to Coopers legacy he rigged his trench-coat as a wing-suit and managed to track all the way to tina bar where he deployed at 500 ft and buried his loot

Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived.

[377 20]

On my WFFC DC 9 jet jump, the windblast was VERY strong. Others on the load lost goggles and anything else that was not fastened strongly. Most tumbled from what I observed although few admitted it. I tumbled. I admit it. Tightly strapped goggles were ripped off my face but still held on by my helmet. It was kinda wild for a few seconds. Add night, cold, inexperience, fear, no reserve and a possibly obstructed ripcord handle access and you are talking a major risk of going in undeployed. Remember, this was a 28 ft canopy tightly stuffed into a non extended NB 6 container. This would be a very hard pull even if everything else went perfectly.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[377 20]

Orange,

You seem to know a lot about clinical psychology. What might have made Duane pose as Cooper if he were not actually Cooper? He didn't get fame or public adulation. Only his wife Jo knew about his claim and she would not think more highly of him for being Cooper, in fact I think it is the opposite.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[snowmman 3]

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sluggo said:
On this forum (thread) we have very few individuals who produce bona fides

Jo said:
This afternoon sitting on my front porch I threw a stone at a big dog taking a dump (Cow Pile) in my front yard.

I own three dogs and do a lot of dog training. I've taught one of them to ride a skateboard. I'd have a hard time believing someone on this thread is going to be able to shout me down about dogs.

With respect to raincoats, there are a lot of issues.

One, it was described as a topcoat at first right?

I've looked at newspapers for the ads showing the styles being worn in '65-'71. There are a lot of questions. More tailored coats were coming into fashion? I wonder if it was a real raincoat...more likely would have been tan or sand or grey? if so...
Single or Double breasted?
Military collar? (wide) or narrow?
button or zipper?
belted?
Many of these coats had the zip in fleece liner for winter.
(edit) Specifically, I don't think we're talking about the "Columbo" style very-loose, raincoat.

So we can bitch about the "raincoat" or "topcoat" but we're don't even know what kind of coat we're talking about.

They were fitted in both chest size and length.
No chest pockets.

One common thing is that they came down to mid thigh. (edit) so that's a question. I'm assuming Cooper's was mid-thigh, but who knows? could have been longer.

So the "blow up/inflate" argument does seem to make sense no matter what?

Does anyone want me to post pictures of typical raincoats/topcoats for men from '65-'71?

And Jo, throwing the rock at the dog was the worst thing you could do. Hopefully he'll bite you soon.

[airtwardo 6]

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RE- trenchcoat.

As I understand a trench-coat extends to knee or ankle length and I can imagine that would seriously affect stability and would certainly hurt like hell to have that much fabric flapping around. I can't visualise how easily leg-straps would fit do maybe the fabric would be all bunched up?

I guees people like twardo who jump with the big flags may have an idea on what this is like - but then would you even want to do that as a high speed exit or long free-fall?

Perhaps to add to Coopers legacy he rigged his trench-coat as a wing-suit and managed to track all the way to tina bar where he deployed at 500 ft and buried his loot

Did someone say...Trench Coat?

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[Orange1 0]

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Orange,

You seem to know a lot about clinical psychology. What might have made Duane pose as Cooper if he were not actually Cooper? He didn't get fame or public adulation. Only his wife Jo knew about his claim and she would not think more highly of him for being Cooper, in fact I think it is the opposite.

377

Nope, aside from some pysch lectures attended NDP out of interest at university (my degrees are in economics and finance, haven't had much chance to illustrate that expertise here apart from a small exchange about the end of the gold standard ) - the stuff i have posted is just gleaned from internet searches from what seem to be reasonable (mainstream) sources. (Not all that different from what a number of others are doing wrt various other factors... but as Aggie has said he has had experience interviewing these kind of people, it was that that started me looking..so now you know)

As to what he said, I have no idea why. I could do some more searching ... it certainly would not be the only example of a false deathbed confession... but to be honest I have not entirely discounted the possibility that Jo simply misheard what he said (and yes I know she has been presented with that theory by others and denied it vehemently.)

btw the original post said clearly that the stuff was all on wiki - which should have made clear i do not claim to be an expert!- in the repost i edited out some stuff that was originally a reply to something else and it got cleaned out with that.

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[377 20]

Orange,

My ex had a PhD in clincial psych from UCLA. I went to lots of shrink parties. You could definitely pass as a psychologist, but they are a twisted group, so maybe you want to keep your distance.

I have always wondered about Duane's alleged use of the word "aft" when referring to the stairs and his fear that he left fingerprints on it. It is odd that he would use "aft" (instead of "rear") and odd that Jo would have understood it in context. Fore and aft are nautical terms. Pilots I have heard usually use front and rear.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[nigel99 143]

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RE- trenchcoat.

As I understand a trench-coat extends to knee or ankle length and I can imagine that would seriously affect stability and would certainly hurt like hell to have that much fabric flapping around. I can't visualise how easily leg-straps would fit do maybe the fabric would be all bunched up?

I guees people like twardo who jump with the big flags may have an idea on what this is like - but then would you even want to do that as a high speed exit or long free-fall?

Perhaps to add to Coopers legacy he rigged his trench-coat as a wing-suit and managed to track all the way to tina bar where he deployed at 500 ft and buried his loot

Did someone say...Trench Coat?

So cooper dressed up in a tan trenchcoat discuised as snoopy? What is Ckret covering up that he never mentioned the snoopy disquise

Seriously though you wouldn't want to freefall very long with that much stuff flapping around would you? I've made the mistake of wearing a collared shirt in the tunnel and I came out black and blue - I'd hate to have a square foot of fabric flapping around my crotch area

Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived.

[Orange1 0]

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I have always wondered about Duane's alleged use of the word "aft" when referring to the stairs and his fear that he left fingerprints on it. It is odd that he would use "aft" (instead of "rear") and odd that Jo would have understood it in context. Fore and aft are nautical terms. Pilots I have heard usually use front and rear.

funny you should mention that, i was thinking about it the other day (after when i asked ckret if there were actually fingerprints there). it seemed strange to me actually that he used any description at all (whether aft, rear, whatever)... it did also occur to me that the "aft stairs", assuming not just part of some dream, could well have been somewhere else - it sounds like there may have been more than one place he didn't want to leave fingerprints, after all... but then again my experience of hearing people talk in their sleep is also that the words are often not very clear anyway.

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[Orange1 0]

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Seriously though you wouldn't want to freefall very long with that much stuff flapping around would you? I've made the mistake of wearing a collared shirt in the tunnel and I came out black and blue - I'd hate to have a square foot of fabric flapping around my crotch area

before the whuffos express disbelief - yes.
i made the mistake of jumping without my helmet strap done up once and ended up with a raw, bleeding patch on my chin from the 45 secs we were in freefall for...

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[airtwardo 6]

So cooper dressed up in a tan trenchcoat discuised as snoopy? What is Ckret covering up that he never mentioned the snoopy disquise...

> ~Um....that's McGruff, taking a bite outta crime!

Seriously though you wouldn't want to freefall very long with that much stuff flapping around would you? I've made the mistake of wearing a collared shirt in the tunnel and I came out black and blue - I'd hate to have a square foot of fabric flapping around my crotch area.



> ~ yeah, stuff like that does flap around a lot, and yes it can be a bit uncomfortable at terminal velocity... but then again I do it for a lot less than 200,000 bucks per, so I guess it's not all THAT bad!

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[skyjack71 0]

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Orange,
I have always wondered about Duane's alleged use of the word "aft" when referring to the stairs and his fear that he left fingerprints on it. It is odd that he would use "aft" (instead of "rear") and odd that Jo would have understood it in context. Fore and aft are nautical terms. Pilots I have heard usually use front and rear.
377

377 - I can answer that.
He did say Aft Stairs becauseI asked him what Aft stairs was (I didn't have a clue) and his reply was that it was the stairways in prisons. Also remember that this was in the middle of the night when he was having a nightmare and talking in his sleep.

To refresh your memory I am restating the story as it has been told from the beginning of all of this..

My response was "You were never in prison". This is when he told me he got in trouble with a couple of guys and spent some time in jail.

I never questioned this - until after his death. I thought it was a couple of months in a county jail as a young man - and I never had reason to doubt what he said in referring to the stairs as Aft Stairs.

Then on May 24, 1996 - 1yr and 2 months later I am reading a book about Cooper - and that was when I found out what Aft-stairs was.

Also remember - WHY I was even reading that book. I had started dating and I had read in a book about widowhood - if a widow becomes acquainted with a gentleman she likes, but does not want to become romantically involved with him - to start talking about her deceased. That is what I did.

I talked about the things that happened in the hospital and what Duane said in the hospital "I'm Dan Cooper" and that I did not understand why he would be telling me such a tale when he knew he only had a few days to live. He became angry with me because I didn't understand what he was talking about.

The Dr had told Duane and I that he would die in about 5 days but he would live for 11 days. The day of the confession was right after he had told the Dr. he wanted to cease the dialysis and was very alert (no drugs) and asked the Dr. if he would want to continue to live in his body. He asked me if I had the briefcase with me as he had requested I keep it with me at all times. I did and he unlocked it and removed papers that had been signed in 1990 regarding his choices. Until then I had no idea that he had already prepared for the end-stage consequences.

If he chose to stay on dialysis - he would have been confined to a bed in a nursing home and maybe occasionally an outings in a wheel chair. He was exercising his right and he was sound of mind.

The gentleman listen as I related what happened the day Duane decided to stop dialysis. He asked me if I had ever thought he might be D.B. Cooper. He had to explain to me who D.B. Cooper was and I told him that yes, because of the statement Duane made when we went of Wa. in 1979 and I had thought the whole trip odd. I had never really gave it a lot of thought.

I was preparing for my real estate license exam. which was a 2 1/2 hour drive from my home. I chose to go there and spend the night before the test. I never crammed before a test so I called this guy and had ask him again what the name was of the man he told me about. (I cannot explain why I didn't remember it - perhaps my mind wanted to know, but my heart got in the way). The library only had one book on Cooper which was mostly fiction.

Thankfully I did not start reading that book in the motel, because I had taken an optional class that afternoon and realized that my instructor had never discussed some of the things we were being told might be on the test. So I spent that night cramming and by the way I was the highest score they had for that test session.

Five of us where asked to stay after everyone else left - I was the last one called in. I would have had a perfect score had I not erased 2 of my answers and changed them --- they noted this and felt I might have had access to the materials prior to testing. I had to sign a written oath regarding this. So this could help you understand my "memory" which is questioned over and over in this forum.

May 24, 1996 at my home I start to read that book - one third of the way thru - I am on the phone to the FBI. I had never known that D.B. Cooper had given his name as "DAN' and it was the first time I had heard the mention of AFT stair again and then it was a flood of memories coming so fast I felt I was drowning or going crazy.

Our life together sudden made sense - the pieces that didn't fit, finally fell into place. After reading about 1/3 of the book I am on the phone with the FBI - was I drinking or taking drugs? It was a useless conversation with them.

After reading 13 more pages I am back on the phone only to be treated the same way I had been treated an hour before.

I hired a private dectective - who helped me to assemble what little I had to get a letter with pictures to Ralph Himmelsback since the FBI wanted no part of this. Please also NOTE - the only composite I had seen was the old Bing Crosby look-alike composite. I had not seen the other composites. My convictions that he was Cooper were based only what I knew regarding what he said and our trip to WA and other things that Duane had said.

NOTE: The only composite in that book is the old Bing Crosby look-alike. The fact that he resembled the other composites comes at a later date.


The author, Max Gunther and I exchanged many phone calls and letters regarding this (I kept all of them). We thought that Clara and another person may have been one and the same. Max admitted he only had 6 phone conversations with her - and that much of the story was fiction, but based on the phone conversations - he changed locations and sequences. I was able to point out the things he had taken from those conversation and the things he changed...the two of us reached our own conclusions regarding this, but chose to remain silent on the issue.....that is forever between Max and myself.

Maybe Max was just pulling my chain.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[quade 3]

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I have always wondered about Duane's alleged use of the word "aft" when referring to the stairs and his fear that he left fingerprints on it. It is odd that he would use "aft" (instead of "rear") and odd that Jo would have understood it in context. Fore and aft are nautical terms. Pilots I have heard usually use front and rear.

A LOT of aviation terminology comes from the nautical tradition; running lights, port, starboard, rudder, ect.

Fore and aft are common terms as in, "the CG of the aircraft is too far aft."

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[377 20]

You are right Quade, but when referring to windows, doors, exits etc. I have always heard pilots use rear, not aft. Have you heard pilots talking about aft exits, windows or doors ever?

True, when speaking about CG, it is aft not rear.

You seem to have your finger on the pulse of many discussions besides the DB Cooper one. Do you read every post in every forum? If you do, how, do you have time for much else? Maybe you just have a nose for courtesy/rules violations and can skip most posts.

No fights in this kennel lately, just a tiny bit of barking and snarling, quickly quelled by tossing a steak into the cage.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[mark 102]

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[W]hen referring to windows, doors, exits etc. I have always heard pilots use rear, not aft. Have you heard pilots talking about aft exits, windows or doors ever?

When speaking to passengers, airline pilots use language they are most likely to understand.

Mark

[skyjack71 0]

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And Jo, throwing the rock at the dog was the worst thing you could do. Hopefully he'll bite you soon.

It was just a pebble besides I couldn't hit an elepant in my yard, much less a BOXER - I was corrected today.

I just knew it was big and it had those big floppy jaws and sad face...I always associated with a bulldog. They are all the same to me...I would say lovable if he wasn't so big.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[snowmman 3]

I got curious about NWA hijacks.

according to:
http://www.mnhs.org/library/findaids/00110.html

NWA had these hijackings:
July 1, 1968: To Cuba.
Jan. 22, 1970: To Cuba
Nov. 24, 1971: D. B. Cooper.
Dec. 24, 1971: Minneapolis-Chicago flight.
May 8, 1977: Tokyo-Honolulu flight.
July 11, 1980: Seattle.

The Dec. 24, 1971 hijacking is interesting. Just a month after Cooper, on christmas eve. It was a Cooper copycat attempt. But just a kid. And he couldn't even get the plane right (707, from another article)
Attached news article.

Another random factoid:
Northwest participated in the Korean airlift. Flying DC-4 aircraft completed 1,380 round-trip trans-Pacific crossings.


I also found a 1963 timetable for NWA. While it's a little old for '71, it has 305 on there, although it looks like it's not exactly the 305 that was there in '71.

But it does point out a couple of things. There weren't a lot of flights from Portland to Seattle..they were part of longer flights from the East. And if you wanted an earlier flight, you had to grab the eastbound flights...which were WAY early in the morning.

So Cooper may have not had much choice on the time, if he wanted to go portland to seattle.

Also, they tended to list the planes on the timetables. This particular one didn't, but I've noticed others that seemed to list the exact plane.

ne64-03 has 305 on it. Others for comparison.
(west vs. east)
(too large to attach)
http://www.timetableimages.com/ttimages/complete/nw63/nw63-01.jpg
http://www.timetableimages.com/ttimages/complete/nw63/nw63-03.jpg
http://www.timetableimages.com/ttimages/complete/nw63/nw63-04.jpg
http://www.timetableimages.com/ttimages/complete/nw63/nw63-06.jpg
http://www.timetableimages.com/ttimages/complete/nw63/nw63-07.jpg

[georger 197]

I own three dogs and do a lot of dog training. I've taught one of them to ride a skateboard. I'd have a hard time believing someone on this thread is going to be able to shout me down about dogs.


REPLY: WELL SAID.


So we can bitch about the "raincoat" or "topcoat" but we're don't even know what kind of coat we're talking about.

REPLY: We dont even know for a fact, he had it on
when he bailed! Tina saw him with it on preparing to go with it on, it appeared to her, but he could have
refitted once Tina was gone, he could have modified
the coat ... there is no evidence he did but he had
enough time. What surpsied Tina was the ease with which he dawned his chute in the first place - like
he was xperienced.

This in no manner diminishes the testimony of the
experts here, but the fact is, nobody was there with
Cooper to witnesses it. And nobody has solved this
case to date, so far as I know.

One limiting factor on tying would be the number of lines he cut from the reserve to tie things down with. You can only tie so much down on your person with n_number of lines of length L.

[georger 197]

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Orange,

My ex had a PhD in clincial psych from UCLA. I went to lots of shrink parties. You could definitely pass as a psychologist, but they are a twisted group, so maybe you want to keep your distance.

I have always wondered about Duane's alleged use of the word "aft" when referring to the stairs and his fear that he left fingerprints on it. It is odd that he would use "aft" (instead of "rear") and odd that Jo would have understood it in context. Fore and aft are nautical terms. Pilots I have heard usually use front and rear.

REPLY: exactly. Maybe Im wrong but as I recall this
Duane's was a death-bed (post diagnosis) confession. Very likely there was cerebral pathology.
I mean an actual underlying physical pathology of which delusional behavior, projection, and self
persecution may have been a part and active for many years. Without tests who would know? But all
of the socalled evidence contrived after the fact.

This could have become what professionals call
"participatory". If you had an ex who was a psychiatrist then you recognise the terminology
and know what Im talking about here.

The particapatory element comes when outsiders
buy into the pathology and enable and promote it.

This is very common in cult behavior. Recall
Jonestown.

Credentials? I finished Kindergarten. I was
particularly good at woodworking and I raised guppies.










377

[skyjack71 0]

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We dont even know for a fact, he had it on
when he bailed! Tina saw him with it on preparing to go with it on, it appeared to her

It has never been said what lenght the raincoat was. At that time 3 lengths were
available. I know that one came mid thigh and another came to or below the knee - how long was the longest?

Guys this is your department - I have forgot what each one was called. The men in my life never wore one that was at or below the knee -( it was mid thigh)usually with a split in the rear,, so let us say it was that lenght - then the parachute straps would have basically secured it around the groin area - if it had been one of the longer lenght it would have created a problem.

Some of the pilots wore longer lenght coats - wonder why? The Delta pilot I dated wore a long one - was that just a matter of choice? Or was the lenght mandated by the airlines?

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[georger 197]

377 - I can answer that.
He did say Aft Stairs becauseI asked him what Aft stairs was (I didn't have a clue) and his reply was that it was the stairways in prisons. Also remember that this was in the middle of the night when he was having a nightmare and talking in his sleep.

REPLY> Was Duane ever diagnosed as being paranoid schizophrenic, or having a brain tumor
or lesion?

G.