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16 hours ago, RobertMBlevins said:

As far as HA HA HA goes, if some people want to believe it was written by Cooper himself, who am I to shatter their illusions? B|

Affirming the consequent is a common blunder in logic.  Just because I can't confirm your story does not mean I believe anything.  I keep an open mind, including the possibility that there may be something to the Ha Ha Ha book.  Am I supposed to just ignore what may be a key piece of evidence in this case because some guy heard from some lady that she met a guy who said he did the artwork and knew the real author?  I strongly consider your story, but it's not enough for me to say it's confirmed, especially since it is only hearsay.  With the lack of hard evidence, it seems like you would have identified the author if you wanted to do some real work on this case.

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(edited)
On 5/7/2019 at 1:46 PM, 377 said:

Good find on that WW2 24 ft B8 rig. Bet it was twill, not ripstop. 

377

 

Found a later 24 FT back rig..  

 

"For sale is a vintage Irvin Military parachute. Lettering on the pack says:  Irvin Standard Air Chute.   Type: Flexible Back.   Item is complete with pilot chute, main canopy, pack, harness, ripcord, back pad, etc.  Documents in the Packing and Inspection Data pouch include a Parachute Inspection Tag that indicates that the canopy is a Reliance 24' made in Nov 1961."

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Irvin-Military-backpack-parachute-with-harness-etc-/173771843458?hash=item28759be782%3Ag%3A9lgAAOSw6IdcU4Km&nma=true&si=dF1ZdeGgD4FTm7g1W5AH2Nhxpow%3D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

 

s-l1600-8.jpg.0763c0b57c9066506bcbe5c503b51943.jpg

Edited by FLYJACK

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18 hours ago, RobertMBlevins said:

As far as HA HA HA goes, if some people want to believe it was written by Cooper himself, who am I to shatter their illusions? B|

It also seems reckless to be interfering with an open investigation if someone else wrote that book, especially coaxing the reader to go searching for a reward.  If you do find out who really wrote it, it would be interesting to know if FBI paid him a visit over it.

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23 hours ago, 4lcy0ne said:

 Less than 20% of that book has anything to do with the Cooper skyjack.  Most of that story is a flashback of the authors earlier escapades.  Seems like if Pro authors were going to publish a book posing as DB Cooper they would have stuck to the plot.

 

So what was the rest of it about? Skydiving? Military? Crime? I'd be interested to read it if I could find one at a reasonable price.

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(edited)

I think this is the Placard part number, haven't found an image to confirm yet.

 

0178AD DECAL - EMERGENCY AIR STAIR HANDLE AFT COMM

0178AD Marker-"Emergency etc." Aero Decals 0178AD, 0178EWRV2FST, Boeing BAC27DPA182

http://www.ozindustrial.com/?page_id=220&partid=592287&partSupplier=Boeing
 

 

It shows for a Boeing (727, 737 series).. the earlier 737 had integrated aft airstair option (side) they were known to pop open.

https://www2.partslogistics.com/demo/search-part_num-BAC27.html

 

https://www.veritableaviation.com/parts-manufacturer-approval/gm-nameplate/bac27dpa182/

Marker - Emergency Airstair Control . . .
(Boeing BAC27DPA182)
Details Available 
0178AD
Details Available
Boeing (727, 737 Series)

 

Edited by FLYJACK

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15 hours ago, RobertMBlevins said:

Your reference is unsupported, and my points are valid. Those are not opinions. Those are facts. An 'actual typed-out article'? That's rich. Sorry, I'm not buying it and neither will anybody else I imagine. Not without a reference. 

I google searched for "parachute found in Amboy was not from Flight 305 as it was too large at 34-feet in diameter", and first link was this (which contains the exact phrase):

https://themountainnewswa.net/2012/05/14/the-hunt-for-db-cooper-looking-for-the-amboy-chute/

Does this help?

 

Edited by Divalent

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1 hour ago, Divalent said:

I google searched for "parachute found in Amboy was not from Flight 305 as it was too large at 34-feet in diameter", and first link was this (which contains the exact phrase):

https://themountainnewswa.net/2012/05/14/the-hunt-for-db-cooper-looking-for-the-amboy-chute/

Does this help?

 

I will be honest with you. I didn't need Google to tell me that the quote Shutter referenced came from a Bruce Smith article. I read the article years ago. What I was trying to do was get Shutter to admit he got that quote from an unreliable source. I never trusted Cossey on that statement, mainly because when he makes it, he still rehashes the same baloney about the chute being made of silk. Here is the full quote:

Quote

I spoke with Coss shortly after the announcement, and he told me that the parachute found in Amboy was not from Flight 305 as it was too large at 34-feet in diameter, and that it was a cargo chute.  Further, he said that the canopy was made with silk and not the nylon which comprised Cooper’s canopy...

And yet, Cossey gave several media sources a DIFFERENT tale, even lying to a reporter and saying the chute WAS Cooper's. I was waiting for Shutter to admit that the quote was simply hearsay via Bruce Smith, and not obtained from any recognized media. Even IF Cossey told Smith this after-the-fact, Cossey did not give this same story to any media, and he was being contacted about that chute quite a bit. And if Cossey continues to stick to that ridiculous 'it's silk and not nylon' story, then why should anyone believe him when he starts quoting sizes and types years later? 

Perhaps the chute is NOT Cooper's. Okay, fine. But let me say this. Cossey could be motivated to NOT identify a chute brought to him as Cooper's for a number of reasons, but the biggest one is that since he told media many times that he OWNED and DELIVERED at least one of the chutes to SeaTac, and this is not true, he could get caught in that lie if he admits a chute he sees actually belonged to Cooper. Because after THAT, the story would go worldwide in a day. And Cossey would eventually be found out on his original lie to many in the media after the hijacking, i.e. he 'stood and delivered' when he did not. 

There is more baloney in the story of the Amboy chute than people realize. For example, the Seattle FBI said in media reports that they not only contacted Cossey, but 'outside experts'. When I asked them about these outside experts, they admitted these people were only contacted by phone, and were never allowed to SEE the chute. Also...Tom Kaye's Citizen Sleuths team have a standing offer with the Seattle FBI asking to examine the chute for themselves. The Seattle FBI, according to a fairly recent email from Tom, have refused this request more than once. I find that suspicious on two levels. 

First, because the FBI already said the chute was not evidence, and in their opinion, was not the one used by Cooper. 

Second, because the FBI already allowed the Citizen Sleuths to examine and analyze much more sensitive evidence in the case, such as the pink parachute, the tie, some of the bills, etc. So why would they refuse a request to examine the Amboy chute, something they dismissed as having no value in the case? They also say today that the Amboy chute IS evidence in the case, a thing they denied years before. 

The whole thing stinks to high heaven, if you ask me. And Cossey's alleged statement to (only) Bruce Smith cannot be trusted. 

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" the parachute found in Amboy was not from Flight 305 as it was too large at 34-feet in diameter, and that it was a cargo chute."

  "He also said it was a WWII vintage parachute."

Hint: You commented twice on the article..the one that never existed.

"Someone 'told' you they received this in an email and you believed it. Either that, or you are making it up. And now your story has changed a bit, to boot."

My reference never changed one bit. I simply stated what I read and stated it was from a quote by Cossey in an article from years ago. what could I change? I don't make things up. 

I told you at the start of this that I was too busy at the moment to say anything further and you went in to auto-discredit making all kinds of assumptions and accusations that were totally false. we went through a similar issue with your trip. you didn't want to listen. 

If the FBI did get back chutes from Cossey his credibility will no longer suffer from people calling him a liar. you would never have done that, right? 

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21 minutes ago, mrshutter45 said:

" the parachute found in Amboy was not from Flight 305 as it was too large at 34-feet in diameter, and that it was a cargo chute."

  "He also said it was a WWII vintage parachute."

Hint: You commented twice on the article..the one that never existed.

"Someone 'told' you they received this in an email and you believed it. Either that, or you are making it up. And now your story has changed a bit, to boot."

My reference never changed one bit. I simply stated what I read and stated it was from a quote by Cossey in an article from years ago. what could I change? I don't make things up. 

I told you at the start of this that I was too busy at the moment to say anything further and you went in to auto-discredit making all kinds of assumptions and accusations that were totally false. we went through a similar issue with your trip. you didn't want to listen. 

If the FBI did get back chutes from Cossey his credibility will no longer suffer from people calling him a liar. you would never have done that, right? 

Well, I can see why you hemmed and hawed around for a dozen posts and hesitated to say the quote came from a Bruce Smith article. Bruce, even though he likes to think so, is not a recognized member of any media organization. He runs a free WordPress blog, same as I do. Not to say HE isn't telling the truth regarding the statement by Cossey. He's probably quoting what Cossey told him, sure. But that doesn't mean Cossey was being truthful. Four years previous to the Smith article, Cossey is giving a different story to reporters from the Vancouver, Seattle, and other major papers. And notice how Cossey still sticks to his 'silk, not nylon' story. If he had RETRACTED that part, and admitted he was wrong, then his story in 2012 where he now gives an alleged size and type on the chute would be more believable. 

What does the trip to Castle Rock to do a placard search have to do with any of this, by the way? I already told you why the trip was canceled. I was convinced to cancel it after reading posts by you and others explaining why the whole thing would be a waste of time. And I told you privately you were RIGHT about that. 

What accusations? I asked for a reference to the quote. You refused a dozen times until someone else finally did it for you, although I kind of suspected where that quote came from in the first place. I just wanted YOU to admit it originated from Bruce Smith, and not some place like the New York Times. You also did an additional quote that sounded more like an email message, so I questioned that as well. 

You were right when you said that because of the prevailing winds on the evening of the crime, the length of time it would take for the placard to reach the ground, the fact that even if the dummy chute and the briefcase and the placard had gone out the back together....that anything except the placard would be miles away. You were right. The plan to search the Castle Rock area would have cost me money and been a big waste of everyone's time, including the people who had volunteered to attend. Was I going to ignore that advice from the experts, and tell Darren S from the Cooper Vortex podcast to go ahead and drive there all the way from Idaho? Or tell Nicky B it was okay for him to buy a round-trip plane ticket from LA to Portland to join in this search? That's a lot of time, a lot of money by both of them for a wasted effort, wouldn't you say? So...I did the right thing, the sensible thing, told them the truth of the matter, and CANCELED. I don't see anything evil or wrong about that. 

We're organizing a regular Cooper Campout to an area SE of Eugene, Oregon instead, which makes a lot more sense. I posted the new notice about that over at Darren's Facebook page, and he upvoted it right away. 

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(edited)

Robert, you have no proof he's wrong. the jumpers are also looking at what we are looking at. 377 believes it's twill and not silk or nylon. you question the opinion based on believing it's been in the ground for decades. where is your proof? 

 

If not mistaken. I cancelled your trip..I mentioned you should go ahead and cancel because I wasn't going to give a "shout out" and you replied, DONE...

Edited by mrshutter45

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4 minutes ago, mrshutter45 said:

Robert, you have no proof he's wrong. the jumpers are also looking at what we are looking at. 377 believes it's twill and not silk or nylon. you question the opinion based on believing it's been in the ground for decades. where is your proof? 

 

If not mistaken. I cancelled your trip..I mentioned you should go ahead and cancel because I wasn't going to give a "shout out" and you replied, DONE...

I'll admit I didn't see a lot of general Cooperland support for the search in Castle Rock. Why should I start using the AB debit card to finance a search no one except a few people wanted, or supported? But a shout out from the Cooper Forum wouldn't do much good anyway. The public cannot see links or pictures there, only registered members, so what would be the point? I'm not much for preaching to the choir. My post at the Quora Space on Cooper about the proposed search went out to over 700 people the moment I posted it. But most of them do not live in the Pacific Northwest, and although they are interested in the Cooper case, only a few post up actively on the case. And only two of them agreed to participate in the search. (Nicky B and Darren S.) 

It was no big deal, really. The major reason I canceled was because I could see certain people were right when they said it would have been a big waste of everyone's time. I returned one of the metal detectors to Amazon, and kept the other just on general principles. 

As far as the chute being made of silk, no...I don't believe it was. Silk is biodegradable. It is a natural substance, like cotton, as opposed to nylon, which can last for many years buried in the ground. Chute folks who saw pictures posted by the FBI more or less agreed it was not silk. The manufacturing date of February 1946 pretty much precludes that possibility anyway. The war had just ended and no one was making chutes out of silk anymore. Why Cossey went with that tale is beyond my understanding. 

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I told you in a PM that I wouldn't support anyone searching where you were going. I even gave you an idea Flyjack stated about the possibility of the panel going with the placard. you are unpredictable with these events and cancellations. who would promote this while you keep turning it on and off like a light switch..

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3 hours ago, mrshutter45 said:

I told you in a PM that I wouldn't support anyone searching where you were going. I even gave you an idea Flyjack stated about the possibility of the panel going with the placard. you are unpredictable with these events and cancellations. who would promote this while you keep turning it on and off like a light switch..

Oh, come on now. You are on the record in several places saying you would NEVER support ANYTHING as long as it was being organized by the staff of Adventure Books of Seattle. We both know that. That's fine, and you have a right to that. I didn't turn things on and off like a light switch. I had doubts. I had hesitations about the search. And the posts that followed about it, both here at Dropzone and at other venues only convinced me the search would be a waste of time. Of course I had doubts. Of course I had some stress about it. Darren was going to drive from Idaho down to Portland, pick up Nicky, and bring him along. Nicky was about to spring for a round trip plane ticket. I kept telling him to 'hold' on that in my emails to him. I asked him to wait on making that purchase until I was sure I knew what I was doing. For Darren, it was a trip of 365 miles to Portland to pick up Nicky, then another sixty or so to the campsite. Each way. That's a round trip of 850 miles driving, and not something I was taking lightly. And the cost to Nicky for his LA to Portland round trip flight. 

When it became apparent that any search in the location where the placard was discovered would be useless, plus the fact there wasn't a lot of Cooperland support on it, I did the sensible thing. And the Eugene, Oregon trip will NOT be canceled. We're going for sure. 

Edited by RobertMBlevins

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4 minutes ago, mrshutter45 said:

That's correct. you also asked me if I would of done the same in your situation with others and I told you yes. you are mixing two into one here...

 

Now, I believe this subject is closed. it has nothing to do with Cooper. it's all drama related..

 

It had PLENTY to do with Cooper. It was a topic of discussion for a while at both the Cooper Forum and at Dropzone. Nothing dramatic about it. I was simply being honest with people regarding your present stand on anything Cooper-related that happens to have AB's name attached to it. It's not exactly some big secret, you know. That's okay with me, as I said, you have a right to that stand. But it wasn't THAT which convinced me to cancel the search. It was the logical posts I read telling me the search was a waste of time. I couldn't allow Nicky and Darren to commit all that time, driving, flying, and money to something that was completely useless in the first place. I do have a conscience, you know. 

I have had much success with the Cooper Campouts so far. This will be the fourth one. The only one where we didn't get full attendance (14, and up to 20 people if we spread them out a bit at the campsites) was the one held in March 2019. But it was the sudden snowstorm in Seattle that mostly caused all that. I had to keep changing the dates, and then people had to cancel when I did. We only got six people that time, plus myself and Greg the Techie Guy. I'm not even sure we will go max on the Oregon trip in June, but I need a vacation anyway and I've already purchased everything I need except the food, so we go no matter what. 

 

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I just seen the member who posted the link to Bruce's site. that's called an oversight or mistake. what I don't believe is the statement of already knowing about the link. Bruce is not considered a unreliable source anymore than anyone else would be. Bruce Smith has never shown any signs of deception as the other party has multiple times. you are being bias since you are not allowed to post on his site. 

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15 minutes ago, mrshutter45 said:

I just seen the member who posted the link to Bruce's site. that's called an oversight or mistake. what I don't believe is the statement of already knowing about the link. Bruce is not considered a unreliable source anymore than anyone else would be. Bruce Smith has never shown any signs of deception as the other party has multiple times. you are being bias since you are not allowed to post on his site. 

I never said Bruce was being deceptive. I said Cossey's statement regarding the Amboy chute was unreliable, due to his previous history with the media when the chute was originally found in 2008. Big difference. 

As far as not being allowed to post at Bruce's WordPress blog, that does not concern me in the least. It's a totally crazy place with people using false identities constantly to post whatever comments they wish. A total madhouse for sure. You have been there, so have I. 

I have a quote as well about the Amboy chute, and using Google (as you have suggested I do sometimes) maybe you can figure out who said it:

Quote

"I took some time to pester Blevins about the Amboy chute. had him going nuts trying to get me to post an article where Cossey stated the Amboy chute was 34 feet in diameter and was a cargo chute...finally gave him a hint that would give it away. Flyjack Blevins EU are the only members I see there. a couple jumpers and one loner posting ever so often. basically 90% of the posts are from Robert..."

I dunno. Could be anybody. 
Tell you one thing. I need a vacation for sure now. B|

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(edited)

Found this, very interesting though some errors (assumptions)..

 

"On the night of 24 November 1971 a man who became known as D. B. Cooper boarded a Northwest Airlines 727 in Portland OR and then demanded $200,000 in cash and five parachutes, ransom money, and crews to open the back door and he parachuted out of the Seattle-bound plane with the ransom money. He was never found, nor was any validated evidence of him. Beginning in ca. 2000 a youth reportedly found scraps of the marked ransom money along the Columbia River near Vancouver WA. Other reports spotted fragments of his parachute; this has been repudiated. The 190th FIS scrambled two armed F-102A interceptors to shadow the hijacked plane, but the hijacker's cleverness and the nighttime conditions prevented very close observation of the airliner. 190th Pilot Major Gene Winchester recalls the incident and his story in this chapter reveals how carefully planned and executed was 'Cooper's Caper'. In October, the 190th alert crews were called on to assist in what has become known as the D B Cooper Affair. Lee Bernasconi was the 190th's Alert Detachment Commander at the time, and when I asked him about it and who was on alert when it happened, he replied, "Ahh, Winchester ... and I can't remember who else was on that night, Thanksgiving night, or maybe the Friday after Thanksgiving. [Laughing] I was at my home on Cole and Victory, and the phone rings, and two airplanes takeoff. I said, "That's my alert birds!" My home was at Cole and Victory. I said, "Hey, that's my alert birds! What's going on?" They [the night crew in the CAC] said they didn't know—so that's about all I knew. And our interceptors got over there and got generally behind him, but they didn't get there until after he crossed the Columbia River, and I think Cooper was already gone by then. And they followed him for a ways, and finally went in ... refueled, and came home. They didn't have radio contact with the airliner, and... probably stayed two miles back most of the time Gene Winchester remembers that Thanksgiving very well when he and Jack Newland were on alert, and at about 4:50 p.m. "... we got a telephone call saying there was a hijacking taking place, and they were airborne at the time and ... they told us to stand by. And then I guess they landed at Seattle first, and picked up the money and four parachutes and ... then they went over to Portland and landed again and let some of the passengers off. They called us and said this guy has commandeered the plane, and he's got the chutes and the money, and he's at Portland and ... ''what we want you to do is be at Portland in the traffic pattern—don't get too close that you'll bother him or startle him—but we'll put you on him in trail' and they figured he's going to bail out somewhere and so you just follow him, and don't get too close to scare him. The thing was, they told us 'when he bails out the commercial pilot would turn all his lights back on bright flash', and we would fly a triangle pattern to mark this spot on the radar. That was our briefing. "So Jack Newland and I took off and ... watched him take off from Portland and we snuck in to ... about a mile in trail—and it was a little difficult, he was only going 150. And he was staying about 10,000 feet." Recalling his previous cargo plane flying days, Winchester figured "... he'd maintain that altitude and airspeed as a safety factor because if he bailed out at a higher velocity... I had a little trouble keeping flying, so I'd get up on the perch and when I was about to stall, I'd go over and sit on the other side. And the lights never came on—the 'bright- flash' signal—when he jumped out. And I was told that he had displayed a weapon and told the crew to shut the cabin door. So they never knew exactly when he bailed out, that's why they didn't turn the lights on." Winchester continues, "So, evidently he went out there, and we had no way of knowing, and we followed that airliner to Reno—Jack and I, it was Thanksgiving evening, I remember that. We were worried about getting home for Thanksgiving dinner! But our briefing was 'he was going to land at Reno and refuel, and we don't want you to land on the same base with him', so we went over to Hamilton, I believe it was, and they would call us when he took off. I watched him land and that back door of that airplane was dragging on the runway and shooting sparks like—you know when you put a knife on the grinder?!It looked like the sparks was going 50 feet in the air! It's dark, and we probably.... got up there about somewhere around 6 o'clock—it was VFR, it was great—a clear night and we could see other airplanes ... and there were a couple F-106s out of McChord, they came down and were available for a while, then they went back. And we asked Maj Gene Winchester 'What are our instructions?' They said 'Well, we don't know if he's still on the airplane, or if he went out the back door when it stopped, he might be here, we 're going to make a cordon, a perimeter off, and do a ground search... And you go over there and get out of the way and fill up 'cause we think he might be going to Mexico; you might be following him to Mexico And I thought 'That sounds interesting!' So we sit over there for, I don't know, several hours. And then they called us and said 'you could go home'. We got back here about 7:00 a.m., Jack and I."1 Winchester had no direct radio contact with the airline crew, only with FAA Controllers. In the darkness and following in-trail at a safe distance, they never saw Cooper leave the airliner." 

 

 

Edited by FLYJACK

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(edited)

Sounds like a pretty bizarre version of events. They have 305 landing in Portland? I know the F-106's had to keep doing wide 'S' turns just to stay behind the flight because they weren't built to fly as slowly as 305 was going. Most of it sounds legitimate, though. Kinda/sorta/maybe.

Edited by RobertMBlevins

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23 hours ago, EJU said:

Daily DB Cooper Bite. I discuss the FBI's decision to close the DB Cooper case unsolved.

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/DBCooperChannel

 

 

The people investigating D.B. Cooper seem to have an element of frustration with the fact that the FBI is not interested in the case, and that in general the public is not really interested in any of the details.  This research appears to be important to you and your friends, but at what point does it become an unhealthy obsession?  Even if this was solved it would only get a quick snippet of time in the news and then quickly be replaced with something new.  Besides, the FBI has much bigger things to worry about, and any tips they get are probably being handled by some low paid, low level employee.  How would you feel if you were a victim of a crime and found out that the FBI was handling tips about a 50 year old case where no one was hurt and they could have been working your case instead?  Or that the FBI missed out on preventing a crime because they were tied up with tips?  I'm not trying to make anyone feel bad, but this seems like a hobby that you really should not get so wrapped up in.  How many people really care about this?  And what if one of these suspects turns out to be innocent? How would you feel?

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Quote

'The people investigating D.B. Cooper seem to have an element of frustration with the fact that the FBI is not interested in the case, and that in general the public is not really interested in any of the details.  This research appears to be important to you and your friends, but at what point does it become an unhealthy obsession?  Even if this was solved it would only get a quick snippet of time in the news and then quickly be replaced with something new.  Besides, the FBI has much bigger things to worry about, and any tips they get are probably being handled by some low paid, low level employee...'

You might be right if you were talking about FBI headquarters in DC, but I can assure you things are different at the Seattle office of the FBI. Believe it or not, and even though they won't reveal his (or her) identity, a case agent IS still assigned to investigate (wade through) the Cooper stuff. Yes, they still have a case agent assigned to Cooper. They've actually told me this. And only a few months ago. 

The public IS interested. I opened the Cooper Space at Quora in November of 2018. Six weeks later we had over 700 followers. 72,000+ plus people have viewed the KC video at YouTube, and the unedited report on him, a 53-page PDF with pictures, has been downloaded TENS OF THOUSANDS of times from the main AB of Seattle website since its release, and shows no sign of slowing down. Two movie production companies have partnered up to do the first ever, dramatic feature film on the Cooper case. Shooting hasn't started yet, but they still send me $2,000 bucks every February until they do...and the newest producer to sign on board has been in 17 movies and a TV series to date, none of which ever lost any money. (I met with him in Seattle this last January) The fifty or so illustrated articles on the case I have at WordPress average 300 unique visitors a day (or so) and have been for years. I still receive an average of 12-20 emails a week asking this question or that one about the case. Our Cooper Campouts are usually a sellout. (Although it is free to attend)

No...I wouldn't say either the FBI has totally given up on the case, or the public has completely lost interest, especially in the Northwest, although the FBI has said they do have to divert resources to more important matters. But that doesn't mean they wouldn't like to solve it, especially the folks at the SEATTLE office, who are almost legendary in wanting to see it (finally) closed. 

Or...maybe it was closed for ANOTHER reason...(I know this is arrogant, yes...but it HAPPENED)...and that's because they might already know who he is anyway. And just aren't saying it officially. 

One thing I do agree with you on these points is that sometimes people can become obsessed. For example, there is so much animosity going in Cooperland that *some* folks will spend half their internet life telling lies about OTHERS involved in the case, and go to almost any ridiculous length to discredit. Others hurt the case by failing to support things that could raise public interest in the case. Your best bet on how to deal with these things is to do what you do to help promote the case, and ignore the naysayers and the liars. B|

On a side note, five people are now signed to go on the latest Cooper Campout in late June. Anyone and everyone is invited, even if we've had 'issues' before. Internet stuff is one thing. Personal gatherings are another. I can tell you this much. No one has ever complained they didn't have any fun. Six weeks to go, and I think we will be able to fill the usual fourteen slots. I had doubts because this one is in Oregon, and all of the others were held in the Olympic Mountains of Washington, mostly near the Skokomish River area above Shelton. 

 

Edited by RobertMBlevins

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