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DB Cooper

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Wasn't that the most ridiculous outfit you ever saw - Plaid jacket, diagonal striped tie & pink shirt. I forgot to look at the shoes...

His hair is dark & I do not know the man with him...but obviously someone with the company - manager or another agent.

What I was doing was trying to find what the location was.....I thought the area of the flag on the right hand side with a tower behind it might help to locate this American Income Ins. Office...it doesn't show in the posted pic as it was cropped.

We know Duane probably didn't go to work for American income until 1969 or 1970.

He was in prison in 1968 and then to CO where he and the wife and kids fled from the FBI to New Orleans. This was when they were befriend by David Ferrie - the guy with no hair or eyebrows. It was during a Hurricane Camille they headed to Atlanta. I believe this is when he hooked up with American Income.

That outfit looked like it came out of a thrift store or good will.

The tie and shirt were OK, but the JACKET!
What was with that JACKET - was it Halloween?

Was the Jacket a loaner - I just do not get it. What the picture does tell us is the hair was dark...with just a hint of grey which he wife would later keep dyed for him...she was the one who told me this.

When I met Duane he had white hair and gun metal gray - I had never met the man in that picture - if I had - I would never have married him.

Someone sure did a good job of polishing him off in the next 2 or 3 yrs. The wife told me he would disappear for a wk or a wk end & said he was going with another guy to AL to clean out basements and attics. They left in a van (one time she said red & in another coversation she said white). It was during this time Duane asked his wife to buy him some dickies (work jumpsuits). This was in 1970/1971 in the Atlanta area.

All the more puzzling was how Duane had the money to loan his BOSS $1800 in Oct of 1975.

He must have been busting his ass selling insurance and cleaning attics? Well, he was definitely doing something....he and his wife bought a home and 2 new cars in 1972....in January and then got divorced that summer??????

He was making enough to have a girl friend on the side...whose brother was a dentist and Duane did jobs for him in the lab...Duane was very good with his hands and could make a room shine.

Duane told me about the dentist and the equipment he learned to use to make the bridges....I assume to pay for the beautiful bridge he had placed in 1972 - perhaps he help make it...

The thing that man could do - with very little to work with was amazing.

NOW that jacket - is just way out there.
Yet, when I look back and see how he had to live his life & the steps he made forward in his life - yes I am proud of what he became in the 18 yrs we spent together.

I had NO idea what his life was like before I met him. He had some rough edges, but he polished up just FINE!

How or why we made if for 18 yrs I will never know - but, I wonder if I had seen that picture & have known about his criminal record - what would I have done?

You guys know what I would have done - I would have run in the opposite direction!

He came from good stock and his family was well known and admired - he was considered the bad apple. His brother became an engineer with Boeing and was a personal friend of Stanley Gilliam.

Duane's and his brother knew Gilliam because of the connection their mother had to the woman that Gilliam married. They all lived in relatively condense location in CA for a period of time. Duane's brother & Gilliam where both living in WA in 1971 & they both worked for Boeing.

Oh well, just as well try to tell a judge that black is white and red all over. No one gets it.
Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

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Experience flying as a loadmaster would provide Cooper with most of the information he needed. The chute & how to use it - does not need multiple classes just the basics.

Intermountain Communication & Duane's connections to them provide him all of the access to the specifics he needed to make the jump.

Anyone remember the Southeast Asia flight with a 727 or similar plane. Why did Duane claim to know 2 of the men in the picture attached? There was an incident with one of the Southeast Asian flights Duane told me story about - the guy getting his foot stuck - I do not remember the details - but the guy survived hanging half out of the plane.

The DuBop pic will not down load but most of you have seen it.
Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

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"On the evening of the hijacking, it took NWA some time to locate any people at Boeing who had knowledge of lowering the stairs in flight. That program was simply not common knowledge either at Boeing or any commercial airline."

Forgot who wrote the above, but Duane knew Stanley Gilliam who received a phone call from an unauthorized caller.

The call was accidently put thru.

The caller wanted verification of information regarding the 727 and the testing they had done previously.

Stanley did not recognize the voice & afterward out the call came thru unauthorized. Gilliam contacted the FBI himself in reference to this.

Stanley Gilliam was married to the GOD child of Duane Lorin Weber's mother.

Lorraine Beecher Weber was the name of Duane's mother. Her best friend gave birth to a Daughter - one month before or after Duane was born. They used to visit each other - even when Duane's family lived in Ohio.

That GOD DAUGHTER became the bride of Stanley Gilliam.

Duane had spent some good times at "The Stuckee House" - the talked about the family on our trip in 1980 to WA., but that we were not going there. He told me the Goddaughter had worked for MA BELL, but didn't know if she still did so.

Later many yrs Later in my investigation of Cooper - this story was VERIFIED and Gilliam had related the story to other family member.

When Cooper called Gilliam's office he did not recognize the voice of the boy who was now a man in his 40's.

:)[:/] This statement can be proven!

Stanley Gilliam & Duane Weber's brother (John C. Collins) were best friends who both worked for Boeing and also shared a joint financial venture that failed. THE FBI REFUSED TO EVEN CHECK IT OUT!

SO WHAT IS OUR GOVERNMENT HIDING?


T
Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

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Cooper just wanted to go South - he knew the plane would have to stay in the vector, but what if they chose to go out over sea - well he would just have threaten to blow his bomb.

He didn’t know how to operate the aft way & wanted it down so he could see the lights of the Dams & other land marks he knew from the AIR. He and /or a friend had participated in an activity that gave him that knowledge of the 727 and the Aft stairs.

Every airport he knew & commented about he & the boys flying in & out of.
When I finally asked him on our way to Tahoe thru Oregon what they were doing....he was caught off guard & just told me he couldn't talk about it. I was the one to ask if it was during war time or the fire bombs. He had his out.

Duane Weber knew very body of water, every tower, every power lines, the pipe lines, the signal towers, the air strip. He pointed out & showed me these things - how did he know all of this. NOT ONE TIME DID HE LOOK AT A MAP. I wrote about these things on the thread & communicated these things to Himmelsbach. I trusted he was sharing them with active FBI. He told me he really didn't know the area that well & to contact JT.

I didn’t know what I was talking about - but, I did the best I could to describe the places to JT as he was the one Himmelsbach told me knew the area. Well, we all know how that went down. I spent 5 yrs talking to a stone wall...and then more time on this thread.

It was 2001 when the crew took me to WA., but they took me in all the wrong places! Why if they were going to invest in a documentary - did the NOT have the proper guides & information. IT was all a bust...I do not know if that segment ever aired....remember I only had & still only have antennae in my attic.

JT did NOT understand one damn thing I was describing - he kept saying Cooper landed further East. NO one understood the area I was describing until I went to WA in 2010 & found ALL of the places I tried to tell other about...all by myself.

A couple of places I never found because of the changes from 1979 to 2010 - yrs of changes. Places he just talked about & didn't take me near - I was blank on...but if I saw it in 1979 I remembered it.
Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

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skyjack71: You say ""On the evening of the hijacking, it took NWA some time to locate any people at Boeing who had knowledge of lowering the stairs in flight. That program was simply not common knowledge either at Boeing or any commercial airline."

I say: "Sheridan Peterson and I were both at Boeing before Norjak (I was in the Structures Test Lab and he was in the Manuals and Handbooks group and both in the 9-101 building) and knew all about 727 Airstairs Testing in the B-29 hanger and Flight Tests at Moses Lake. It was common knowledge to us.!!!"

Bob Sailshaw
sailshaw00@gmail.com

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The biggest questions are WHO took the picture, and WHY? We already know for certain that Christiansen lived alone at this particular residence. Yet...someone snapped it as he was entering the apartment. But...he has no key in his hand, although he looks a little surprised. Very strange. We think the photographer was his friend Bernie Geestman, and that the photo was a purposely-staged memento. We do NOT believe the bag and briefcase Christiansen holds are the actual items used in the hijacking. Repeat: NOT the actual items. But it is very coincidental that he is dressed similarly to the hijacker for such a picture, carrying those items, and taken around the time of the hijacking.

Well...and it looks like he's maybe wearing a black raincoat...more of a topcoat. It's too long to be a suit jacket. ;)

EDIT: Looking at the pose in the picture, the door is fully open. Both of Christiansen's hands are occupied. There is no set of keys visible in the lock, or in his hand. He is not seen pushing open the door.

Conclusion: Staged photograph, most likely. Reason unknown.





Okay how about this...(well I have enough people for company so I don't feel "that" stupid anymore with my comments :P)..Anyways...

This is one of the most popular pics by which KC is being pinned as DBC. Anyways about the questions you have about the pic... is it possible that the pic was taken after 1974 (sorry I couldn't see the date on the pic as you mentioned). That is owing to KC's resemblance with DBC they decided to play a prank of sorts in which he dresses up like him and for the memento sake took that pic.

It is, otherwise, eerily similar to the description of DBC but then DBC description was quite non descript.

Or just take the pic at face value rather than splitting hair on matters like keys, wreath, his expression etc. Besides didn't he had a more visible receding hairline in 72 (date of pic) compared to DBC composite. (I remember either you or Jo has written something about it like colouring the hair or something, a bit foggy on it though).

Sorry a bit busy and was not able to look up for a few days, another confusion I have is that why KC or DW were not picked up by FBI in '74 itself?

I mean I understand that they my not be the most social of people however they were still living normal lives around normal people... and DBC case was no hidden mystery, it was apparently all over the television so how come no one came forward reporting them as suspects??

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sailshaw

skyjack71: You say ""On the evening of the hijacking, it took NWA some time to locate any people at Boeing who had knowledge of lowering the stairs in flight. That program was simply not common knowledge either at Boeing or any commercial airline."

I say: "Sheridan Peterson and I were both at Boeing before Norjak (I was in the Structures Test Lab and he was in the Manuals and Handbooks group and both in the 9-101 building) and knew all about 727 Airstairs Testing in the B-29 hanger and Flight Tests at Moses Lake. It was common knowledge to us.!!!"

Bob Sailshaw
sailshaw00@gmail.com




(I know the comment is for Ms. Jo) Anyways the airstair thing is popular perception though...not sure how it began though. If I am not wrong Wikipedia says that (irrespective of quality it is the biggest source of most people's stories and "research")....

Anyways it seem same as the weather thingy, wherein most of us (Cooper commoners ;)) were led to believe that it was a thunderous night....that myth also got busted on this forum only.

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RobertMBlevins

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'Blevins, if you add ONE more detail that was not disclosed by JO to the FBI yrs ago and in this thread - YOU will hear me SCREAM all the way to WA.


Everytime I mentioned anything - you conveniently have incorporated it in to your story.....IF YOU TOUCH THE RAIN COAT - YOU WILL REGRET IT.'



I have no idea what you told the FBI about anything. Like you, I do have pictures, though. Only sometimes they have dates and clues on them that can lead you to where, when, and by whom they were taken.

For example, here is Kenny Christiansen in a picture that is stamped FEB 72 across the bottom front of the original. (Refers to the the date the picture was developed, and is placed there by the company who developed the negative.)

However...the Christmas wreath on the door leads us to believe it was actually taken between Thanksgiving and Christmas of 1971 and developed the following year. The location was identified as the Rainier View Apartments, Sumner, WA, Apt. J-3. I have seen this place personally and it still exists under the same name. It could even have been taken BEFORE Thanksgiving, but probably not long before the start of the traditional holiday season.

The biggest questions are WHO took the picture, and WHY? We already know for certain that Christiansen lived alone at this particular residence. Yet...someone snapped it as he was entering the apartment. But...he has no key in his hand, although he looks a little surprised. Very strange. We think the photographer was his friend Bernie Geestman, and that the photo was a purposely-staged memento. We do NOT believe the bag and briefcase Christiansen holds are the actual items used in the hijacking. Repeat: NOT the actual items. But it is very coincidental that he is dressed similarly to the hijacker for such a picture, carrying those items, and taken around the time of the hijacking.

Well...and it looks like he's maybe wearing a black raincoat...more of a topcoat. It's too long to be a suit jacket. ;)

EDIT: Looking at the pose in the picture, the door is fully open. Both of Christiansen's hands are occupied. There is no set of keys visible in the lock, or in his hand. He is not seen pushing open the door.

Conclusion: Staged photograph, most likely. Reason unknown.



Do you have a high resolution scan of this photograph? Would you mind posting it?

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RobertMBlevins

You know...if you would stop speaking for the FBI regarding Christiansen...I wouldn't have to keep re-posting some of the messages I received, or quote phone calls I got from the Seattle FBI about Christiansen

They have already told me not once, but twice, that some in the Seattle office think he's a good suspect, while other agents believe there are better suspects. That is very fair, in my opinion, and probably reflects the reality of the situation.

They also said he had not been eliminated as a suspect. If you want, I will drag out the emails again...

In January, I gave them another way out if they wanted. I told them we had developed a new, and more updated report on KC. Would they like to see it, I asked. I figured if they had decided KC was totally worthless as a suspect, they would have declined. This is what they said:

Quote

"Send it along when ready..."



I don't like to rub it in, but Duane's the only one lately besides Marla Cooper's uncle who has been officially dismissed as a suspect by the Seattle FBI...not Christiansen. Still, I am one of the few around here who doesn't claim a suspect is 'for sure' DB Cooper. Because I know that claim has not been proven as yet. On the other hand, you keep telling everyone that Duane was the hijacker but you haven't presented a single named witness who can corroborate even a PIECE of your claim. Not one, not anyone who can be contacted. You just don't give people anything realistic to go on.

Even though I didn't release the final report on KC publicly, I know there are copies of the original, shorter, (and slightly inaccurate) report out there. But there ARE names and locations attached to that report. If anyone really wanted to do so, they could probably use the old report to contact at least a portion of the witnesses.

If you had any evidence, it is no longer in existence. Not to say Duane wasn't the hijacker. Yes, he could be. But unless you can provide something solid to go on...how do ever expect to prove this allegation that Duane was Cooper? This is not my fault, or anyone's fault but yours. Maybe you should have done a book, or worked with the media. Maybe THEY could have assisted you. Your refusal to do that and stand alone with your claim makes it difficult to support you.

Kenny Christiansen may not be DB Cooper, but by God we surely presented a good amount of evidence against him, and against Bernie Geestman. Not enough to convict. But enough for people to take notice. Twelve different witnesses. Documents and pictures, some of which have not been made public. Mucho testimony. Names, addresses, emails, and phone numbers provided. Excuse me, but when have you ever done such a thing in your effort to prove Duane was the guy? You say you are afraid of lawsuits, etc. sometimes. We've done WAY worse. A book, articles galore with pictures and real names and the towns where they live.

And yet four years later there is not a peep out of anyone we named with any type of legal threats, phone calls to our office, requests to cease and desist, etc. Nothing, nada, nobody, no how. And even if someone did that, then they have to prove we're telling lies about them...which means they would have to answer possibly difficult questions to prove their case. Am I worried about any of this? NO.

And some people HAVE taken notice of our efforts...I am starting to receive messages from some of the folks who were given the final report on Christiansen.



Robert, perhaps I missed it, but when did the FBI completely rule out LD?
"They were saying he was never gonna make it now, now that daylight had set in. But later that night, they were shining those lights back down on that mountain again." - Todd Snider

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thousandthings

(I remember either you or Jo has written something about it like colouring the hair or something, a bit foggy on it though).

Why KC or DW were not picked up by FBI in '74 itself?

DBC case was no hidden mystery, it was apparently all over the television so how come no one came forward reporting them as suspects??



Edited to keep brief. Duane L. Weber immediately left the area and moved from his current address in 1971 to a new address in 1972....the Cooper case was NOT strong in the East as some of you might think.

Blevins claims his suspect was wearing a wig...but Cooper did NOT have a wig on & the witnesses described a hair line with tiny peaks.

Shaffner did her best to make this known. Later in life she is so haunted by Cooper she was overly conscieous of his finding her....

Weber's hair was being dyed by his wife until the skyjacking. Photo will prove this.

I will see if I have a photo dated 1974.
He immediately gained a lot of weight due to eating well.

I just viewed the pics I have on the computer...nothing in my online file. I did find one of him in 1974, but will have to take it somewhere & have them remove the blonde doll on his arm.. His hair is VERY gray and White in the pic. Thought there was one in my files - but they have been corrupted.

I do have other files on a disk just encase.

Give me a few days to find it in all of this mess...lots of pain with my arm, but need to see how other tests come out before surgery is schedule & I will need someone to take care of me for 8 wks or so...I can't afford a caretaker...so do not know how I will handle this. No family available and no one who lives in the area other than paid caregivers.
Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

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RobertMBlevins

.

If you had any evidence, it is no longer in existence. Not to say Duane wasn't the hijacker. Yes, he could be. But unless you can provide something solid to go on...how do ever expect to prove this allegation that Duane was Cooper? This is not my fault, or anyone's fault but yours. Maybe you should have done a book, or worked with the media. Maybe THEY could have assisted you. Your refusal to do that and stand alone with your claim makes it difficult to support you.



DUH!
I sent you things you could have handled when you were supposedly doing other research...things that would have been in public records but not things that are on the computer...


Old property records!
How many times did I ask for help in the location you were supposedly going to?

I do not live in WA!

You were going to certain locations & I asked you several times to check on things...but you are making things up & all of those trips I do not believe you made.

These so called camping trips you supposedly take very often - on the surface those who know WA are doubtful you are really taking the multiple trips you have claimed in this thread. I have watched the hours & your trips & postings & cancellations. The timing never made any sense!

You supposedly still have time for a girl friend, to write & edit multiple things...

The story you spin is contrived & every bit of it goes right back to Porteous. You are either a liar, very gullible, in cahoots with others or Porteous is USING you & maybe you are exactly the puppet he was looking for when he and I first contacted. He denies it according to you Robt. I know were I have been & who I have talked to.

If I lived in WA & someone had contacted me asking me to check on their subject & the backgrounds intermingled & the story intermingled regarding time lines & individuals...I would have been all over it. No problem with asking the right questions in the right place IF you are TRULY searching for THE TRUTH!

YOU DO NOT WANT THE TRUTH - ALL YOU WANT IS ATTENTION.

All U want is to sell A BOOK & TO PROFIT. YOU CONTINUALLY IGNORE ANYTHING THAT WOULD INVOLVE ANOTHER SUBJECT.

HOW MANY THINGS DID I ASK YOU TO CHECK ON WHEN YOU WERE IN THE AREA CHECKING ON OTHERS? You did not one time asked any of your "witnesses" anything that might point to others - exclude or to include subjects! In fact you have not had that many conversations with any of them.

You came into this with things I chased & followed & I did it with no knowledge of how to do a search. I just chased the things Duane told me about & showed me & I made phone calls I could not really afford prior to getting unlimited long distance. You pretend to help, but merrily a quise to build your story or hide your source.

IF U HAD BEEN INTERESTED IN THE TRUTH - U WOULD HAVE READ BACK AND CHECKED OTHERS OUT.....

U DID ALL THIS BECAUSE OF PROTEOUS? DID HE SET YOU UP OR DID HE SET ME UP OR DID HE PLAY BOTH OF US.

ALL OF the things I knew about FOSS TUGS & what Duane told me - all matched up & co-mingled with KC. DID ALL OF THAT COME from Porteous.
WHO REALLY IS PORTEOUS? Anyone can be anyone on the computer.

So who is the ruse? Blevins, Bernie Geestman, the Detective, Foss Tuggs,
Margie? Maybe MEIRE is behind all of this - is Porteous a protege of Meire & his friends. Litttle bird said Meire is writing a book - a little late considering his age.

I was telling this story in 1996 to anyone who took the time to listen...
Mostly I was talking to JT & Mr. Himmelsbach....yet, you come along & adapted the things Duane told me to your story.


The thing I learned thru Duane's old records and tracking is remaining friends...a family tree that would prove Weber's connections to some of the very individuals you proclaim to hold the truths.

You never even bothered to check out the family trees or pictures...you knew your sources were misled & /or you used them!

IF you really investigated or cared about the truth - WHAT was the harm of asking your "witnesses" to view photos or to ask about family member from yrs ago? U WERE following orders! I know why & I have watched all of this unfold right here in the thread.

ALL of the things you used are things I repeatedly told over the yrs...but you didn't even bother to READ BACK & see what Jo was all about...You denied 101 after it was zapped...the site is gone, but HARD copies do not just go POOF. Your source was 101 & Porteous.

If I had been in your shoes - because I am truely seeking the truth...I would have been all over it & investigating both suspects at the same time!

You are not seeking the truth - infact I think YOU are a BLIND SET UP TO DISTRACT FROM THE TRUTHS
Knowingly or unknowingly - that is the question.

This is a HUNTING GAME & the PI IS PLAYING YOU TO THE LIMITS...OR PERHAPS HE NEEDS TO DISTRACT THE PUBLIC FROM THE REAL TRUTH as a matter of SURVIVAL.

When GRAY got his tip I have watched you & Porteous & Lyle play a game way beyond the extent of truths. Lyle wanted to back out.

Go back in time to 1996 with Himmelsbach, JT & Myself and you will find in all of my old exchanges with Mr. H....the VERY same things U & Porteous garnered your KC story on.

Step back in time to the 60's and then march forward full speed...HOW & WHY did I know about KC and Margie and Foss Tugs and that little town along the coast line where Geestman lives now? I knew about the trailer & that is was top of the line for the times. Duane told me about the trailer & he used Geestman's name.
I just would not know who Geestman was or make the connection until you started to play your story out.

There is something about this in this thread or the old thread LONG before anyone ever heard of Blevins.
I had all of that before anyone ever heard of you. You are a DECOY or is PORTEOUS USING U OR ARE U USING PORTEOUS?

Porteous shaddowed me from his place yrs ago to meet his goal...He was supposedly walking away & then you got involve. Who is taking who for a ride?
Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

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skyjack71


I will see if I have a photo dated 1974.
He immediately gained a lot of weight due to eating well.

I just viewed the pics I have on the computer...nothing in my online file. I did find one of him in 1974, but will have to take it somewhere & have them remove the blonde doll on his arm.. His hair is VERY gray and White in the pic. Thought there was one in my files - but they have been corrupted.

I do have other files on a disk just encase.

Give me a few days to find it in all of this mess...lots of pain with my arm,



Sure...I'll wait..take care

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'The thing I learned thru Duane's old records and tracking is remaining friends...a family tree that would prove Weber's connections to some of the very individuals you proclaim to hold the truths.

You never even bothered to check out the family trees or pictures...you knew your sources were misled & /or you used them!

IF you really investigated or cared about the truth - WHAT was the harm of asking your "witnesses" to view photos or to ask about family member from yrs ago? U WERE following orders! I know why & I have watched all of this unfold right here in the thread.

ALL of the things you used are things I repeatedly told over the yrs...but you didn't even bother to READ BACK & see what Jo was all about...You denied 101 after it was zapped...the site is gone, but HARD copies do not just go POOF. Your source was 101 & Porteous.

If I had been in your shoes - because I am truely seeking the truth...I would have been all over it & investigating both suspects at the same time!'



By the time you asked me to do these things, I was no longer making long trips to Twisp and elsewhere. The last time was in October 2010.

Why don't you just join Ancestry dot com or something?

These connections you keep trying to make regarding the Geestman couple and Duane Weber? Did you ever mention these things prior to my first posting at Dropzone? (Answer is 'no')

Do you know the term 'Six Degrees of Separation'? It goes like this:

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'Six degrees of separation is the theory that anyone on the planet can be connected to any other person on the planet through a chain of acquaintances that has no more than five intermediaries. The theory was first proposed in 1929 by the Hungarian writer Frigyes Karinthy in a short story called "Chains."



There is no plot, no conspiracy, regarding the investigation into Kenny Christiansen. Lyle Christiansen talked to Porteous. Porteous talked to Gray. Porteous wanted to do a book. Gray wanted to do a book, but began with a news article. I contacted Porteous and showed interest in publishing his book because the Cooper case happened right up the street from where I live. Gray does his book. I got roped into doing the road work for the investigation into Christiansen. Book came out later, a more thorough investigation happened afterward. Investigation is basically complete. Results submitted. No conclusions as yet.

That's about it. And I don't have a clue what '101' means, besides the famous coast highway sign.

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'Step back in time to the 60's and then march forward full speed...HOW & WHY did I know about KC and Margie and Foss Tugs and that little town along the coast line where Geestman lives now? I knew about the trailer & that is was top of the line for the times. Duane told me about the trailer & he used Geestman's name. I just would not know who Geestman was or make the connection until you started to play your story out...'



All of these things you mention have been public knowledge for years, ever since the book and the two TV shows came out. And from my posts here. And from the original report, which was made public in December 2012. By the way...the trailer was not 'top of the line.' It was an old Airstream and Helen Jones said it smelled when she and her family lived in it for a while. And Oakville is nowhere near the coast of Washington. You refer to the place Geestman lives NOW...Port Angeles area...and Duane was already passed away when he moved there.

thousandthings asks:

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'This is one of the most popular pics by which KC is being pinned as DBC. Anyways about the questions you have about the pic... is it possible that the pic was taken after 1974..'



No. It is a photograph of an old snapshot. You know the type, with a white border all around the picture. Date stamp at the bottom by the developer says FEB 72. The Christmas wreath indicates it was probably snapped during the previous holidays. I think I posted up the full original once here, showing the date stamp. If not, I can do it if you wish


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By the time you asked me to do these things, I was no longer making long trips to Twisp and elsewhere. The last time was in October 2010.



:PDUH! YOU made arrangement and talked about going TO TWISP & told the thread about her bill being paid by the attorney..Hard to believe this was 4 yrs ago.

Later you refuted & said you only called yet you definitely stated you were going to TWISP. You make grand plans & canceled them. You often misled the reader - making elaborate plans & then acting like you carried it out only to refute what you said previously.


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These connections you keep trying to make regarding the Geestman couple and Duane Weber? Did you ever mention these things prior to my first posting at Dropzone? (Answer is 'no')



[:/]I talked about the RV & the man who lived on the coastline & the guys. I talked about the man who worked for the tug boats (Duane told me the name - but I didn't remember it until I heard it again & that was when you came to the thread). THIS was when you got my attention.

I talked about the guy who used to work with the Tugboats when we went to the river at the BIG GREEN TANK....that was very early on in this thread. you have stated you did not read the thread before you started posting!I posted about interviewing the man who owned it as it was not the previous owner....if not on the thread in PM's to Cook. Pretty damn sure I posted about this - long long before you ever came to the thread & something I did by PHONE before I use the computer.

Mr. Himmelsbach & I discussed this in detail when I did it. It was before 2001 as I did not have the freedom of speaking privately on the phone after I remarried...so most of my phone calls were prior to my moving to my current location....I did have some phone conversations - but I had to time them as not to interfer with the time I needed to spend with my husband.

Most of the phone conversations were prior to June of 2001. Sometimes I could slip a call in if he went somewhere alone which was rare.


:)So U loose on that first confrontation. I could not remember if Duane said a name but when that name came up my eyebrows went UP UP UP.

:oThen I find out he lived in the very place Duane told me about - after I BUGGED the SHIT out of you for the location for what seemed forever..
When I looked it up - it was everything Duane had talked to me about. I tried to locate his address & he doesn't live there...I needed to talk to him about Duane. Duane told me that day in 1979 about knowning the guy but we would not be going there...this WAS BEFORE the money was FOUND!

I do not know if the man who was meeting Margie was her husband.
He drove a Pickup...I had to leave before he got there.. Does Margie have a sister who was close in age to her...Who else would have been able to answer the question about Kenny.

On our trip he pointed out more than one place where he knew someone who live in that location at one time or still lived there. One was a location below Lake Merwin and before we got back the an area that took up to Battleground.

A woman that live in that area....some were close to Amboy.

I also remember their talking about Horses - but, I have never seen a picture of the other woman you claimed drove a team of horses - the woman you showed a picture of would have been too old per the pictures you posted.

Margie looked like the woman at the shop in 2002 approx...but her hair still had color in it - obviously dyed - but the face & eyes looked like Margie and she was introduced as Margie.

Duane told me about Twisp and a museum not far from there - claiming it had a picture of him in it...before you went on that trip - we discussed this in the thread...do you NOT remember that.

I questioned you about this on the thread or in a PM...I print most PM's I send to someone I feel knows more than they're saying and that makes me suspicious..

How I was able to PROVE my case against Cook - I was able to prove every pertinent contact with him. If it was short with nothing much to say - I deleted them.

You deny mentioning Paradise Park - but you did and Duane told me about Paradise park and the GUYS.

This was discussed on 101 prior to 2001 and some after I moved. I was communicating with Porteous at that time and that was BEFORE your claiming KC was Cooper.....GOTTCHA!

You can deny this all you want but that is where I was going. Porteous SET you UP or you set yourself up! Or you just set out on your own.
Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

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'DUH! YOU made arrangement and talked about going TO TWISP & told the thread about her bill being paid by the attorney..Hard to believe this was 4 yrs ago.

Later you refuted & said you only called yet you definitely stated you were going to TWISP. You make grand plans & canceled them. You often misled the reader - making elaborate plans & then acting like you carried it out only to refute what you said previously.'



Never made any plans to return to Twisp. Margie Geestman wasn't there anymore. Remember...she sold her ranch to Washington Fish and Game and moved. No one except her lawyer and the bank officer in Winthrop knows her current location. Lawyer paid off the last electric bill for the ranch is all. That was around May 2012. I did contact the bank officer and he asked for a copy of the initial report on Christiansen. So I sent it to him. To be fair, I also sent a copy to Mrs. Geestman's lawyer. She also got a copy of the more recent, expanded report.

I have no interest in seeing Margie Geestman, although at some point the Seattle FBI might pay her a visit.

I think she bailed town because people in Twisp knew both she and Bernie Geestman quite well...and Bernie went on History Channel and said Kenny could be the hijacker. My thought is she probably used some foul language when Bernie was dumb enough to volunteer that. Why was it dumb? Because multiple witnesses, including members of Bernie Geestman's own family have come forward saying he was WITH Kenny the week of the hijacking. So maybe he should have offered an alibi for Kenny, instead of throwing him under the bus with the cast of Decoded.

Problem is, Uncle Bernie had no idea there were witnesses testifying to his disappearance Cooper Week with Kenny. Otherwise, he would never have said that. And Margie Geestman knew right away that was a dumb thing for Bernie to say. On national TV no less...:S That's why I think she sold the ranch and bailed town, telling her lawyer and the bank guy to not reveal where she was going. Realistically, there isn't a better motivation. She admitted on video AND voice recorder in her last interview that she realized she was naming Kenny as the hijacker. I hold the voice recording. The video is held by Go Go Luckey Productions in LA. And Margie Geestman KNEW the initial air date of the show that was coming from History Channel. I told her in my last interview with her, and then they re-ran the hell out of the show afterward anyway...for she and everyone in Twisp to see. They get cable there too. :)STILL streaming the damn thing.

During my visits to interview Mrs. Geestman, I also would stop by in town and inquire around about her, especially in the earlier interviews. Everyone knew her. Hard to forget a lady past seventy running her own ranch just outside of a town of less than a thousand people, driving that big bad Dodge truck into town for groceries.

In her last interview, she also admitted that it was Kenny Christiansen...and not any of the people she had tried naming previously...who had gone missing with her husband the week the hijacking occurred. Since she had done at least six previous interviews naming her husband as the accomplice in the hijacking...I asked her if she realized she was naming Kenny as Cooper.

She said YES. Then she hung the Cooper/Kenny photo collage I gave her (see picture) on her kitchen wall.

Sometimes things are a lot less complicated than you think. I also believe that you are trying to incorporate elements of the investigation of Christiansen into your own regarding Duane Weber. There is nothing there for you. All of your claims here have come since the investigation into Christiansen was made public, and details and certain names made available.

Was Kenny the guy? I couldn't tell you one way or another for sure right now. I'm certain the truth on him will emerge eventually, though.


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In her last interview, she also admitted that it was Kenny Christiansen...and not any of the people she had tried naming previously...who had gone missing with her husband the week the hijacking occurred. Since she had done at least six previous interviews naming her husband as the accomplice in the hijacking...I asked her if she realized she was naming Kenny as Cooper.

She said YES. Then she hung the Cooper/Kenny photo collage I gave her (see picture) on her kitchen wall.




And what is her reason for not coming forward so far?

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During my visits to interview Mrs. Geestman, I also would stop by in town and inquire around about her, especially in the earlier interviews. Everyone knew her. Hard to forget a lady past seventy running her own ranch just outside of a town of less than a thousand people, driving that big bad Dodge truck into town for groceries



I have the similar questions... let's just say Bernie wanted to protect the husband then and Ms. Jo and people in north were unaware... how come others like Grocer, Mechanic, distant relatives or neighbors...like really just random others didn't come forward? ...is there a reason behind this or if it remains unanswered?

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Why hasn't Mrs. Geestman (Margaret Ann Geestman) come forward so far? She did to a certain extent in interviews. But most of the time she kept trying to protect Kenny Christiansen along the way. I never understood why she kept agreeing to the interviews, but she did. Maybe her conscience, who knows?

I think in the end she was worried about what the FBI might do about the whole thing. I explained to her about the John Doe warrant on the hijacker that restricts it to only the hijacker himself, and told her Kenny was dead. So I figured she had no need to worry, but I think she started to realize she could be in trouble as an accomplice herself.

When Bernie Geestman and Kenny took off to Oakville the week of the hijacking, testimony from their friend Helen Jones indicates Mrs. Geestman was very upset. She and hubby were supposed to attend Thanksgiving at the Jones' place, and only Mrs. Geestman showed up. Kenny had also gone there for dinner the previous year in 1970, but he had been dropping hints he might catch a free flight back to Minnesota to visit family. So no one thought much of it when Kenny didn't show either.

We believe Mrs. Geestman didn't find out what the two men did until after they returned the following week. And from then on she was stuck holding the bag on their little secret for years. So we think the only three people who actually KNEW what happened were Kenny, Bernie, and Margie Geestman.

Bernie's sister Dawn Androsko testified that she and some of her friends wondered whether Kenny might be Cooper early on, but they dismissed those suspicions later because Kenny was 'such a nice guy' it didn't seem possible.

Years go by and Kenny never became a suspect. It helped that the FBI never looked at the possibility of an inside job, or that the hijacking could have been pulled off by an actual employee of the airline. I'll admit it is almost beyond belief that Kenny would do this and then return to work later for the same airline, but apparently he did. Although he didn't fly for them all that much. Word was once or twice a month on average after the hijacking, up to maybe three times a month maybe.

The only two people living today who know the truth on the whole thing are Mr and Mrs. Geestman. Mrs. Geestman blew town with nearly a half-million bucks from the State Fish and Game Department, and Bernie isn't saying a word. We've presented what we have on this whole situation to the FBI and some members of the media. I think that's all we can do on it. Anything further on this would have to come from one of those two entities, either law enforcement or the media. It's not like I can show up at Bernie's door and ask him to tell me the truth, or ask him why he said Kenny could be Cooper when he was WITH Kenny the whole damn week of the hijacking. Although I wouldn't mind asking him that. :)
Not like he would tell me, of course. He told the cast of Decoded I was lying about the whole thing. Yea. The only liar here is Mr. Geestman. He's been caught in these lies not only by me, but by Marisa Kagan, a former producer with History Channel.

I asked myself why...when Kagan pressured Geestman after she caught him calling up his sister, WHY he would agree to drive down from Port Angeles to Puyallup and appear on the show. The only answer I have is Damage Control. But even after all that's happened, hell...it could still be all a bunch of coincidences, but with Bernie's family coming forward it is tougher to say that now. I just don't HAVE the ultimate answer on Kenny. I don't. Maybe it's like Buddy Levy told me in his email: (Levy is the big guy on the Decoded cast, the professor from WSU)

Quote

"Either he's (Kenny) the hijacker, or it's the biggest set of coincidences in history..."



That's kind of what I think too. But I will never make the mistake (again) of saying that Kenny was DB Cooper for sure. Because the truth is I don't KNOW for sure. I suspect he was, but without further investigation by either the FBI or solid media, there's no way to say. But the fact remains that Mr. Bernie has told a lot of lies and every one of them has something to do with distancing himself from either Kenny, or any involvement in the hijacking. If it is all true about these guys, then it is a damn miracle that no one even suspected any of them until 2007, I will give you that.

Did it go down the way we think it did? Hell, I don't know for sure. Someone will figure it out eventually though, one way or another. In the meantime, maybe it's better to move on from discussing Kenny and Company. I think I have presented everything on him at length, and I'm sure everyone is tired of hearing it. I understand this completely. I get tired of talking about him, although when media asks, I go ahead and send them the full report on Kenny if they ask. Let someone else worry about it. ;)

EDIT: There was a document attached to this message. But after I reviewed it, I realized it wasn't clear on some points. So...Greg the Techie Guy and I went over it again and tried to present it better. Attached to my newer post now...:)


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Update on Bobby's Botching Mrs. Cooper's Investigation

For reasons that are still unclear, Jo Weber's determined 18-year investigation into the truth of her husband's claim that he was DB Cooper, was thrown off the rails this week when Mrs. Cooper revealed that Bobby Blevins had failed to uncover VITAL information that would prove Duane's near-death-bed confession in 1995.

If Jo can't depend on Bobby, who can she rely on?

Details to follow on this breaking story.

Stay tuned!

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BruceSmith

Update on Bobby's Botching Mrs. Cooper's Investigation

For reasons that are still unclear, Jo Weber's determined 18-year investigation into the truth of her husband's claim that he was DB Cooper, was thrown off the rails this week when Mrs. Cooper revealed that Bobby Blevins had failed to uncover VITAL information that would prove Duane's near-death-bed confession in 1995.

If Jo can't depend on Bobby, who can she rely on?

Details to follow on this breaking story.

Stay tuned!



Good joke. Kind of funny, I'll admit. I have absolutely NOTHING to do with any investigation of Duane Weber as the hijacker. Nothing, nada, negatory, not happening.

Funny though. Proves you still have a sense of humor during your travels down Cooper Road. ;)

Recent post by Shutter from the other site on Cooper:

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'The plane starts turning westward past the 8:15 mark. he could easily seen (lights of Vancouver, WA) through the front window of the cockpit (or) the sides. I believe he also states the pressure bump was felt over the suburbs. that's a good distance away from the original jump point...'



You believe the pressure bump was 'felt over the suburbs'? 'You believe' is not a quote by the co-pilot, by the way. Then why did they do the search so much farther north, up by Ariel? That's approximately 20 miles north, or farther, from Vancouver. The actual jump spot was probably no farther south than Woodland. When the Amboy chute was discovered in 2008, the FBI stated that location was in 'the prime drop zone for the hijacker,' and Amboy is just down the street from Ariel. Funny they would establish these things and then NOT search anywhere south of Woodland. By the time the jet reached Vancouver, the most likely scenario is that the hijacker was long gone.


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You believe' is not a quote by the co-pilot



Once again you state things without really knowing whats was said, or why it was said.





Who said it then Robert?

Quotes from this thread that include the FBI.
"The crew had already reported the abnormal fluctuations so they believed this "bump" was just a continuation of what started at 8:11 PM. Because of this they don't report it. They do have conversation, however, Radazcak said he could see the northern suburbs of Portland when this occurred. He also said it occurred 5 to 10 minutes after last contact at 8:05 PM."

Larry Carr:
"I am positive Ratazcak was talking about Vancouver when he said, "we had not yet reached Portland proper but we were definitely in the suburbs or immediate vicinity." Suburbs meaning Vancouver for the very reason you pointed out."

Now, the problem seems to be that the oscillation was recorded on the transcripts, but nothing about the bump. if you take Rataczaks word at 5-10 minutes after the 8:05 contact. that puts the jump further south does it not?

How big do you think the search area was Robert?

I will be disclosing all the known information on my up and coming flight path video.

here is the trailer. the narration will be done by the same person who did the trailer which was done by a professional. the transcripts will run with the simulator, and will have narration to any problems along the
path.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3waV0APRscE
"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

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All well and good. But you didn't answer the question. If you believe Cooper jumped over the Vancouver area, or even the Columbia in Portland...

Then why did the FBI and the US Army do their search up near Ariel and Amboy? Rataczak had imput on the location they should be searching, but much of this was determined from Paul Soderlind's team from NWA, coupled with the radar information and FDR info.

During all of this re-creation video stuff...did anyone who worked with you on it even bother to contact Rataczak for HIS imput? Ever show him a map, talk to him about it?

I have asked this before and all I heard was a bunch of excuses. If you're going to re-create and attempt to change history, maybe you should go to the original source first, don't you think? Rataczak is in the phone book you know. And if you can't look it up, I will be happy to provide his address and phone for you privately. Otherwise, your effort is like trying to recreate the history of the sinking of the Titanic without going to one of the crew who survived. (Assuming, like the role of Rataczak, that this person were actually available for questioning)

In addition, Rataczak has told Skipp Porteous that he not only follows the case today, but he also said he keeps EXTENSIVE notes and records on it. For you and your guys not to bother accessing that source is silly beyond belief. It wasn't very long ago when Rataczak even gave a talk on the Cooper hijacking, which was released by NWA History as a DVD. You can even get it today at their website.

Always go to the source when one is available. Rataczak will talk to you, although he does screen the phone calls first. But to just go out there arbitrarily with your own interpretation of the flight path...without even speaking to the only pilot still available...well, let's just say that is not well thought out. It's almost as if you are afraid of what he may tell you. This point is so obvious that I doubt your video will garner much credibility...and even less respect. For my part, I would respect it a lot more if you interviewed Rataczak and provided him with your own thoughts on the flight path and where Cooper may have jumped. Then see what he says. And not an interview where you just paraphrase a phone call however you want. Better to record it and transcibe his actual answers, or send him a letter with maps on your theories and see if he responds in writing. :S


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When I said "I believe" I was stating that I wasn't sure of what Rataczak said. that's all it was.

Carr seems to believe they relied on the oscillation, and not the bump. this is another reason the entire flight logs seem to be missing, or entries. should be all kinds of talk in the drop time.

I don't believe anything at this point. if the flight path is wrong, the whole thing is wrong. if some proof that the path is accurate shows up, it might help things in the future. mistakes happen, especially in calculations. even by really smart guys! I'm going by what Rataczak has stated in the past, and what the FBI has claimed in the past.

The flight data recorder would also bury some theories, but that data is also unaccounted for. Tom told me the other night that nothing was found in regards to the flight data.

I didn't start my project to jump to conclusions. this has been a long and hard process. I'm not out to debunk the path!
"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

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I believe what you're saying. Really though...you guys should contact Rataczak. I would do it by mail. Maybe send him some maps with your theories written/noted/whatever on these maps. A cover letter, too. Maybe with the simple questions. You know...where the heck was the flight when Cooper jumped? Was it several minutes BEFORE they went over the Columbia...was it north of Vancouver...was it OVER the Columbia at Tina Bar...etc. Maybe give him a map without notes so he can mark things. Then it will be a record.

You know, I still like Skipp Porteous. But he sure asked Rataczak the wrong questions. He had already interviewed him when he sent me the original ms. Maybe you will ask the RIGHT ones. Rataczak and Harold Anderson are the only guys left who can answer the hard questions here. Let's face it. Wouldn't you LIKE to hear what Rataczak has to say?

LOL I know another entity who asks questions poorly...and that's the folks at the Washington State History Museum. Some of those interviews they published were practically worthless.


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What is Rataczak going to tell me about the path that is clearly showing where the plane flew? how is re-creating the path changing history? if something is found I will notify the proper people to look at the data.

He can't tell me anything different if it's not on the FBI flight path. how would that be re-creating it?

I know the speeds, the weather, the altitude, the direction. what will Rataczak do to improve this? the path is right there in stone. you can't change it with out flying the path. I have to follow the path exactly how it is on the map.

Now, if Rataczak says he didn't fly across Battleground like the map shows, then we can't re-create the path can we? if he says anything different than the map shows, that makes the path incorrect doesn't it? I'm sure he has seen the map, and hasn't added anything about the direction, or anything.

Why do I need Rataczak?

If anything is found, then I would like to talk with Rataczak, and others. lets see if the path can be flown the way they present it? then ask the "WTF" questions, no?
"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

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