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quade

DB Cooper

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Gosh, I wonder what ever happened to Robb Heady after he mishandled around $45,000 of cash in that wind blasted plane and then could not hold on to the remaining $155,000 for more than a few seconds?



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s05jcrJw0as

I wonder? :)
Melvin Luther Wilson - Missing Person since September 1971:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03QLnFvk8Fs

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Excellent Vicki,

Once again you hide in the weeds then attack when least expected.

But what kind of cowboy?

Could this be the type?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c412hqucHKw

Something more noir perhaps?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P6WD7B_I_9c

Surely not this suburban legend.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NpvyoDk2eM8

But then I know what my tastes gravitate towards, haaaa….. haaaaa!!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=47W1pNC1QHw&feature=fvst

Through rain and wind and weather… sounds like it was written for Cooper’s jump.

But who’s to say, the name ‘Boys Don’t Cry’ always conjures,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8CDERzun4k

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Lyle Prouse... gee that name sounds familiar...

Oh yeah... that's Bill Rataczak's friend...

SMALL WORLD isn't it?

Caption for attached photo:
Lyle's release from prison. Six of his fellow pilots came from around the country to support him.
L-R, Colie Smith, Gainesville, GA, Lyle, Mike Phillips, Cumming, GA, Vic Manussier, Auburn, AL, Bill Rataczak, South Haven, MN, Dayle Yates, Cumming, GA, and Glenn Eggert, Scottsdale, AZ.

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Excellent Vicki,

Once again you hide in the weeds then attack when least expected.

But what kind of cowboy?

Could this be the type?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c412hqucHKw

Something more noir perhaps?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P6WD7B_I_9c

Surely not this suburban legend.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NpvyoDk2eM8

But then I know what my tastes gravitate towards, haaaa….. haaaaa!!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=47W1pNC1QHw&feature=fvst

Through rain and wind and weather… sounds like it was written for Cooper’s jump.

But who’s to say, the name ‘Boys Don’t Cry’ always conjures,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8CDERzun4k



Cat's do not particularly like the rain...do you think Cooper owned a cat?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pk7yqlTMvp8

or a monkey?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BYNoQZ5djUA

Now I am hungry.......gosh darnit!! I will be back after I eat my Chilito.


Get you mind out of the gutter.....:$

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XYqOIdYCOy8 :$

*disclaimer* a chilito is a menu item at Taco John's and is not put out there as a sexual connotation!
Melvin Luther Wilson - Missing Person since September 1971:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03QLnFvk8Fs

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Smart move putting that disclaimer about the chilito, there must be a barrel of them on this thread and to think otherwise would make you the…..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwGVDmEsi8A

That’s not to say there is a steaming shortage of that commodity either.

P.S., I checked Taco John’s menu for chilitos and they don’t exist, but don’t worry, it will be our secret here on PM where messages are private and not for public view. The others don’t need to know.

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it will be our secret here on PM where messages are private and not for public view. The others don’t need to know.



as I sit here staring at the messages link.......waiting........waiting........;)

I must also inform you that the Chilito, the oooooey goooooey chilito, IS still a menu item at Taco Johns (at least in MN anyway) amazing I keep my girlie figure!

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/food/calories/taco-johns-chilito-7673815
Melvin Luther Wilson - Missing Person since September 1971:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03QLnFvk8Fs

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You are correct - I DO NOT have a complete transcript. I clearly remember the conversation about the "bathroom" and perhaps I thought you guys were pulling my leg.

I tried to pull it off the way Sluggo suggested. I believe I tried all of this before as I did recently. Understand that at this current time I am unable to sit at the computer for any lenght of time due to a recent surgery. If anyone has any suggestions about how I can get the complete transcript or can email it to me in a format I can down load - it would be appreciated. My regular email is on my profile.

Thank You.
Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

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Lyle Prouse... gee that name sounds familiar...

Oh yeah... that's Bill Rataczak's friend...

SMALL WORLD isn't it?

Caption for attached photo:
Lyle's release from prison. Six of his fellow pilots came from around the country to support him.
L-R, Colie Smith, Gainesville, GA, Lyle, Mike Phillips, Cumming, GA, Vic Manussier, Auburn, AL, Bill Rataczak, South Haven, MN, Dayle Yates, Cumming, GA, and Glenn Eggert, Scottsdale, AZ.



I picked up a friend of mine from prison when he was released in 1982. Doesn't make me a criminal, and I don't necessarily write off my friends if they make a mistake. Just shows Rataczak had a bit of character.

On a side note, my friend never got into trouble again and ended up becoming a union welder on ships in the Seattle area.



Robert,

Re-read my post. Your response says a lot about how you preceive things when presented with a statement. You evidently read something into my post that wasn't there.

The question is... is that how you have handled "witness statements"?

BTW: I agree with you, Lyle's story is a compelling one. After a few years in a 12-step program he was able to get his license back and spends a lot of his time using his story as a warning to other pilots etc. I would gladly fly with him.

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OK, by now everyone knows (even those with room temp IQs) that Flight 305 landed in Reno, LaPoint’s Airwest flight was bound for Reno and Heady hijacked a United flight from Reno. So logically the next tale would involve…… RENO and hijacking via:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2CTPLUcQAjk

It really is hard to believe there is such a boundless demand for gubbermint conspiracies, convict Smokejumpers or homoerotic Airstream trailer romances but this thread will quickly disabuse the most casual of reader of those thoughts. Unemployed gas station attendants, employed magazine subscription phone salesmen and parking lot attendants aren’t enough of a menagerie of occupational face plants to give serendipity hijacking enough credence to make the bottom shelf of consideration.

Fair enough then.

Let’s behave like this is just another day in America. But why is it just this country? How come Australia or New Zealand doesn’t produce the number of bat shit crazies we do? Ahhh, no matter I guess we should consider it part of our national heritage and embrace it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLE6T97DA2o

So another United 727 is jacked in Reno by a man riding his bicycle up to the plane with a rifle slung across the handlebars. You gotta admit that no one probably saw that one coming from a mile away. Truly brilliant and elegant in the very simplicity of his design, dare I suggest a sort of backyard savant?

Now the hijacker gets down to demands, they are to fly to Vancouver (the Canadian one) then to Seattle (the American one) but first, load his bike on the plane.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YEEy615Jzg4

Ummm, yeah….. all that I said about….. gosh I feel kinda stoopid here….. but could we forget all the gushing I did about that elegant design and savant stuff now? Cause this loser is nuttier than a squirrel turd to think he is going to make good an escape on his bicycle. Perhaps he was going to get full on ‘Lance Armstongish’ during touchdown and ride down the aft stairs and make good his escape with 15 gold bars, 2 large bull horns, 3 small ones, 20 pairs of handcuffs, 300 feet of nylon rope, 3 binoculars and carrying cases, large box of quick acting sleeping pills, some pep pills, ammonia inhalers, 3 one mile beam flashlights, 3 Zenith portable radios, 1 powerful VHF transceiver, 3 Thompson submachine guns, 12 fully loaded clips, 3 Python 357s and 50 rounds of ammunition. It is possible.

But instead the hijacker’s demand for a new crew in Seattle was answered with a pair of FBI agents posing as pilots who had a confederate hand a gun to them through the sliding window which was used to disable Mr. Frank Sibley with a bi-shot to his shoulder and leg. He fell to the ground but continued to menace agents with a basket of fresh raspberries. You know I made up that part about the raspberries don’t you? Don’t you?

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Duane died on March 28th 1995. In May of 1996 around this date and time of day (approx May 25) - I started to read a book called - D.B. Cooper - What Really Happened by Max Gunther.

I had returned that day from Panama City after ACE-ing the Florida State Real Estate exam with what would have been a perfect score had I not have erased two correct answers. (Since I have Dumb Blonde Sydrome, I have bragging rights).

Now 15 yrs later this is what my efforts to relate Duane's story to the FBI and others has come to.
I am tired. I am not a genius and am not a liar. I have told the truth and I have related what I do know and things I was told and shown. There was an awkward learning curve about the crime itself and a disturbing ordeal learning about the past of a man I had been married to for 17 yrs.

In 1996 I knew only what was in that book of fiction about the crime. The things I have learned over the yrs about the crime and some of the people who contacted me have only enforced what Duane told me.

I have been lied to by so called individuals who supposedly are the right arm of the FBI in this old crime and yes, I have been lied to by the FBI. IF Weber was supposedly NOT involved in anyway in this crime - WHY did authorities and "others" find it necessary to lie to me? If the FBI had one IOTA of proof Duane Weber was NOT Cooper then there was NO reason NOT to come forward with that information if for no other reason than to give his widow some peace of mind.

Too many unlogical and unrealistic moves on the part all the parties who should have known how to handle this suspect will forever leave its mark. The burden of proof was put upon me - and not where it should have been - squarely on the shoulders of the authorities.

Don't even try to touch the DNA - because the DNA on that tie did NOT belong to Cooper and the FBI knows this. I believe I know who the DNA belonged to, but the FBI chose NOT to explore that avenue....considered it utterly ridiculous.

If You Do NOT Know Now You'll Never Know
Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

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Jo wrote:
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Don't even try to touch the DNA - because the DNA on that tie did NOT belong to Cooper and the FBI knows this. I believe I know who the DNA belonged to, but the FBI chose NOT to explore that avenue....considered it utterly ridiculous.



RFK, right?

377
2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

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If the FBI had one IOTA of proof Duane Weber was NOT Cooper then there was NO reason NOT to come forward with that information if for no other reason than to give his widow some peace of mind.



The FBI isn't in the business of proving innocence. If Duane wasn't wrongfully charged or convicted then the law enforcement machine couldn't care less about his innocence.

That's just the nature of the beast Jo. You weren't singled out for bad treatment.

377
2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

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If the FBI had one IOTA of proof Duane Weber was NOT Cooper then there was NO reason NOT to come forward with that information if for no other reason than to give his widow some peace of mind.



The FBI isn't in the business of proving innocence. If Duane wasn't wrongfully charged or convicted then the law enforcement machine couldn't care less about his innocence.

That's just the nature of the beast Jo. You weren't singled out for bad treatment.

377



Especially since 'she' started it all, in the first place!

The FBI didn't ask Jo Weber to claim Duane Weber
was DB Cooper! Nobody did.

Whether true or not, it's all Jo's work.

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Bevins:
I think you are right on about the found chute. I agree he probably wanted the container to carry the money and just tossed the chute out just after opening the airstairs and way before he jumped. Cossey probably did not remember that the old silk chute was used for the dummy at Issaqua Sky Sports. Sheridan Peterson probably laffed when he saw the dummy that he had seen many times as an instructor at Issaqua and tossed it to confuse the FBI about his jump location and then use the carrier for the money.
Bob

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William Greene did not jump or ask for parachutes during his hijacking but his effort deserves a little recognition none the less. For Mr. Greene established the ‘standard ransom’ for a large jet and was among the first to hijack a Convair 880. Now largely a footnote in commercial aviation history since less than 100 were produced (well below any break even figure) and was the last gasp for the company which would focus future efforts on a much wealthier and malleable customer, the gubberment.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7kxbBuLSRrQ

That was awesome (3:55 – 4:30). Yes, Jim Thompson had to explain some basic facts to his wife before she made that pre-dinner, hair appointment, before picking up Jim who got out of a meeting early. I guess suspension of disbelief in 1960 was just the same as it is today with more sophisticated, intelligent and beautiful people in the role of aviation consumer.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xI_UIrzOZAQ&feature=related

So few Convair 880s were made, but as luck would have it there is one example on display in the good ‘ol USA. But where would such a crown jewel of aviation be stored? The Smithsonian, National Museum of the Air Force or the Pima Air Museum you imagine. Nope, this time you’re going to Graceland.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5531Ztyin4&feature=related

What was that on the entry stairs? Would you believe that Elvis bought that 880 from none other than Delta?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7g9WjcGdxuM

OK, this is getting too weird. Now there is photographic proof and a clear provenance of exactly how Elvis is tied to Flight 305. You’re welcome. Any and all information I have is immediately shared and made public for people to read with their own eyes and be shocked with their own brains or with whatever brains they choose to use.

Why doesn’t the gubberment understand me after all the hundreds of emails I’ve sent?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MyrQqmc5UT8&feature=related

I just feel like everything I do is wrong, I just I hope I can find the strength to continue…..

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You posts continue to amaze and entertain the audience, but hopefully some of the things you put out will NOT merge into the Cooper Sector as facts. The Myth versus Facts is already extremely convoluted.

At any rate I enjoy you posts and your recent post gave rise to this:

Recently the Supreme court refused to take sides in a long-running billiondollar dispute between a contractor and the government regarding a plane.

The two companies are Boeing and General Dynamics who were supposed to build A-12 Avenger attack planes. This case goes back to 1991 and there were delays and cost overruns. The government and the contractors disagree with WHO was responsible for the problems.

Now 20 yrs later this has NOT been resolved with the government demanding repayment of the money spent on the developement of the plane. The companies filed a lawsuit in Federal Court to block the Pentagon from Collecting.

The Government wants the lawsuit to be THROWN out because of classified secrets being leaked during the discovery process. NOTE: this is 20 yrs ago - just how much is still secret in 2011?

The state-secrets privilege on which the government relied on to shut down the companies's lawsuit - has only been used in the past in National security and terrorism cases.Therefore the Government involving a privilege ratified in the 1950's - the Government is saying if the lawsuit goes forward it will force disclosure of information that could damage National Security

What does this have to do with Cooper?

The Law that was ratified in the 1950's - regarding National Securtiy is what caught my eye about this situation. When technology is 20 yrs old it is obsolete and all other information is of NO importance after 40 yrs. If 40 yr old infomation (regarding Cooper) cannot be publically acknowledged then the Government was in the Wrong 40 yrs ago.

I DO realize I am taking much of this out of context - but, it is how I feel because of all the things our governement has done in the past and we are ALL aware of this. No one person nor government is infallible - but I believe in taking responsibility for wrong doings...not hiding behind a 1950 law that should never have existed in the first place, I do understand when it involves an ongoing action - but not 20 or 40 yrs later?

It is time for America to STAND-up and Admit they have made mistakes - NOT cover them up with a privilege law 40 yrs later. Face it - 40 yrs ago NO one expected the information lines available thru the internet to exisit. NOW is the time to admit mistakes before other countries and those who do know do it for us.
Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

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a Convair 880. Now largely a footnote in commercial aviation history since less than 100 were produced (well below any break even figure) and was the last gasp for the company which would focus future efforts on a much wealthier and malleable customer, the gubberment.



Have you forgotten the Convair 990 Farflung? It was a roughly 707 size airliner that flew like a fighter. Smokey, compromised range, but pretty fast and handled great according to those who flew them. NASA flew one out of Moffett Field CA long after they had been retired from major airline service. It belched huge plumes of black smoke on high power settings used for TO. Spantax, a second tier carrier in Spain kept a fleet of them flying for charters for a long time. They contracted with a Prof at Cornell to figure out how to reduce the smoke and it was a success. An academic figured out a simple combustor section mod that eluded GE, the engine mfr. In their last years the 990s were nearly smokeless.

http://www.google.com/search?q=cponvair+990&rls=com.microsoft:en-us:IE-SearchBox&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&sourceid=ie7&rlz=1I7GGLL_en#hl=en&sugexp=ldymls&pq=cponvair%20990&xhr=t&q=convair+990&cp=1&qe=Y29udmFpciA5OTA&qesig=X-uxM4NKfBk_mig4uSMBLg&pkc=AFgZ2tni313ZJ_wu1RAVDvF7sDNbxyNP7nqV6kp77byqQ-sgP7yKEiKyj1Tpx8w3nUM-RCCnYhjCtm4eQGHet6xFrQL6UzxIkA&pf=p&sclient=psy&rls=com.microsoft:en-us%3AIE-SearchBox&rlz=1I7GGLL_en&source=hp&aq=0&aqi=&aql=&oq=convair+990&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=3ab7b119eb13be61&biw=1380&bih=809&bs=1

377
2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

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377,

I didn’t forget the 990, just considered it part of the inexplicable program to build a smaller and more expensive but faster aircraft which didn’t catch on. Just like the 1011 was to the DC-10 which was more advanced, better handling and had copious visibility with a larger price tag. Lockheed could barely move 250 of those and that was with huge government bribes and a couple suicides to spice up the story. I guess that there was a need to support Lockheed, Northrop and General Dynamics (nee Convair) as a trio of competing government contractors to keep prices down.

Just like they way Boeing competes with other American jet builders like……. ummm hang on… well there is some logic embedded so deep that fragile minds like mine can’t comprehend the sheer magnitude of the genius. By keeping several mammoth contractors building planes forecast to be in the thousands the last 20 years has yielded a sky darkening 21 B-2 bombers and 187 F-22 fighters. See what the government is capable of doing with a few million man years? Yet another example of how easy it would be for them to manage a DB Cooper cover up.

Now Boeing and Airbus are fighting for air superiority with the ‘Dreamliner’ which is a smaller airframe than the ‘Skytanic’ A380 which is capable of seating a village. This may be history about to repeat but who knows?

Of course both companies had those mind numbing mock ups with ‘sky casinos’, beds and showers which are never ordered. We all know it will be 835 sensory deprivation seats with a couple dozen First Class accommodations.

So who has a better design? Last year SFO (your backyard) had a total of 390,000 flights according to the FAA. Time for a little math, that would be over 1,000 flights per day with one operation every two minutes would require 33 hours and with parallel runways make for a 16 hour day and allow for noise abatement regulations. Well it appears that SFO is at or very close to facility saturation in regard to air operations. So whacha think? Smaller faster Boeing or the ‘Supersized jetgasm’ that touches the physical limits of girth and length?

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So whacha think? Smaller faster Boeing or the ‘Supersized jetgasm’ that touches the physical limits of girth and length?



I like pretty planes and only its mother could think that the A 380 is attractive.... so I'll vote for the sleeker BoeDoug dream machine.

When I was a kid there were lots of pretty planes flying over my schoolyard on the way to SFO. Super Connies were gorgeous. Slick and TWA flew a lot of them. You'd still see a few DC 3s too which have their own form of timeless beauty.

The Boeing 377 wasn't pretty, but it was manly. Your kind of plane Farflung. The nursing tanker mission that the USAF C 97 had to perform may give a contrary impression, but a real civil B 377 (without a USAF fuel tit) the Stratocruiser was a good looking plane when viewed in a masculine context.

So true about those skymalls and aerial gyms shown in jumbo mockups. How long did the piano bar or the deli last in the 747s? Just long enough to appear in a soon to be misleading ad is my recollection.

377
2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

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Sailshaw has been signing his posts with the name 'Bob'.

Tell me please that this is NOT Bob Knoss. If it is, I will ignore everything he says. Been there, done that.

Side Note:

Top Five Mistakes I Believe the FBI Made in the Cooper Case:

1) They never seriously investigated or questioned (with the exception of the 305 crew) people who worked for the airline.

2) Although the FBI issued a list of the ransom money numbers, no one at the Treasury Department was checking the numbers on their incoming bills from banks, businesses, or individuals, for worn currency replacement. And the banks gave up looking at the list within 3 to 6 months. (via Larry Carr's radio interview. Link at Wiki.)

3) After they found the money at Tena Bar, they took the easy way out and said they now believed Cooper died in the jump. If so, how did approximately three bundles of the money end up in the same spot...and nothing else was found?

4) They perpetuated a story right from the start that conditions were too stormy for a jump. Yet the official weather report from the Portland International Airport says different. The heavy rain and higher winds didn't start until the search began the next day.

5) They lingered too long on their laurels believing Cooper was Richard Floyd McCoy. Meanwhile, the REAL Cooper laughed and blended back into the community. Along the way he probably washed all the actual bills and became fairly safe from being caught.

I could go on. Maybe a list of ten. But those first five aren't bad.

And let's not even go to that ridiculous explanation they offered regarding the Amboy parachute.



Prove it.

Prove anything, Jo-II. !

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Sailshaw has been signing his posts with the name 'Bob'.

Tell me please that this is NOT Bob Knoss. If it is, I will ignore everything he says. Been there, done that.



Sailshaw isn't Bob Knoss. He is a retired engineer who worked for Boeing. He is also a licensed amateur radio operator as is Snowmman, Georger, Sluggo, Guru, myself and perhaps others who post here. Odd isn't it?

What has become of Bob Knoss?

377
2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

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'If you knew airline people as I do, then you would know none of them would ever do such a thing...'



Nearly two years before the Sept. 11 terror attacks, Egypt Air Flight 990 took off from Kennedy Airport bound for Cairo and inexplicably crashed into the Atlantic off Nantucket, Mass., killing all 217 aboard.

U.S. investigators determined the relief co-pilot, Gamil el-Batouty, deliberately crashed the plane. Those findings were released just five months before Sept. 11.

Batouty's last words, according to investigators, were in the form of Muslim prayer in Arabic: "I rely on Allah." He said it 11 times before the aircraft began its sudden descent from 33,000 feet to 16,000 feet.

The auto-pilot was switched off before the steep dive and both engines were shut off. Mechanical failure was ruled out.

377
2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

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Blevins
Yes, I am not Bob Knoss and was a Boring Engineer for 34 years and have been retired for 16 years.
I would like to address the money found at Tena's Bar. There were three packs of 100 $20 and I believe they were the ones offered to the crew that were refused. I think DB took ten $20's (for pocket money) from one pack and put $5,800 still in three packs (held together by the rubber bands) in the paper sack he had brought onboard. He then upon being refused the offer by the crew, rolled up the sack with the three packs and stuffed them in his coat pocket (or somewhere on his body) before the jump. Then the buffeting caused the sack and the Tena money to fly out of his pocket and land near or at Tena's Bar. In the paper sack as protection the Tena money stayed together and could have floated to the place found. The wind from the South East could have blew the sack in the direction of Tena's Bar and even dropped in the Columbia. The sack could of rotted away but did provide protection for the three packs of $20 inside. When found on Tena's Bar, the sack could have been rotted away. Now if this thought is correct, a vector from Tina's Bar in the direction up wind and where it crosses the 727 flight path would be the most likely point of where Cooper left the plane.
Just something to chew on as the group is solving this case and what could have happened. This gets us away from the travel down rivers and up stream on the Columbia by the Tena money.
Bob

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