DB Cooper

[Orange1 0]

being lazy, please remind me when he died?

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When KC died, his estate probate lists the following: $400,000 in cash and a coin and stamp collection worth another $300,000, a car, and a house. No reasonable explanation has ever been forwarded as to how Kenny managed to acquire so much before his death. According to available tax records found among his papers, he never exceeded $20,000 a year in income, with most years far below $10,000 declared.

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[Orange1 0]

Reason I ask is, 71 was just heading into big inflation and that had a massive impact on stock market returns. Depending on exactly when you pick your dates, the Dow went up about tenfold between late 1971 and the end of the 1990s, then a bit more up/sideways since. Turning 200K into 800K or so worth of assets would not have been hugely difficult, in fact it wouldn't have been a great performance at all compared to the market, and that's even before you take dividends into account. (Quite how all this would have escaped the IRS etc is another story.)

Edit: see chart at link (log scale for obvious reasons).
http://stockcharts.com/charts/historical/djia1900.html

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[georger 197]

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being lazy here but please remind me when christiansen died?

re

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When KC died, his estate probate lists the following: $400,000 in cash and a coin and stamp collection worth another $300,000, a car, and a house. No reasonable explanation has ever been forwarded as to how Kenny managed to acquire so much before his death. According to available tax records found among his papers, he never exceeded $20,000 a year in income, with most years far below $10,000 declared.

Coin and stamp collections are notoriously over
valued as a rule. Valued by who? Sold to who for
what?

For example gold in 1970-71 was valued at about
$35 an ounce. What is gold today!? Gold coins fall
into the same catagory. Condition is everything.
A coin or a stamp can catalog at $5000-$20,000
and sell for $500.00, or less!

The very nature of what Kenny had tells me
a lot about his financial/investment life (and his
personality).

How much Microsoft or Genen-Tech stock did
Kenny have? Probably none.

This guy is investing in soft investments which by
itself tends to suggest he didnt have much free
cash to spend, or saved, or solid real assets ...

I have a cat that is worth $400,000 ... if someone
says so! That cat was a stray that wandered up on
my property three years ago. I know its a champion!
I say so.

Blevins needs to firm up his evidence potpourri
with solid value before I am going to buy into
his shell game of anecdotal script issued by
Acrhie & Jughead Ltd.

I have no doubt Kenny lived a lonely life but that
does not mean he was DBC or a millionaire! $100k
in hard assets CASH after a lifetime spent during a high growth high inflation era plus some stamps and
coins of uncertain value IS NOT a large estate, imho.
Hardly. That suggests Kenny was an under-performer. People who worked as clerks at JC Penny's or at service stations during that era wound up with larger estates by comparison.

My bet is Kenny's socalled coin and stamp collection
wasn't even a real "collection" but just a bunch of
msc stuff Kenny managed to save as he found
things over the years ...

Follow the money in Kenny's life! What did he inherit
or borrow etc?

[skyjack71 0]

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The map came from a DB Cooper Facebook page
which Blevins posts to... the caption under the map
speaks of Duane ... are you saying this is a map
Blevins posted as an interpretation of your story
about Duane? I did catch the milk can conflict with
your story which I recall uses a paint bucket ?

I literally just found the thing and dont know anything about who is doing what to whom or what
phase the satellite Iapetus is currently in ???

Whoever posted this thing misspelled
Hemmelsbach in addition to placing Washougal
clear down in Oregon! Looks like a pretty
amateurish effort ?

Georger read the next Post that Blevins posted - I could never say it any better.

Blevins - Thank You for that post.
I have never ever gone to that site and would not - because I know this man and so do others who have been searching for Cooper.

Blevins: Regarding KC's financilal assets.

Well, let me give you a little lesson. A home bought in 1988 for 43K sold for 159K approx 2006 or 2007. Go figure. This same home was purchased in 2002 for 89K. The man who bought it GOT LUCKY and hit at the right time of the market almost doubling his money in a 5 yr period of time.

1988 - 43K
2002 - 89K
2006 - 159K

Compare homes in WA versus homes in FL. An 1800 Sq FT 10 yrs old home in a very good neighbor home can be had for 159K.

Comparable homes in a small town in WA are currently selling for 345K...and they do not look as nice. But that is just Fl. versus WA.

Real Estate investments where very good in the late 1970's and up until 2007 - then they bottomed out...depending on the area. Duane and I bought a house in Virginia for 78K in 1984 and sold it in 1987 for a very very nice profit.

KC was doing property and coins.
In the past that was a sure thing.
Right now if one could afford to buy property and hold on to it for several yrs - and if the economy ever gets turned around - then in 10 yrs make a tidy profit.

I think the American Economy will not survive what is happening.
Seniors used nests eggs to buy homes with the intent to use the equity on those home to supplement their income should their IRA's become depleted. Well, you all know what is happening...because of the inflation of everything else and the deflation to homes - they are already using the equity in the home to survive or they are down sizing.

Some Amercians who were considered average in investments are now becoming dependent on their children - some have even moved in with their children or visa versa - just to keep a roof over the head of the families. We haven't see the worst of this yet! Mark my word. A lot also depends on the areas.

FL has been hit hard. A home built in 2004 sold for 189K and the family put 28K in upgrades into this home - it just sold for 113K...will close next wk...buyer gets all of the extras - bar none.
This WAS not a distress sale or repo.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[Orange1 0]

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For example gold in 1970-71 was valued at about $35 an ounce. What is gold today!? Gold coins fall into the same catagory.

Now you see, I have to be pedantic about this fixed at $35/oz under Bretton Woods. Like any other fixed price it would never have reflected real value! It's still a very good point though because a savvy investment in gold coins/krugerrands before the oil price spike would have been made at very cheap prices, and a gold coin actually is not "valued at whatever someone will buy it for"; they are calibrated in oz (1/4 oz, 1/2 oz, 1 oz etc) and that is the minimum value they keep. Some will sell for more if they are collector's editions. However, for most of the period gold would have way underperformed stocks; and the barbarous relic of course provides no income, so true underperformance even greater than just a price chart comparison indicates.

not a great chart but here anyway http://www.goldprice.org/gold-price-history.html#36_year_gold_price back to 73 not 71 but gold was still in the low 60s/oz in early 73. Of course after the spike in the late 70s/early 80s it kind of sidelined around 300-400 for a very long time until the past couple of years.

Still, I have to note that an investment at around $50-60 that goes up to around $400 or so .... is not very out of line with the kind of increase one might expect looking at Cooper's haul (assuming he kept the money) vs Christansen's estate value.

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[georger 197]

Quote

Quote

The map came from a DB Cooper Facebook page
which Blevins posts to... the caption under the map
speaks of Duane ... are you saying this is a map
Blevins posted as an interpretation of your story
about Duane? I did catch the milk can conflict with
your story which I recall uses a paint bucket ?

I literally just found the thing and dont know anything about who is doing what to whom or what
phase the satellite Iapetus is currently in ???

Whoever posted this thing misspelled
Hemmelsbach in addition to placing Washougal
clear down in Oregon! Looks like a pretty
amateurish effort ?

Georger read the next Post that Blevins posted - I could never say it any better.

Blevins - Thank You for that post.
I have never ever gone to that site and would not - because I know this man and so does others who have been searching for Cooper.

I dont really care who posted or composed that bullshit map.

[georger 197]

Quote

Quote

For example gold in 1970-71 was valued at about $35 an ounce. What is gold today!? Gold coins fall into the same catagory.

Now you see, I have to be pedantic about this fixed at $35/oz under Bretton Woods. Like any other fixed price it would never have reflected real value! It's still a very good point though because a savvy investment in gold coins/krugerrands before the oil price spike would have been made at very cheap prices, and a gold coin actually is not "valued at whatever someone will buy it for"; they are calibrated in oz (1/4 oz, 1/2 oz, 1 oz etc) and that is the minimum value they keep. Some will sell for more if they are collector's editions. However, for most of the period gold would have way underperformed stocks; and the barbarous relic of course provides no income, so true underperformance even greater than just a price chart comparison indicates.

not a great chart but here anyway http://www.goldprice.org/gold-price-history.html#36_year_gold_price back to 73 not 71 but gold was still in the low 60s/oz in early 73. Of course after the spike in the late 70s/early 80s it kind of sidelined around 300-400 for a very long time until the past couple of years.

Still, I have to note that an investment at around $50-60 that goes up to around $400 or so .... is not very out of line with the kind of increase one might expect looking at Cooper's haul (assuming he kept the money) vs Christansen's estate value.

Nixon took us off the gold standard - the Hunt
fiasco followed (silver).

But we are light years away from how KC lived
and thought, and did ...

Blevins is never going to give us the facts we need
to parse this matter out correctly ... his theory will
not stand scrutiny. That is all that matters.

BTW: did anyone catch the fact that Cooper
remarked to Tina he really didnt care about the
money? He said, "I dont want it!". He obviously
had something more important on his mind ...
that said he didnt leave the money behind either.


Lastly. Mr. Blevins statements about KC's financial
life is totally biased and not a professional audit!

[Orange1 0]

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Nixon took us off the gold standard -

you make it sound like he had a choice in the matter

and yes i know this is off track ... (although it is not the first time we have discussed the economic background)

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[georger 197]

Quote

Quote

Nixon took us off the gold standard -

you make it sound like he had a choice in the matter

and yes i know this is off track ... (although it is not the first time we have discussed the economic background)

No I think its very much on track because a fundamental part of every promoter's story is
explaining the money angle ... where the money
went (as if its supposed to go somewhere other
than to Tina Bar and out into the Pacific!)

Its hard to balance a jumper being professional
and the same person bumbling at the end and losing the money! Promoters demand perfection in
their candidates. Perfection = credibility?

Blevins has not told us how any money got to Tina Bar and conforms with the facts of the money (Blevins knows or thinks he knows!). Aeyee there's
the rub...

Where is the candidate that was an Indian who knew how to live off the Northwestern woods in his bare feet and send smoke signals back to an accomplice? Who read Tintin! Who fought off ten hobos that night
and lost a little money near Tina Bar but survived
to get back to his Reservation? DB Hiawatha? Dan
is a good indian name. Dan George = Dan Cooper.

Come on folks and promoters! Show a little creativity here!

[skyjack71 0]

Quote

BTW: did anyone catch the fact that Cooper
remarked to Tina he really didnt care about the
money? He said, "I dont want it!". He obviously
had something more important on his mind ...
that said he didnt leave the money behind either.

for the record is that an official statement made by Cooper per the FBI records?Or is it one of the many myths created over the yrs by writers and others with certain agendas?

Sluggo: Time for the fact keeper intervien.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[georger 197]

Quote

Quote

BTW: did anyone catch the fact that Cooper
remarked to Tina he really didnt care about the
money? He said, "I dont want it!". He obviously
had something more important on his mind ...
that said he didnt leave the money behind either.

for the record is that an official statement made by Cooper per the FBI records?Or is it one of the many myths created over the yrs by writers and others with certain agendas?

Sluggo: Time for the fact keeper intervien.

Good point! Time for fact checking... overdue!

I would like to know what routes Kenny flew?
Any international routes? From this fact alone
Kenny's story could go a different direction
completely -

Kenny's interest in coins and stamps (collectables
of value) interests me. Did he acquire these items
while flying from place to place? Did he know what
he was collecting? If he buried money did he also
bury collectables he somehow acquired! Why no
precious stones (diamonds, rubies, emeralds)?

Maybe Kenny was a wealthy man?

Maybe he had no need to hijack an airplane
for a mere $200l?

Lets get this all out on the table ...

[Farflung 0]

georger and Orange1 have made salient points regarding gold.

Kenny strikes me as a 'mattress stuffer' or soft investor which is painfully common among those raised during the Great Depression. These people tend to live below their means, well below.

Here is where things begin to take the fork in the road.

Kenny spends $100 a month (a weeks pay) on rent and is characterized as impoverished rather than thrifty (search 'crash pad'). His apartment is called shabby and run down even though it is barely four years old (built 1967). Kenny spent years (3 or 4) on Shemya where there is no rent to pay and a large salary premium for living on the 'Black Pearl of the Pacific'.

Anyone with 20/20 hindsight, could have purchased $60 gold in 1972 and by 1994, amassed an estate value of near $1.2 million. Physical gold (bullion and coins) still occupy a rare niche in the American taxation spectrum in that gold is akin to bearer bonds. Take your gold to any coin shop or coin show and sell them without so much as a 1099 or receipt. No transaction, no tax. I do pray that common sense would interceded any thoughts of a person selling hundreds of ounces at one time (I know I'm wrong here).

Gold was never illegal to own as long as it was in the form of jewelry, not in excess of some ($100?) amount of legal tender or of numismatic value. You could drive an armored truck through that loophole.

Kenny seemed to have wanted to continue his modest lifestyle long after the hijacking.

I thought Kenny died of cancer. It seems a little (just itsy bit) strange that Kenny's estate would end up in a probate court when he was approaching his final hour. The transfer of physical gold and stamp collections could have been simple and tax free. He sure picked an expensive ending with the estate tax and all.

[airtwardo 6]

If it WAS him...he's obviously fairly good at not being caught.

If it WAS him...who says that he only committed one crime?


If a guy hits the lottery for 200K, how often does he hole up and quit playing??

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[georger 197]

Quote

georger and Orange1 have made salient points regarding gold.

Kenny strikes me as a 'mattress stuffer' or soft investor which is painfully common among those raised during the Great Depression. These people tend to live below their means, well below.

Here is where things begin to take the fork in the road.

Kenny spends $100 a month (a weeks pay) on rent and is characterized as impoverished rather than thrifty (search 'crash pad'). His apartment is called shabby and run down even though it is barely four years old (built 1967). Kenny spent years (3 or 4) on Shemya where there is no rent to pay and a large salary premium for living on the 'Black Pearl of the Pacific'.

Anyone with 20/20 hindsight, could have purchased $60 gold in 1972 and by 1994, amassed an estate value of near $1.2 million. Physical gold (bullion and coins) still occupy a rare niche in the American taxation spectrum in that gold is akin to bearer bonds. Take your gold to any coin shop or coin show and sell them without so much as a 1099 or receipt. No transaction, no tax. I do pray that common sense would interceded any thoughts of a person selling hundreds of ounces at one time (I know I'm wrong here).

Gold was never illegal to own as long as it was in the form of jewelry, not in excess of some ($100?) amount of legal tender or of numismatic value. You could drive an armored truck through that loophole.

Kenny seemed to have wanted to continue his modest lifestyle long after the hijacking.

I thought Kenny died of cancer. It seems a little (just itsy bit) strange that Kenny's estate would end up in a probate court when he was approaching his final hour. The transfer of physical gold and stamp collections could have been simple and tax free. He sure picked an expensive ending with the estate tax and all.

agree. I dont see that Kenny had any financial
need to hijack an airplane, or any financial record
indicating he did. Kenny seemed very well adjusted
so I dont see Cooper's "grudge" at work in Kenny.

I seriously doubt Blevins can account for money
being at Tina Bar which connects with Kenny.

Everything else is anecdotal and questionable -
he-said vs she-said.

Kenny does not fit the physical profile.

Put Kenny on the plane?

Put some money at Tina Bar which conforms to
facts of the money at Tina Bar.

G.

[377 20]

Quote

Put some money at Tina Bar which conforms to
facts of the money at Tina Bar.

G.

That Tena bar money is sure a nuisance. It messes up so many good DBC scenarios. stories and theories. It is a constraining fact and a really big one at that. The door placard didnt get in the way of much speculation, but the money sure does.

Where is the damned rig? I mean they find a flimsy small door placard, lots of decomposed twenties, but no trace of that big canopy, all the suspension lines, nylon webbing and the many pieces of very durable metal harness and container hardware.

Frustrating.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[Sluggo_Monster 0]

georger:

Some of Kenney's routes {emphasis mine} and other stuff.

Quote

From:
Unmasking D.B. Cooper by Geoffrey Gray

“He was an amusing character,” McWilliams says now of Kenny. He describes life in the house as “odd.” There were always other men around, men from the Army whom Kenny knew and had relationships with. “It was uncomfortable to me, because I’m not like that, but not everybody lived in that house at night,” McWilliams says. Living there as a teenager was also liberating. When Kenny came back from Japan or Germany, there were always gifts: expensive food, big bottles of aged sake, ceramic dolls. Kenny never held back financially. They always ate out. “Any restaurant, really,” McWilliams says. “He’d always call it ‘my turn.’ He’d never accept that I pay for some of the things that he ate.” Kenny also helped Mac and other young men who lived with them learn how to save. Once, as a teenager, McWilliams says, he wanted to buy a car. Kenny opened up a bank account for him and matched every dollar he earned. “There was always a little bit of cash, maybe a little bit in his dresser. Also in his wallet.” He thinks it’s possible Kenny was D.B. “As a steward, they made good money, but they didn’t make that much money.”

Remember a "Purser" handled the money for the flight!


PS (mostly for Farflung):
About the title of this post:
Why does no one ever ask questions about Alice (Peg?) Hancock? I'll bet she knows a lot (and so does Harold Anderson).

REMEMBER! Those who talk... DON'T KNOW! Those who know... DON'T TALK!

Web Page
Blog
NORJAK Forum

[Farflung 0]

Sluggo Monster,

You're correct about asking Alice. More like 'Jefferson 727' perhaps? That Starship name was a thinly veiled reference to... that's right... you got it... Roswell UFOs... which are.... time machines.

Grace Slick had some deep pipes that I frequently confused with Mariska Veres' who sang the haunting tune 'Venus'. Starships, Venus, Roswell and coded lyrics..... do they mock me?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U2DBcbZc3ck


He grabbed it from the counter top,

was running for a silver plane.

with a plan to hatch way above,

and Cooper was his name.


That's D B......

Yeah, Northwest that's D B....

Well, he's a genius,

Join the choir,

you can conspire.


Well, got served peanuts,

frequent flyer,

what will transpire?


(interlude)


Mucklow saw with her own eyes,

a bomb that would make her get,

a message to the cockpit she was,

to do what no one else has.


She's got it,

Yeah, Tina she's got it.

Well, have you seen this?

I require,

the cash acquire.


Hell, have you seen this?

better try 'er.

or we'll retire.



(Cooper jumps stanza)

Ahhhhhh ahhhhhhh Ahhhh Ahhhhhhhhhh ahhhhh.....

(still in free fall)

Ahhhhhhh ahhhhhh ahhhhhh ahhhhhh.....


He's got it,

Yeah, Northwest,

He's got it.


Well, hey there genius,

don't perspire,

it's your quagmire.


Well, I'm the meanest,

won't expire,

that those admire.


(have a bit of a zombie dance)

[377 20]

I always though Venus was an innovative song and now we have new lyrics. Well done Farflung.

Tina, She's GOT IT!

She sure does...

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[georger 197]

Remember a "Purser" handled the money for the flight!

audit.

PS (mostly for Farflung):
About the title of this post:
Why does no one ever ask questions about Alice (Peg?) Hancock? I'll bet she knows a lot (and so does Harold Anderson).

[skyjack71 0]

[

Quote

About the title of this post:
Why does no one ever ask questions about Alice (Peg?) Hancock? I'll bet she knows a lot (and so does Harold Anderson).

REMEMBER! Those who talk... DON'T KNOW! Those who know... DON'T TALK!

Sluggo: I haven't been on in a few days ( computer out of commission). I know what Jefferson Airplane means. It is a song and one Duane would only hum the tune to and usually only when he was giddy or very very drunk. He did a little airplane thing with it.

Surprised no one caught it, but like I said I haven't been here in a few days and I am currently using a friends computer in her house.....

All I can say to Blevins - is Good Luck, but I warned him he would only be making a fool out of himself - there is one born every second. Me. I just have blonde root so I am told.

I expect everyone needs to buckle up and hold on tight. Hope to see you guys around someday - better sooner than later...if you get my drift.

Love Ya All (even the ones who give me a hard time). This excludes Jerry T.---no excuse in his treatment of me.

Like I said - love ya and hope I get the chance to meet ALL of you guys, but that is going to take a Miracle. Miracles do happen - I had one this morning because I prayed last night for a sign and guidance and when I went outside - there was my sign staring straight at me right out on the horizon.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[1969912 0]

Quote

There is a GREAT book on Japanese attacks on the US mainland during WW 2 called Silent Siege...

Thanks. I just received a used copy in the mail yesterday. Very detailed book. Interestingly, mine is stamped "Property of Battery Point Lighthouse" and is signed by the author.

"Once we got to the point where twenty/something's needed a place on the corner that changed the oil in their cars we were doomed . . ."
-NickDG

[umlaw95 0]

Hello to everyone, and thanks to the good people hosting this forum and allowing me to take part in this discussion. Honestly, I haven't yet read all 752 pages of posts so far, but I really hope some of the more knowlegdeable people and Mr. Carr are still around.

A little intro. I'm not a jumper. I'm not a pilot, but it is my life's dream to own a UH-1. What I am is a trial attorney. I have been a prosecutor, I have been a public defender. I have represented clients in every court, state and federal, at every level in the state of Florida, except the US District Court of Appeal. (Technically, they are in Atlanta, so my statement stands.) And of all this in under 6 years. I don't want to sound like an arrogant @sshole, but I know my job, it's all I ever wanted to do.

I also love history, and history's mysteries. Since the Grand Duchess Anastasia's body was found recently, that only leaves Jack the Ripper and Dan Cooper for me to focus on. I'll leave the Ripperology to someone else.

My approach to the Cooper case is simple, it is the same as any other case I work on. What are the facts, what is the law, what do I need to convince the six-headed monster? In short I care about evidence. What evidence do I have? How persuasive is it? Will I have any problems with admissibility? How can it be used or turned against my theory of the case?
And if the evidence doesn't speak for itself, what will an expert witness make of it?

And that's why I'm here. I promise I will read through the posts as much as possible so I don't bother asking questions that have already been beaten to death. Also, I promise I will try to be as helpful as I can and answer any questions others pose of me. Beyond that, let me also admit that I have a favorite suspect and that is Kenneth Christiansen. IF, again, IF what I have heard about him is all true, *especially* Tina Mucklow's statements concerning his ID, I would feel anywhere between 60-80% confidence taking him to trial, in a criminal court. Where as most of you already know, the prosecution has both the burden of production and persuasion, "beyond and to the exclusion of any and all reasonable doubt."

Before proceeding, a little discourse on evidence. There two kinds of evidence. Direct and circumstantial. Basically, direct evidence is anything that tends to prove a necessary fact needed to establish an element of the offense. Circumstantial evidence requires you to make some logical inference from it to the fact you are trying to prove. Mucklow's ID (even though not 100%) is direct evidence, KC working for airlines, being a paratrooper, etc. is circumstantial evidence. At least in Florida, a conviction where even one of the elements of the offense relies on proof by circumstantial evidence, that cicumstantial evidence must be of a character "so probative in value as to exceed any reasonable hypothesis of evidence." A pretty high burden indeed.

Even with all that, I still think I could sell him to a jury as the hijacker. As in any case, I check my instincts with any lay people around me who will listen. So far, everyone who has seen the Christiansen picture compared to the FBI composite *sketches* (plural) has been convinced they are the same person. Remember, a jury is six schlubs off the street too dumb to get off jury duty. If they think the picture is him, you get a conviction. How he did it, how he got away, doesn't really matter so much.

But you still have to cover the holes. The money is a major problem. How can you say Christiansen stole the money and spent it on those properties if none of the money ever turned up. I have spoken to many people with banking and banking equipment experience, and even if Cooper did wait until the heat died down, there's no way 9,000 bills got burned by the treasury without one being found. All those serial numbers of destroyed cash are recorded (to the extent possible) to make sure that they have an accurate count of what's in circulation. One very possible way around this is spend it overseas. In many third-world nations, US currency is highly valued, and just might not make it back to the US. So, didn't Christiansen fly overseas to Asia as part of his job with NWA? If so, Asia is a possible money-laundering source.

The money that was found on the riverbank, frankly, though, I believe is very, very good evidence that the hijack money (at least the lion's share of it) was never spent. Not because of three bundles found in the same hole, but the fragments found throughout the area. That suggests the whole kaboodle ended up in the drink. How else would it have been so diversely spread?

Which leads to what seems to be everybody's pet here, the flightpath. Has anybody come forward with a flightpath that would have explained the money being found where it was? For that matter, how sure is anybody that he jumped when they say he did? I understand it was by the jet correcting itself circa 8:10. But it's my understanding that it was from the stairs being lowered, would the weight of a man falling off the stairs have been noticed in the cabin? If that were true, wouldn't every heavyset person flopping down in the head "genuflect" the plane?

Well, I guess that's enough for now, anybody reading this far down has bloodshot enough eyes. Thanks for reading, looking forward to your replies.

Thanks,
TDG

P.S. I always loved "Venus" too, but the Bananarama version. I guess there's just no accounting for taste.

"We got 'em and we shot 'em, according to Rule 303."
The Breaker

[Robert99 37]

TDG, Welcome and you have your work cut out for you. "Facts" are hard to come by in this matter and there are about 20+ versions of the facts for every item that is discussed.

May I suggest that you visit Sluggo's web page and, for instance, compare the Air Traffic Control transcripts from the Seattle ATC Center with those from the Oakland ATC Center. You will rapidly come to the conclusion that the Seattle ATC transcripts have been "sanitized" after the 1971 hijacking, and probably after the money was found at Tina Bar in 1980. Apparently after the money was found, some of the facts were changed, or deleted, so as to not contradict someone's theory and the flight path was the main item changed. Consequently, there is no agreement as to the actual flight path in the Portland area. And careful checking into radar data will eliminate it as a meaningful tool for determining the flight path.

Having said that, there is no reason whatsoever at this time for dismissing the possibility that the airliner actually flew directly over Tina Bar. Some people disagree with this possibility rather strongly.

So please act as a defense attorney in this matter and don't accept any alleged "fact" at its face value. If you want to act as a prosecutor, Jo Weber would probably be delighted to have you assist in proving that her late husband, Duane Weber, was D. B. Cooper (although he wasn't).

Again, welcome.

Robert Nicholson

[Robert99 37]

The claim that Cooper threw money in the river or buried some at Tina Bar just doesn't pass the smell test. And since it took 8+ years to find it, it didn't fool anyone initially.

There is credible evidence that fragments of some bills were found a couple of feet under the sand. To me, this suggests that the money deposition at Tina Bar was a repeatable event and that, if true, means that Cooper probably landed on solid ground near Tina Bar and stayed in that location for a period of years.

Robert

[skyjack71 0]

Until I contacted the FBI in 1996 NO one had EVER explained how the money got on Tena's Bar.

With NO knowledge of the crime I am the only person who has ever - put that money on Tena's Bar during the time span the Palmer Report and a recent report thur a private individual which stated the found money had only been in the river for about one yr.

In 1979 my husband took me to WA and there were some unusual happenings in regards to that trip. Things I did not question until 1996 when I learned who Dan Cooper was.

Until I contacted the FBI in 1996 - I was the only person to put the money in the water within a yr. of the find. When the find was made public in 1980 my husband immediately turned in his resignation to a company he was making GOOD money with.

Then 2 wks after the find there was a special on TV. My husband arranged for us to go out in the middle of the wk with another couple (I had never met them). We never went with other people. I apologized to the woman for being poor company as mid week things where not normal for us and there was a program on TV I wanted to see about the recent Money find regarding Cooper.

Duane got VERY drunk that night.
Crawling drunk.

He was afraid he had said too much on that trip and he had no idea what the program would reveal and I might not put 2 and 2 together and get 4. Dumb Blonde Syndrome. I did not know the name used by D.B. Cooper was Dan Cooper (the name my husband told me he was 11 days before he died).

I would never have known who Dan Cooper was had it not been for a friend who I had told about Duane's confession. I got a book out of the library and was on the phone to the FBI within the first 1/3 of the book. Until that night I did not know the name given by D.B. Cooper was Dan Cooper. This was 1 yr and 2 months after Duane had died.

On our trip in 1979 - Duane threw a sack into the Columbia behind the Red Lion in Vancouver at the foot of the I 5 bridge.

On our trip he showed me things and told me things that meant zero to me. Now they do. I have retraced that trip - and the answers are revealing. Duane had a background in WA from 1945 to 1949 and possibly again in the the 60's for short period of time.

You know I lived in Georgia for several yrs. You know that one his ex-wives was married to an attorney - are you that attorney?
If your last name starts with C then I know who you are.

377 will tell you that I am NO DUMB Blonde. Sometimes it pay to play dumb...and I used that to the fullest. I am tired of all of the claimes made by many and I am now currently involved in something that will end the fiasco once and for all.

The FBI among others have covered up the background of Duane L. Weber and his many aliases....and I am proving that but NOT on this forum. Christiansen was NOT Cooper. Coffelt was not Cooper and Gossett was not Cooper. Coffelt was deceased when the money was found - it had not been in the river for 8 yrs.

Have you spoke with the co-pilot and the attendants? Probably not! I am the only person besides the crew who KNOWS what that money went out of that plane in - END OF SUBJECT!

Throw your time and money away because that is what I did for several yrs. My mistake was calling Mr. F and if your name starts with a C then you know who Mr. F is. I had ceased all communications with him in the last few yrs - but, out of the blue called him and you are the result of that call. SEE - NOT a dumb blonde.

Give BR my regards if he is still living.

PS. If the money find was something thrown out of the plane it would NOT have stayed in bundles for 7 yrs. Use your heads and use some logic. The money being money thrown from the plane in 1971 is NOT LOGICAL.

So now who has Blond Roots.

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