DB Cooper

[quade 3]

Quote

Quote

OK georger, time to whip out your photo analysis software and skills on 'The Picture'.

What is that in Kenny's left hand? Briefcase or Navbag?

A Nav or Publications bag would be hard to display a bomb in the fashion described by the Flight Attendant.

What did Cooper have on the plane? Briefcase or luggage? What sort of sack or bag was he holding. I had imagined something on par with a lunch sack rather than a full size grocery bag.

Here, you be the judge. Looks more like a nav or
flight case ... not an ordinary briefcase.

Witnesses agreed on briefcase vs other types of
containers ... remember Tina described the contents
(bomb components)..

For Quade's benefit - I used gamma level adjustments (200-90)
+ a medium cut noise filter in Photoshop.
Quade will know what Im
talking about...

The problem is . . . it's a brief case. By attaching adjectives like "nav" or "flight" you're creating the impression that it might have belonged to part of the flight crew or a person that was otherwise familiar with aviation.

In fact though, it's just a large brief case. Briefcases do come in sizes that large and have for many, many years. They're used by everyone from traveling salesmen to lawyers.

For example;
http://www.bagsforme.com/bags/WI-1108
http://www.overstock.com/Luggage-Bags/Amerileather-Executive-Attache-Briefcase/2669843/product.html

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[skyjack71 0]

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Jo wrote:

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Why was Duane so worried about a lot of false ID in an old beat-up wallet while he was in the hospital? He had removed what ever was in that vault and placed the Magazine in it - before he went to the hospital. My name was not on the vault - and he knew I would not have access to it unless he got it out - but what was it? I think it was proof of what he told me "I'm Dan Cooper" because he got upset with my not understanding what he was trying to tell me.

Funny how every single piece of tangible evidence that might prove Duane was DBC is "missing". Could there be another logical conclusion one could draw from this state of affairs, such as Duane lied about being Dan Cooper and had nothing to do with Norjack?

Please Jo, just consider the possibility. You have no evidence that what Duane told you from his hospital bed was true. You just have unsubstantiated hunches, beliefs and yes... hopes.

It pains me to see this obsession consume you, but maybe it is what keeps you going.

Still, I am glad to have you here.

377

I held the evidence in my hands -the ticket, the bank bag and the stub. The other things such as the square he carried in his wallet, the parachute parts, patches-----when someone can erase the memories then I will give up. I know what he told me and that he was mad because I didn't understand.

What-ever was in that van was clues or evidence - and I nor Anne knew what we were looking for. If we had known who Dan Cooper was, we would have taken the van apart. I know what he told me and showed me on that trip. I know the FBI denies Duane ever having been in WA (that is NOT true), they denied his Army record and I proved them wrong. I believe I have evidence and had other things that put him on that plane....but, I didn't know what they were.

What does Blevins have, what does Cook have, what does Grey have, what did Tosaw have, what does Himmelsbach have....all of these people had stories to tell and they don't have one iota of proof. All Duane had was one stupid woman who didn't listen to what he told her...or take the time to try to understand what he was talking about. None of them had a suspect take them to the area and point out things that would be significant....how can the FBI say Duane was never in WA when he was? How can they sey he wasn't in Camino when he was? The truth is the FBI did not investigate.

We are proving he was in Camino and in Washington , but the FBI doesn't even want me to bring the proof to their office - Write them a Letter. If they have proof Duane WAS NOT Cooper then why don't the produce it and let me get on with my life and get out of their hair?
The FBI has not been able to prove Duane was not Cooper and if they could they would have sent me documents that would prove he was not Cooper. They have provided nothing about his past - Zero - Nothing. ALL I have is what I and Doug found. The FBI never produced the Jefferson record other than what is on line....they can't even prove he was a resident of Jefferson for the full time they claim he was there. They did not produce a picture of Duane in Jefferson...mug shots - intake and out put.

I believe if anyone produces a picture of Tina as an 8 old child that I will put Duane on that plane. If I didn't believe in miracles and believe what he told me - I would not give up my life to prove it...and that is what I have done. This has cost me not only the time I could have enjoyed my life, but financially also and definitely emotionally and it has affected my health.

If I didn't believe with all of my heart and soul that Duane was Dan Cooper - never would I have taken on the challenge. I expected the FBI to find something, but after 4 yrs I realized they had not even looked. Now it is 14 yrs and I know they didn't look.

Only with the FBI's co-operation can I put Duane on that plane. If they choose to keep secrets about evidence then not only can I not put Duane on the plane - NO one else can put their sujects on the plane.

Now with this other man surfacing claiming that there was a program for ex-cons out of a certain state- and that another suspect was with this same organization - doesn't anyone think that does NOT need to be investigated? Why aren't they doing this - because the man is so powerful and rich and politically connected that he was above reproach. The government sanctioned his actions. Yet, he hired ex-cons - even if for his legitiment business - that is against the law.

A licensed Life Insurance agent cannot be a convicted criminal or felon. These men weren't hired to be insurance agents they were trained to infiltrate the mafia and other organizations for information he could use for leverage. I know and understand little about this kind of world and never dreamt my search would take me into the abyss. Protect and do NO harm.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[Farflung 0]

Quade reflected:

"The problem is . . . it's a brief case. By attaching adjectives like "nav" or "flight" you're creating the impression that it might have belonged to part of the flight crew or a person that was otherwise familiar with aviation."

Well Quade, your right. By attaching adjectives like 'nav' or 'flight', I'm also using the jargon applied to these devices by everyone I ever flew with for over 12,000 hours. Can you believe that we all were part of a flight crew and were familiar with aviation just like Kenny and the crew on Flight 305?

Attached are ten images from contemporary web sites which supply gear for professional flight crews (not shoe clerks). The names have not been changed. Are any of them called "common sample cases" or "briefcases' or "catalog cases"?

All those years of global flying with hundreds and hundreds of aviators, some with over 30,000 hours and you think one of them called the Pubs Bag a 'common sample case'? OK then, you win. Got me red handed. Once on the crew bus, someone asked where the Chart Case was and I said 'Oh, do you mean the catalog case?'

Same for 'glove boxes' - no gloves in them. I have suitcases that have never held a suit either. The saddle bags on the motorcycle; just checked - not a saddle to be found.

I feel so free now that I've been unshackled from my past experiences in flying heavies. Even managed to forget that miserable time spent on Shemya. Wasn't worth much anyway, since all one needs to counter years and years of direct and largely unpleasant experiences is an opinion and a keyboard. Wait, keyboard would presume a bunch of keys and a piece of wood. All this has is a bunch of buttons mounted on plastic. Here I go again.

[Farflung 0]

Straight from Sluggo Monster's web page:

"The man, a (roughly) 45 year old Caucasian with a Mediterranean (swarthy) complexion wearing a dark business suit and carrying a briefcase and a small, brown paper sack..."

"If the man's appearance could have a one-word description, it would be 'unremarkable'".

I see how I have been reading too much into such words as 'small paper sack' and 'briefcase'. For crying out loud, how would a Ticket Agent know if the sack was made out of paper? That would put him in the wood pulp business instead of an airline. He should have just said sack. And what exactly is meant by small? I give up.

I think we know what Cooper looked like based upon the un-biased and one true description.

[georger 194]

Quote

Straight from Sluggo Monster's web page:

"The man, a (roughly) 45 year old Caucasian with a Mediterranean (swarthy) complexion wearing a dark business suit and carrying a briefcase and a small, brown paper sack..."

"If the man's appearance could have a one-word description, it would be 'unremarkable'".

I see how I have been reading too much into such words as 'small paper sack' and 'briefcase'. For crying out loud, how would a Ticket Agent know if the sack was made out of paper? That would put him in the wood pulp business instead of an airline. He should have just said sack. And what exactly is meant by small? I give up.

I think we know what Cooper looked like based upon the un-biased and one true description.

Ckret


Jumps
License
In sport :
:
:

Apr 2, 2008, 4:44 AM

Post #918 of 10319 (1803 views)

Registered: Sep 7, 2007
Posts: 522 Re: [skyjack71] If Cooper Lived... [In reply to]
Can't Post

It was a briefcase, no one that had direct contact with Cooper described anything other than a briefcase and small paper bag.

[nigel99 143]

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Straight from Sluggo Monster's web page:

"The man, a (roughly) 45 year old Caucasian with a Mediterranean (swarthy) complexion wearing a dark business suit and carrying a briefcase and a small, brown paper sack..."

"If the man's appearance could have a one-word description, it would be 'unremarkable'".

I see how I have been reading too much into such words as 'small paper sack' and 'briefcase'. For crying out loud, how would a Ticket Agent know if the sack was made out of paper? That would put him in the wood pulp business instead of an airline. He should have just said sack. And what exactly is meant by small? I give up.

I think we know what Cooper looked like based upon the un-biased and one true description.

Well its definately Duanes hands in that photo.

Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived.

[377 20]

Farflung wrote:

Quote

And what exactly is meant by small? I give up.

small:http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://marypmadigan.files.wordpress.com/2009/07/cricket_runway_med.jpg%3Fw%3D429%26h%3D285&imgrefurl=http://marypmadigan.wordpress.com/2009/07/06/a-very-small-plane/&usg=__COTeC3GOUcjXHnstkutjhu8hx04=&h=285&w=429&sz=50&hl=en&start=17&sig2=Y1fJQKW7FPNH8pcs8Z9zBA&zoom=1&um=1&itbs=1&tbnid=7ZCsnAFyg2vCFM:&tbnh=84&tbnw=126&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dvery%2Bsmall%2Bplane%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26rls%3Dcom.microsoft:en-us:IE-SearchBox%26rlz%3D1I7GGLL_en%26tbs%3Disch:1&ei=DrejTKD3MoKCswbArbWtCA

big: (Is that you in the left seat?)
http://www.aerospaceweb.org/aircraft/bomber/b52/b52_04.jpg

small Electra: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/94/Earhart_and_electra.jpeg

big Electra:http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.century-of-flight.net/Aviation%2520history/photo_albums/timeline/airliners/images/16.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.century-of-flight.net/Aviation%2520history/coming%2520of%2520age/Lockheed%2520L-188%2520Electra.htm&usg=__en2Y0Hhj6VIS6LRtmuiHbUbFvok=&h=298&w=450&sz=35&hl=en&start=7&sig2=fyTxdJF03S7EN1iPWT02PQ&zoom=1&um=1&itbs=1&tbnid=Bg7-7BlhrsdORM:&tbnh=84&tbnw=127&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dlockheed%2B188%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26rls%3Dcom.microsoft:en-us:IE-SearchBox%26rlz%3D1I7GGLL_en%26tbs%3Disch:1&ei=3LejTIKpMcfBswbFyvCkCA

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[georger 194]

Quote

Farflung wrote:

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And what exactly is meant by small? I give up.

The word 'small' is referenced in terms of what can be held in the palm of the hand ... etimologically.
Nothing has changed in that regard in usage and semantics since the first languages, probably
developed by Homo Erectus in Afrika.

And in one ancient language the word for large
(gadol) means literally what cannot be held in the
palm of a hand... there are several old languages
which make that split.

These things were probably born of common agreement. A small bag would be a bag that could be held (by size and weight) in the palm of a hand,
and everyone would accept that as a common fact.
All but Artur Rubenstein and Robert Blevins of course
whose hands could reach four octaves on the Afhar
Royal Harp. Baruq Adonai!

[Farflung 0]

That's just the point 377,

What are "low hours"? For a Lycoming O-360, 900 hours would be low to mid time. A Pratt Whitney R-985 (boner), 900 hours would be near run out.

Yet the school of common sense can kick in and assume; one probably means the opposed power plants favored since the end of WWII.

Or they can spend what little time they have left on the planet, treating each and every interaction as a new and baffling experience which lives in a world of perpetual randomness.

[Farflung 0]

I forgot that this is a skydiving forum and not an aviation chat room.

Hopefully this will clear up any confusion about the difference between a Lycoming O-360 and a classic like the R-985.

Sorry about that.

[377 20]

Q: What is the model of the largest radial engine ever used to power a civilian jumpship?

A: The P&W R4360-59B Wasp Major "AKA corncob"... 28 oil sliinging cylinders, basically four 7 cyl radials lined up with a common crankshaft.

Four of these beasts powered the surplus C 97 that dropped demo teams into an airshow in Southern Calif back a few decades ago. The plane was owned by the Foundation for Airborne Relief, an ill fated venture to assemble a fleet of surplus C 133s and C 97s for relief flights and medical support.

That's 224 spark plugs on one plane!

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[skyjack71 0]

According to Himmeslback - the bag was small - lunch bag size.
Remember back in 1971 - the sandwiches were normal and not supper sized and not put in boxes then in a bag.

To me this means 5 to 6 inches wide and 3 to 4 inches deep.
Tall enough to fold over at the top - so the height would be between 10 and 8 inches. The standards have change so much over the last 40 yrs...I doubt too many people remember what a lunch bag looks like.

For all we know - he bought 2 or 4 packs of smokes before boarding...there was never any mention of his having smokes in the briefcase.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[georger 194]

Quote

Georger says in part:

Quote

"and Robert Blevins of course
whose hands could reach four octaves... "

I wouldn't know how to handle it if you forgot to lay a daily insult on me.

ITS A JOKE HONEY! sheesh.

You are confusing me with somebody important!

You probably think this song is about you ...

[Orange1 0]

Quote

[used by Cooper.

Contents of paper bag? Who knows? Cigarettes, a hat, food perhaps. Maybe a map and a compass.

Side note: Katy Watson testified that Christiansen smoked a lot and was usually a Raleigh man. But so were a lot of other people. It was a popular brand.

bag - maybe goggles? an alti? ... if he was a skydiver ...

re raleigh - somewhere in the distant past on this forum there was some stuff someone dug up (snow? can't remember) on popular cigarette brands at the time. it certainly was!

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[skyjack71 0]

If you guys thought I was way out with the cover-up theory - well, Blevins is completely out of the ball park.

I never heard anyone suggest Cooper was bald. Believe me - when I say the wigs of 1971 could not be dequise that well.
They were pretty obvious - for example David Ferrie and his homemade wig. Even his eyebrows were fake. Died in 1969 I think, but a lot of people wanted to see him dead.

For instance Duane Weber and with GOOD cause...but, you have not heard me talk about that one and I won't - it is too spooky for willy nillies.

See the attachment

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[skyjack71 0]

Hey, Orange don't give me a hard time on that last post - Blevins was asking for it and Georger deleted his post before Blevins could see it.

The Raleighs had coupons on them and people saved them for nice little trinkets and junk. I have often wonder if that is not where the name Cooper came from. Dan said the first part of his name and cut it short and then looked down at the pack in his hand and said Couuper. Exactly the way Weber Coooed out Cooper when he told me he was Dan Cooooper.

Now watch Blevins make that one part of his story - but, I have told it before in this forum and in other places.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[georger 194]

I never heard anyone suggest Cooper was bald.

[Orange1 0]

Quote

Hey, Orange don't give me a hard time on that last post - Blevins was asking for it and Georger deleted his post before Blevins could see it.

huh??? If you look at that post properly you'll see I was replying to Blevins, not to you.

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[Farflung 0]

One has to admit the 'Bald Cooper' article is equally funny and inaccurate.

They have the date of the hijacking as 23 Nov. But then the FAA transcripts had the wrong date also.

He 'signed the passenger list'? Things sure must have been different in 1971 if passengers were signing a passenger list. I've never heard or observed such a practice in my life, but I'm sure someone will chime in with how common it is.

They got the ransom wrong as well. It was four parachutes, $200,000 and a knapsack. Wonder why the knapsack is ignored? Not glam enough I suppose. Plus, I used to think a knapsack would be like a small backpack with straps. Since 'briefcase' now covers anything from a ladies clutch to a steamer trunk, a knapsack must be anything from a small, paper bag to a circus tent.

But the best part of the article was saved for last. The FBI showed a photo of the 'bald' suspect taken in front of a downtown wig shop. Pee my pants absurd. Yes, I insist, they caught that bald guy doping just what every bald man does; stand in front of a wig shop with a forlorn look of hope that some day he will come into enough money to cover his shame.

That's why fat people are ALWAYS photographed in front of bakery displays, computer geeks are spotted in front of sperm banks and Roswell aliens in trailer parks.

[skyjack71 0]

Folks below is my post to Orange about the coupons:


Hey, Orange don't give me a hard time on that last post - Blevins was asking for it and Georger deleted his post before Blevins could see it.

The Raleighs had coupons on them and people saved them for nice little trinkets and junk. I have often wonder if that is not where the name Cooper came from. Dan said the first part of his name and cut it short and then looked down at the pack in his hand and said Couuper. Exactly the way Weber Coooed out Cooper when he told me he was Dan Cooooper.

Now watch Blevins make that one part of his story - but, I have told it before in this forum and in other places.


--------------------------------------
Copyright©2009 by Jo Weber




Then Blevins makes this ridiculous post below!

Blevins states:
...........................................
Skyjack71 says in part:

"Now watch Blevins make that one part of his story....."

What story? I posted the actual ARTICLE from the Bremerton Sun that was published in May, 1972. I did not write the article, but it exists nonetheless. Early on in the investigation, the FBI was pursuing many leads. And back in those days around Seattle, every newspaper had contacts in law enforcement, whether it was the local cops, the Seattle police, or the FBI.



Ok, guys all of you know I was referring to Blevins making my story about the Dan Cooper name and the Raleigh Coupons part of his own story. He was quick to make it look LIKE I was talking about the Bremerton Sun article and far from it.

I had been aware of that article for yrs and Himmelsbach and I talked about it before - he gave NO credence to the story, but they investigated it.


Blevins takes a statement about the Coupons and then references it to his Bremerton Article - This is how he is writing his story? Talk about linking things together that have no connection and connecting dots that do not connects - he takes the cake. I am just an old woman with Dumb Blonde Sydrome and he is supposedly a writer and editor. His post was deliberate in order to make it look like I was referring to his "find" about Bremerton - Gee Whiz.

I jump around in my post - but Blevins taking the focus off of the Cooooper and Coupons and making it appear my post was about the Bald Article takes the cake. How the H does he edit books? I am not a writer nor editor or proofer...but when someone turns a statement around I make - I do GET it.

His motive is the last color I used. Green

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[skyjack71 0]

Jo Said:

Quote

Hey, Orange don't give me a hard time on that last post - Blevins was asking for it and Georger deleted his post before Blevins could see it.

Orange replied:

Quote

huh??? If you look at that post properly you'll see I was replying to Blevins, not to you.

=============


I KNOW you were referring to Blevins - I was just asking you not to give me a hard time regarding my reply to Blevins. That was all - sorry I didn't make this explicit and remember I have Dumb Blonde Syndrome -!

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[Sluggo_Monster 0]

Absolute proof that: “the FBI, Seattle cops, and every other LE agency around here were flipping over every possible rock trying somehow to find the hijacker” in the Spring of 1972.

Hurry... Hurry… Hurry. Get your proof here!

They couldn’t put it in the newspaper if it wasn’t true! Right?

Web Page
Blog
NORJAK Forum

[377 20]

Thats proof enough for me Sluggo. Still, I am really pissed that the FBI missed me. I had travelled to Seattle recently, was still jumping military gear, and had all kinds of Boeing airliner flight manuals in my home library.

I think some jumpers lied about being questioned. It was a status symbol back then.

Funny, I spoke with some friends whose daughter has taken up jumping and has about 100 jumps at Lodi. They told me just weeks ago that the DZ was run by a person believed to have been DB Cooper, Bill Dause. Bill isnt even close to the physical description but the legend persists. With over 26,000 jumps and a lot of left seat hours in transport category aircraft there is little doubt that Bill had the air skills.

I think about Larry Carr reading his forum, barred from posting and getting a few laughs at our wild tangents and intermitent squabbling. No real progress has been made.

We need some new blood, some new ideas, a visit from Tom to tell us what he has been doing with all that test equipment and instrumentation. What about pollen, was that wild goose chase? What about the edge erosion and bored holes in the money? Dredged up ionto the bar or not?

Inquiring minds want to know.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[377 20]

Georger,

What say ye about the facial cranial match to the FBI sketch?

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[georger 194]

Quote

Absolute proof that: “the FBI, Seattle cops, and every other LE agency around here were flipping over every possible rock trying somehow to find the hijacker” in the Spring of 1972.

Hurry... Hurry… Hurry. Get your proof here!

They couldn’t put it in the newspaper if it wasn’t true! Right?

esp is working overtime ... here is the photo in question.There were four of em!

Note the palm trees in the background - but Seattle is warm and wet!