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nigel99

Breaking a bad habit?

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I've gotten into a bad habit of tucking my left leg up immediately after pitching. To some extent I'm even flying with my left leg slightly cocked, but I don't even notice it in freefall.

The problem is that on the snivelly canopy I'm jumping it consistently causes line twists and is going to result in a chop sooner or later. When I consciously point my toes during deployment I get nice on heading openings. The problem is its a habit to bring my left leg up, so any distraction like watching for traffic and I revert to the old behaviour.

Any suggestions on.breaking a bad habit?
Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived.

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Tie a length of string from your balls to your toe with only enough slack to allow you to bend your leg a little bit.
I reckon you'll have that habit broken in no time. B|:)
Remember you don't stop laughing because you grow old, you grow old because you stop laughing.

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jono

Tie a length of string from your balls to your toe with only enough slack to allow you to bend your leg a little bit.
I reckon you'll have that habit broken in no time. B|:)



LOl...what a troll answer...and here I thought I was the only notorious troll on the forums. Well played. I formally announce you sir as my apprentice padawan.

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Studies suggest it takes up to 2 months of daily repetition for something to become a habit and early repetitions have a bigger effect on retention than later ones, as does positive feedback reinforcement. If you have a bad habit, the only way to break it is to consciously replace the wrong thing with the right thing and do it repeatedly. It requires a sustained conscious effort, there are no short cuts.

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JackC1

Studies suggest it takes up to 2 months of daily repetition for something to become a habit and early repetitions have a bigger effect on retention than later ones, as does positive feedback reinforcement. If you have a bad habit, the only way to break it is to consciously replace the wrong thing with the right thing and do it repeatedly. It requires a sustained conscious effort, there are no short cuts.



I suspected that may be the case. It just frustrates me, as on 'normal' jumps I'm focussing on feet and knees together during deployment This weekend we did bigways and the last thing I needed was a canopy that wasn't fully flying with 26 other people all around. I was focussed on looking for traffic during deployment so my legs went to their natural position. Fortunately I just pointed myself away from traffic and kicked the twists out - did mean I landed off.
Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived.

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JackC1

Studies suggest it takes up to 2 months of daily repetition for something to become a habit and early repetitions have a bigger effect on retention than later ones, as does positive feedback reinforcement. If you have a bad habit, the only way to break it is to consciously replace the wrong thing with the right thing and do it repeatedly. It requires a sustained conscious effort, there are no short cuts.



And what studies would those be?

We are speaking about "habitation" and this generally can take place in 3 to 7 nights....Same to extinguish same behavior.

If yo can get this on vid, frequently seeing what you are doing can be a big help.

I would say just concentrate on your opening, I mean the whole dive dedicated to just one thing. Not having a RW jump / and at the end start to try to change stuff....

One jump one learning!

And or start jumping and putting your hands to the small of your back or grab the bottom of your container. Both hands and arms! You can fly reasonably well with just your legs and watch what happens to your arch as well:)
C
But what do I know, "I only have one tandem jump."

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nigel99



I suspected that may be the case. It just frustrates me, as on 'normal' jumps I'm focussing on feet and knees together during deployment This weekend we did bigways and the last thing I needed was a canopy that wasn't fully flying with 26 other people all around.



Another point of view would be... don't do anymore Bigways until you sort out your opening problems? :o
Birdshit & Fools Productions

"Son, only two things fall from the sky."

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ChrisD

And what studies would those be?



Lally, P., van Jaarsveld, C. H. M., Potts, H. W. W., & Wardle, J. (2010). How are habits formed: Modelling habit formation in the real world. European Journal of Social Psychology, 40, 998-1009.

But I'm sure you know better.

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ChrisD


And or start jumping and putting your hands to the small of your back or grab the bottom of your container. Both hands and arms! You can fly reasonably well with just your legs and watch what happens to your arch as well:)



Not sure this is a good idea for someone who is already having body position problems. Putting both hands behind your back/on your BOC can result in a more head-down attitude, which is not something you want at pull time.

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As a newbie, this is what helps me break bad habits:

Practice on the floor at home.

I've only got 10 jumps in so take my advice with a very sizeable chunk of salt.

That's how I worked on my arch, deployment, and back loops.

Anytime I'm unsure about something I'll practice it on my floor/bed, couch.

I'm guessing that if you start tucking in your leg, you'll feel it when you "deploy" on your floor. Also it'll help you with if your arms and legs are uneven.

Again, Dislcaimer: 10 measly jumps, grain of salt.

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I probably shouldn't but I'm going to have a second crack at this... put your rig on, get on a creeper pad and practice pitching 20 - 30+ times in a row (wouldn't worry about repacking the bridle in between) and even better if you can do this in front of a mirror then immediately repack the PC and bridle and go jump. Keep doing this till you find yourself doing it without having to think about it. Repetetion to enforce muscle memory is the key just like practicing EPs.
If that doesn't work.......I still say try the string.:)
Remember you don't stop laughing because you grow old, you grow old because you stop laughing.

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skyjumpenfool

***

I suspected that may be the case. It just frustrates me, as on 'normal' jumps I'm focussing on feet and knees together during deployment This weekend we did bigways and the last thing I needed was a canopy that wasn't fully flying with 26 other people all around.



Another point of view would be... don't do anymore Bigways until you sort out your opening problems? :o

That's sound advice.
Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived.

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Ok, solid idea on dirt diving my opening. Either on a creeper or the student ep hanging harness.

It's not during the pitch that's an issue, but during the snivel. Canopy stands me up and I adopt the skygod foot behind the knee pose:D as opposed to the Lego man pose that students take (feet straight and 30 degrees apart). Ye old Sabre that I jumped for the last couple of years opened so quick it always beat me to it:P

I'll be on Creepers for 4 way, I'll add deployment too the dirtdive and I'm sure it will help thanks.
Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived.

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Quote

I was focussed on looking for traffic during deployment



How about looking for traffic before deployment, then hold a heading during deployment. Don't worry about where your legs are. Just pick an object in the distance and hold a heading on it while you pull and count to 5.
You don't have to outrun the bear.

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evan85

***
And or start jumping and putting your hands to the small of your back or grab the bottom of your container. Both hands and arms! You can fly reasonably well with just your legs and watch what happens to your arch as well:)



Not sure this is a good idea for someone who is already having body position problems. Putting both hands behind your back/on your BOC can result in a more head-down attitude, which is not something you want at pull time.

Not at pull time , but as a flying exercise, and this is something you can do at a tunnel as well.
C
But what do I know, "I only have one tandem jump."

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JackC1

***And what studies would those be?



Lally, P., van Jaarsveld, C. H. M., Potts, H. W. W., & Wardle, J. (2010). How are habits formed: Modelling habit formation in the real world. European Journal of Social Psychology, 40, 998-1009.

But I'm sure you know better.

Did you actually read that thing? Perhaps habit is the wrong word to use? So this habit according to that research actually started in adolesnce?

My point was rather obscure, I'll admit. The problem starts with just one bit of obscure research, that isn't really research and has limited predictive value. This is the problem when quoting research on habits or any thing involved with learning theory. The research you quoted really has nothing to do with recency, primacy, or the last thing you hear...Do you understand trying to model behaivior to fit a particular curve and what all that means?

If you want to quote research then perhaps the face validity of tying a string as one novel solution may have a more successful outcome than doeing something and waiting upwards of 90 - 120 days to form a correct habit?

Nigel There is some truth to doing something that you will defenatly remember as a learning experience...While I can't condone tying a string to ones balls, the effect of a strong stimulus or increased stress can work wonders. In this case then, the string thing or something that would have great meaning might be more effective.

This is why filming oneself can be a great tool!

I myself frequently "forget" to fully flare. I like to touch the toggles to my lower thighs at or just before I hit each and every time. Sometimes in high winds I do the girl thing and raise my arms up high. (No disrespect to any female intended, although if you want to point out how words can effect behavior, go ahead.)

Anyways I had no idea that I was doing this arm raising thing until I saw the vid. For me seeing that I was in fact doing something that I was convinced I was not was a profound experience.

If you have a profound learning experience like this then you will correct the behaivior very quickly. The problem is what is profound to you, this is sort of a learning thing and varies quite a bit!

This is one of the best things about a tunnel and a good coach, you can spot this kind of thing in the tunnel and generally there is lots of good vid to be had.


Or you could just obsess and have a real scarey dream about a monster line twist in your reserve after the first really scarey bad opening and this might push you enough to fully concentrate on this behavior change you want to make.

Do the visualization thing! Visualization can be a powerfull tool to help you! And be POSITIVE. Do not visualize negative outcomes!!!!!

And since you mentioned checking for traffic, take a moment and make a few jumps free of traffic or anything else that could distract you so that you can concentrate!

C
You got this by the way!!! :)
Just do it and make the change!!!
But what do I know, "I only have one tandem jump."

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Do a few hop and pops so you can focus most of your attention to the opening and canopy flight.

I'm not sure I understand exactly what you're doing with your leg though... are you bringing your left leg in to a fetal position?

To solve the left leg issue you can try opening directly after tracking, that way your leg is already pushed out? Some may argue that opening in a track isn't a good idea, but as long as you're not too head-low there's nothing wrong with it:)
"Better to have a short life that is full of what you like doing than a long life spent in a miserable way." -Alan Watts

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DcloudZ

Do a few hop and pops so you can focus most of your attention to the opening and canopy flight.

I'm not sure I understand exactly what you're doing with your leg though... are you bringing your left leg in to a fetal position?

To solve the left leg issue you can try opening directly after tracking, that way your leg is already pushed out? Some may argue that opening in a track isn't a good idea, but as long as you're not too head-low there's nothing wrong with it:)



It's pretty simple really. Having uneven weight on your harness at higher wingloading and a slow opening is a recipe for twists. I naturally stand with my weight on my right leg, all it takes is lifting my left leg a couple of inches during the snivel and I can induce linetwists. During the bigways I was wearing more than 10% of my body weight in lead as I was in the base - that didn't help.

Anyway did a bunch of 4 way and was fine, it's a matter of refining body position. Student canopies and lower wingloading all you really need is shoulders square. One of the guys I was jumping with this weekend had developed bad habits that he got away with on his Sabre 2 for hundreds of jumps, he'd only just moved across to a highly loaded katana and his habits were causing issues on the katana.

I guess its a small part of the downsize equation that isn't always considered.
Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived.

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I also have a long snivelling moderately loaded elliptical. The long snivel allows me to make up for any small mistakes by putting small inputs to correct it. I've not had anything more than a half twist..
"Better to have a short life that is full of what you like doing than a long life spent in a miserable way." -Alan Watts

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