I just wanted to unload something that’s bugging me.

[labrys 0]

A few weeks ago I bought a rig with a soft reserve handle. It’s my first rig, new jumper, etc. I decided that I wasn’t all that comfortable with the handle and asked if it could be replaced with a D-ring style handle. I didn’t rush getting it replaced because it’s end of jump season and I wasn’t expecting to use the rig much. Winter seemed like a good time to get it done. FWIW, I practice EPs at least twice on every jump and was actually feeling pretty confident about being able to find and pull the handle if I needed it after roughly 20 jumps in 3 weeks, but was also still planning to replace it with a more accessible D-ring.

Yesterday I was on the same load with a guy who was as close to a fatality as I would imagine you can get. Maybe not injury-wise but certainly luck and timing were on his side. It appears (and this is only speculation) that he could not or did not pull and that a Cypres saved his life, and that his reserve opened just barely in time. Before the ambulance had left the DZ there was talk that his soft reserve handle may have been a factor. As I tried to concentrate on packing and hoped for the best outside, a friend of the injured jumper came into the hanger and started talking about how much soft handles sucked. I just listened until he walked up to my rig and started using it as an example.

I already felt like shit, I didn’t know the guy who was complaining about my handle, and I didn’t want to be a part of a conversation that seemed useless and inappropriate at the time, but instead of saying that, I guess I got defensive. I told him that I had already asked to have the handle replaced. He immediately came back at me with a sarcastic “When, 30 minutes ago?” and damn did I get pissed.

But I didn’t say much about it. I figured that he was dealing with what had happened in his own way. I was wondering if anyone else had had this type of experience and if so, how they dealt with it.

Owned by Remi #?

[lazerq3 0]

On the flip side ..I heard a jumper say he wouldnt freefly with anyone unless they had a pillow reserve for faer of getting your feet caught in the D handle...go figure!

jason

Freedom of speech includes volume

[labrys 0]

I know what you mean. It's not that I don't understand the soft vs. d-ring handle debate. I just didn't think that this was the right time to be talking about it.

Owned by Remi #?

[imdskydiver 0]

(Soft reserve handles ) , I have one , Used it , No problems !

[Hooknswoop 19]

Quote

I just didn't think that this was the right time to be talking about it.

I agree, emotional distress doesn't give you the right to be an ass to me. I would have told him to 1) put my rig down, 2) take his attitude and shove it, and 3) a pillow reserve handle has worked for me for 10 cutaways, so get bent..

See why I don't hang out at the DZ anymore?

Derek

[EdC 0]

I guess it is a matter of personal preference as to which handle you want. I like the D-ring myself.

Big Ed

[usedtajump 1]

Betcha when the time comes that you really have to find it, you will

The older I get the less I care who I piss off.

[kai2k1 0]

I would have told him to knock off the holier than thou bullshit and leave me the hell alone!

There's no truer sense of flying than sky diving," Scott Cowan

[Samurai136 0]

Sorry to hear about your friend.

My soft handle worked great for me.

That guy who was venting I would have asked how he figured so quick it was the handle that failed as opposed to the user.

Ken

"Buttons aren't toys." - Trillian
Ken

[billvon 2,395]

> I would have told him to 1) put my rig down, 2) take his attitude
> and shove it, and 3) a pillow reserve handle has worked for me for
> 10 cutaways, so get bent.

See, that's the difference between us. I would have just laughed. How can I take a guy who's criticizing my rig seriously when I helped out with the initial testing of it? I've gotten condescending lectures on how to track, how to fly in big-ways, and how I didn't know anything about AFF if I thought static line was an OK course. Life's too short to take people like that seriously.

[PROGRESSIVE 0]

Soft handles are great. Look at how long cutaway pillows have been put into production. I chose soft because it would be me to snag a D-handle on climb out. Or launching a piece with someone grabbing a D handle rather than my main lift web. I can think of a better place to be than at 12500 ft under my reserve.

A word of caution though, with an articulated harness, and probably other types of harnesses too, the pillows, cutaway and ripcord, can turn around on you while putting on your rig and become neatly tucked behind the lift web and your chest.

Food for thought.

[ihateskydivers 0]

just tell those fags that if they didn't grip their dicks all night, that cramped hand could pull.

10 chops, 8 on soft, never noticed a difference

[labrys 0]

Oh man. I'm sorry I asked now.

Owned by Remi #?

[Patman 0]

First of all, nobody has any idea of what was the problem that made him not pull. A pillow can be found and pulled or it wouldn't be an option. Everyone has their own opinions on the type to use based on their own feelings. I don't think you should take this to heart, like Hooknswoop said, it's just venting and you just so happened to be there. Only you can tell what you want and feel good with. "D" or soft, it's up to the jumper. This guys buddy made his decision, and nobody told him it was wrong. Who knows, it may save you in some situations. Live life, don't try to dissect

Don't tell me I can't! I already know that! Haven't you seen my x-rays?

[skydiventom 0]

Quote

I was wondering if anyone else had had this type of experience and if so, how they dealt with it.

I know my gear. I'm always amazed at how other people are more than willing to tell me how to jump it. I love skydiving however, it is a serious sport. I listen politely and wonder " when is this one gonna get hurt"

"Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana" -Groucho Marx- "Tom flies like a rock" -Tom Carson-

[labrys 0]

Thanks. I appreciate your thoughts. I would like to make it clear that neither jumper was a friend. I hadn't seen either of them before yesterday. That's one of the reasons I was unbalanced by the comments.

Owned by Remi #?

[SickMonkey 0]

Anyone who has problems with soft reserve handles should talk to my buddy who had his D handle pulled by some jackass while freeflying. He flew his reserve down from 10000 ft. with a dislocated shoulder and internal injuries. Safe to say, he has a slight bias now.

[Amazon 7]

I have had both... old gear new gear.. I opted for the soft pillow on my new gear.... then again.. I have 3 rings on it instead of J-1 Capewells that I cut away with 5 time before...

I do some freeflying... I do some hybrids... as a belly flier.. and have done rodeo dives... and zoo dives.. and tube dives.. never a single problem with ANYONE pulling something they shouldnt' have... now if I had a Metal D.... I might not be saying that as casually. I did quit jumping ofr a few days a few weeks ago when I dislocated one of my fingers on my left(reserve pillow) hand. since it was VERY painful to try to grip the pillow... I doubt I could have pulled my reserve at the time so I grounded myself till I could grasp and pull the pillow...If I had silver instead... I could have continued having fun at Hollister rahter than hitting the road home to rainy Seattle.

Do what you want to do.. practice your pulls... peel and pull... and stick with what ya got.

[jmpnkramer 0]

Quote

faer of getting your feet caught in the D handle

You would have to have a pretty damn small foot to get it caught in the newer D-Handle styles.

There is also a loop design that I have seen on some people's rigs.

Just my thought on that. Then again there are positives and negatives to everything in life. The best thing to do is write all of them down and make an informed decision.

Laters,

KRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The REAL KRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMER!

"HESITATION CAUSES DEATH!!!"
"Be Slow to Fall into Friendship; but when Thou Art in, Continue Firm & Constant." - SOCRATES

[bkdice 0]

I opted for soft pillow for both my cutaway and reserve handles. I was always uncomfortable with the D-ring on my old rig. Regardless, whatever you choose to end up with, get yourself in a hanging harness and practice cutting away. Also, when your rig is due for a repack, instead of just giving it to your rigger all packed, practice pulling your cut away and then your reserve so you get a bit of a sense for what it is like.

[Antithesis 0]

We all know how a bad situation can bring out the asshole in somebody. It sounds like this guy was just trying to vent. Nevertheless, I'm touchy about people handling my gear especially some cromagnon who's going to educate the world on how it's the equiptments fault that a jumper couldn't operate his Emergency Procedures

I travel the land, Work in the ocean, Play in the sky

[DJL 232]

Question for everyone. If it's such a big deal to have a D-ring reserve handle then why not have a D-ring cutaway.

Next, I see the problem with the soft tab handle but the soft handle with a thumb hook is a different story. Talk amongst yourselves.

Yes, and that guy sounds like he ran his mouth right over you. Get an apology or kick him in the nuts.

"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher

[Aviatrr 0]

I doubt the soft reserve handle was a problem....unless he was a schmuck and had it tucked under the MLW and never checked it before exit(and after donning the rig for that matter). You make it sound as if he didn't deploy his main OR reserve....which makes it sound like much more than a case of a soft reserve handle problem to me.

I've had several cutaways with a soft reserve handle. I don't use an RSL. My Cypres never fired. I pulled the handle every time...and it was just as easy as pulling the cutaway handle. I'm a believer in the soft handle for all of my freefall rigs. CReW rigs are a different story.

Some people swear by soft handles....some swear that they are nearly impossible to pull....others are somewhere in between. I've had people tell me that a soft reserve handle will kill me someday. I've seen video of a guy getting his reserve deployed at about 160mph, head down. He broke his pelvis on the opening. Luckily the reserve didn't blow up. Somebody went for a harness grip, and got his hand inside a D ring. Everybody says that you can solve that problem by not jumping with people that are not capable of taking a grip without compromising your D ring....well, these guys had several hundred freefly jumps together, and thousands total....and were doing a normal part of their routine. Shit happens.

The bottom line is...it's your choice. Choose what you are comfortable with, NOT what other people say you should be comfortable with or they think is safe.

Mike

[billvon 2,395]

>If it's such a big deal to have a D-ring reserve handle then why not
>have a D-ring cutaway.

I know a few people who have gotten cloth-loop handles for their cutaway handles, basically a loop of steel cable covered with cloth. It gives you a better grip and still lets you feel a difference between the two handles. In the case of one jumper, she was worried about having enough grip strength to cut away in the event of a hard cutaway.

[freeflybella 0]

Quote

The bottom line is...it's your choice. Choose what you are comfortable with, NOT what other people say you should be comfortable with or they think is safe.

Absolutely. Either in this thread or a similar one, someone wrote that the 'comfort' (ease of mind) factor is part of the decision. And that is SO true.

Get informed, and as with ALL things you read here - check it out with people you respect face to face. Know who you are getting your advice from.

I have a pillow cutaway and a small d-ring reserve handle. I freefly and I vigilantly protect my gear. I have had a cutaway where I was SO THANKFUL to have a d-ring handle. I've had a cutaway where I would have been fine with a pillow. For me, there is comfort and security in the d-ring.

For you, it could be different.

Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi