Is lightning a factor?

[cvfd1399 0]

Ok I did a search to find some info about lightning and skydiving. It returned 30 pages of topics but nothing I could find that answered my questions. There were a few things about plane strikes. Ok I know that lightning can strike from as far as 10 miles away. Has anyone ever been struck in free fall or under canopy?

[Nightingale 0]

um...

if the cloud cover is bad enough to produce lightning, why would you jump in it?

[cvfd1399 0]

Like my post stated lightning can strike from 10 miles away. It may be clear where you are at and be lightning in the distance you see.

[kallend 1,623]

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Like my post stated lightning can strike from 10 miles away. It may be clear where you are at and be lightning in the distance you see.

Small aircraft (that would include almost all jump planes) are advised to stay well clear of CuNim clouds - like 10 miles. Assuming the pilot and jumpers aren't fools, then a lightning strike on a jumper is most unlikely.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Erroll 49]

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Like my post stated lightning can strike from 10 miles away. It may be clear where you are at and be lightning in the distance you see.

Small aircraft (that would include almost all jump planes) are advised to stay well clear of CuNim clouds - like 10 miles. Assuming the pilot and jumpers aren't fools, then a lightning strike on a jumper is most unlikely.

John, just out of interest, is it physically possible to be struck by lightning while in freefall - not being earthed and all, assuming one is not falling through cloud or rain?

[pilotdave 0]

Planes get struck, no reason a person couldn't.

And I'm no meteorologist so I could be wrong, but I don't believe lighting could travel horizontally 10 miles. I mean maybe in theory there's enough energy or whatever, but I just don't believe it happens in nature. Anyone know?

Dave

[Kris 0]

Anything is possible. Don't know about the shock factor, but the heat is sure as hell still there.

From Temperature of a Lightning Bolt
'The rapidly rising return stroke current heats the channel to a peak temperature near 55,000 F'

Sky, Muff Bro, Rodriguez Bro, and
Bastion of Purity and Innocence!™

[cvfd1399 0]

http://www.weathersavvy.com/Lightning.html

Warning: Just because the lightning has struck 5 or more miles from you, or even if you can't hear the thunder, does not mean it is safe to be outside during a lightning storm. In fact, an electrical charge could be building right above you, and you wouldn't know it until it was too late. Also, lightning can strike 10 miles from the storm. If you can hear the thunder, be safe and listen from inside your house.

[bch7773 0]

well, I've never heard of lightning strikes on jumpers... but I have heard about some guy years ago that was sucked into a thunderstorm while under canopy. It actually started pulling him up like 5000 feet, and he had to cut away to get out of it. He ended up being moved several miles by the thunderstorm

MB 3528, RB 1182

[Erroll 49]

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well, I've never heard of lightning strikes on jumpers... but I have heard about some guy years ago that was sucked into a thunderstorm while under canopy. It actually started pulling him up like 5000 feet, and he had to cut away to get out of it. He ended up being moved several miles by the thunderstorm

You mean this?

[samyueru 0]

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Planes get struck, no reason a person couldn't.

And I'm no meteorologist so I could be wrong, but I don't believe lighting could travel horizontally 10 miles. I mean maybe in theory there's enough energy or whatever, but I just don't believe it happens in nature. Anyone know?

Dave

Yea, I saw on the discovery channel once about this kid who was playing on a field by some mountains. Like 10 miles away, on the OTHER side of the mountain an electric storm was around and the kid got hit and died....messed up!!

As far as a skydiver getting hot by lighting while in the air... I'm not an expert of any sort, but maybe because a plane has enough metal to attract lightning and a skydiver doesn't, they may be safe? Who knows.

-Alex

[AggieDave 6]

Ok, if there's a storm with lightening brewing near you (within 10 miles) why would you be jumping? Not due to the lightening or the rain, but the WINDS.

What happens before a big storm hits? Winds pick up before the storm even gets there. So you'd be screwed, lightening or no.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[darkwing 4]

I've been jumping 30+ years, and have never heard of a lightning strike on a skydiver. It could happen though. (So says the physicist in me). Without a great deal of thought I'd say it was much less likely than a plane getting struck. I think the ion trail in the exhaust might enhance the chances for a plane. Most jumpers don't leave an ion trail--exception for some scared head-downers.

-- Jeff
My Skydiving History

[PhillyKev 0]

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Ok, if there's a storm with lightening brewing near you (within 10 miles) why would you be jumping?

Because otherwise, no one would have been jumping the first 3 days at Rantoul this year.

[billvon 2,394]

No one's ever been struck that I know about. If you're near the leader, though, you would have as good a chance as any airplane for being struck. Often, freefallers pick up a slight static charge as they fall; I notice it often when I dock on someone and get a shock. This tends to attract leaders, but it's a very minor effect.

In any case, if you're that close to strong convective activity, it's likely that you have other more serious problems than possibly getting hit by lightning.

[EDYDO 0]

Made a decision on one jump that I would be safer outside the plane than inside due to storms. I left the plane with a lot going on around. As I passed through 500 feet, I visualized a cloud to ground strike and thought about the possibility that that I may be charged differently than the ground. I'm here, so nothing happened, but it was exciting!!

Ed

[airgord 1]

Don't wrap aluminum foil around your head before you jump and you will be fine!

[ChasingBlueSky 0]

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Don't wrap aluminum foil around your head before you jump and you will be fine!

You think that no one would have a helmet like that - but I've seen one.

There is a town here in IL (Park Ridge) that had a kid get struck on a baseball field - the conditions were pretty safe (they had cleared the field for a brief time earlier in the game due to rain). The kid (actually the coach) didn't make it. Now that baseball field has a new lightning detection device installed - one year later on the aniversary of the strike, during the ceremony to unveil the devices, they sounded an alarm with no storm on the horizon. They cleared the fields and the scoreboard was struck by lightning.

I have been in freefall, in clear blue sky, at several DZ's and seen cloud-to-cloud strikes. Those clouds never passed into our airspace, but just beyond, and the winds were very calm. I never had the fear of getting hit while in the air, but rather once I touch the ground in a wide open field with my canopy over head.

_________________________________________
you can burn the land and boil the sea, but you can't take the sky from me....
I WILL fly again.....

[firstime 0]

I really hope your kidding, if so you have us all laughing... if not buy a bowling ball

[msmithd8769 0]

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I've been jumping 30+ years, and have never heard of a lightning strike on a skydiver. It could happen though. (So says the physicist in me). Without a great deal of thought I'd say it was much less likely than a plane getting struck. I think the ion trail in the exhaust might enhance the chances for a plane. Most jumpers don't leave an ion trail--exception for some scared head-downers.

Hmmm, I don't know. It would seem to me that a skydiver in freefall could not be struck by lightning because he would not be grounded and therefore there would be no negative/positive difference of potential between him and the thundercloud and actual lightning bolt.....

_____________________________
"And when the prophet shall arise who appeareth as a bird then the time of the Lord draweth nigh and the flock shall rule the earth."

[FrogNog 1]

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I've been jumping 30+ years, and have never heard of a lightning strike on a skydiver. It could happen though. (So says the physicist in me). Without a great deal of thought I'd say it was much less likely than a plane getting struck. I think the ion trail in the exhaust might enhance the chances for a plane. Most jumpers don't leave an ion trail--exception for some scared head-downers.

Hmmm, I don't know. It would seem to me that a skydiver in freefall could not be struck by lightning because he would not be grounded and therefore there would be no negative/positive difference of potential between him and the thundercloud and actual lightning bolt.....

That would be why a skydiver could not be a terminus of a lightning bolt. However, lightning is happy to sojourn through or along anything that has lower resistance than the alternatives. If a skydiver has a lower resistance through or along some part of him, then he could become a small portion of a discharge path.

Even objects with very high resistance can become parts of these paths if they get covered with water. Plus we jumpers tend to have a steel ripcord on us which, again, is no large source of free electrons (i.e. is not a serious ground) but has a very low resistance (until it melts).

Being cooked by lightning superheating the air next to a skydiver is probably not what would be fatal. I bet the shockwave (thunder) wouldn't kill, either, although it probably wouldn't feel too good if you remembered it. I think passing current through critical body tissues is what really sucks in some lightning strikes. A paranoid skydiver could probably up his chances of surviving by wearing a high-voltage safety suit, the kind that have low-resistance buses in them between the head/foot/arm openings so any current tring to use the wearer as a path prefers to pass around the wearer's main body.

Of course, those suits are for high voltage work on things like power lines, from what I understand. I have my doubts they could take a lightning strike without exceeding the current passing capabilities of the buses. And in freefall this suit might make the wearer even more attractive to lightning as a "shortcut".

-=-=-=-=-
Pull.

[EDYDO 0]

Can you arch in those suits? It could be the next DZ fad!!!

Ed

[msmithd8769 0]

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I've been jumping 30+ years, and have never heard of a lightning strike on a skydiver. It could happen though. (So says the physicist in me). Without a great deal of thought I'd say it was much less likely than a plane getting struck. I think the ion trail in the exhaust might enhance the chances for a plane. Most jumpers don't leave an ion trail--exception for some scared head-downers.

Hmmm, I don't know. It would seem to me that a skydiver in freefall could not be struck by lightning because he would not be grounded and therefore there would be no negative/positive difference of potential between him and the thundercloud and actual lightning bolt.....

That would be why a skydiver could not be a terminus of a lightning bolt. However, lightning is happy to sojourn through or along anything that has lower resistance than the alternatives. If a skydiver has a lower resistance through or along some part of him, then he could become a small portion of a discharge path.

Even objects with very high resistance can become parts of these paths if they get covered with water. Plus we jumpers tend to have a steel ripcord on us which, again, is no large source of free electrons (i.e. is not a serious ground) but has a very low resistance (until it melts).

Being cooked by lightning superheating the air next to a skydiver is probably not what would be fatal. I bet the shockwave (thunder) wouldn't kill, either, although it probably wouldn't feel too good if you remembered it. I think passing current through critical body tissues is what really sucks in some lightning strikes. A paranoid skydiver could probably up his chances of surviving by wearing a high-voltage safety suit, the kind that have low-resistance buses in them between the head/foot/arm openings so any current tring to use the wearer as a path prefers to pass around the wearer's main body.

Of course, those suits are for high voltage work on things like power lines, from what I understand. I have my doubts they could take a lightning strike without exceeding the current passing capabilities of the buses. And in freefall this suit might make the wearer even more attractive to lightning as a "shortcut".

Ok, that makes sense Frog. Thanks for the clarification.....

_____________________________
"And when the prophet shall arise who appeareth as a bird then the time of the Lord draweth nigh and the flock shall rule the earth."

[msmithd8769 0]

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Can you arch in those suits? It could be the next DZ fad!!!

Ed

Yes Ed, high voltage safety suits for all skydivers. We need to get that added to the BSRs (at least for students)

_____________________________
"And when the prophet shall arise who appeareth as a bird then the time of the Lord draweth nigh and the flock shall rule the earth."

[murps2000 86]

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0135482712/102-1699602-7434518?v=glance

Try this link if you want to find an interesting book that deals with the subject. The story is called "The Man who Rode Thunder" by Lt.Col. William Rankin. He punched out of an F-8 at about 47,000 ft. somewhere around Norfolk, Va. Can't remember the year, but it was a while ago, and to date it is the highest known bailout from an aircraft in flight. He did it without a pressure suit, and had a very lengthy freefall through an exceptionally violent thunderstorm. His parachute was equipped with an AAD which deployed it at about 10,000 ft. The ride continued for quite sometiome after that. He experienced lightning up close and personally along the way, although I don't believe he was ever struck. He does claim, however, that whatever lightning may look like from the ground, it comes in huge sheets when you're close by. Very interesting reading.