Raistlin 0 #1 May 20, 2004 We're discussing possible introducing of the subj at our dropzone. Can someone with first-hand experience please let me ask them a few questions (you don't have to be the guy who organized this at his DZ, just the guy who took advantage of it)? :) Thanks, Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nightjumps 1 #2 May 20, 2004 Please elaborate. Are you talking about AFF for students over the course of several weekends, AFF for students on an installment payment plan, an AFF Instructor's course over two of three weekends? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cvfd1399 0 #3 May 20, 2004 When I went through aff in November-Feburary, I paid by the jump. You did get a discount if you paid all up front. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChrisL 2 #4 May 20, 2004 What do you mean? As opposed to one big huge jump??__ My mighty steed Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 558 #5 May 20, 2004 Please rephrase your question. Dropzones in Quebec have found that if students buy the complete AFF/PFF package and do a dozen jumps their first week, they learn well. The trick is finding a bank that will allow them to pay off their bill - in installments - over the winter. On the other hand, students that can only afford to do one or two AFF jumps per month learn slowly. often have to repeat levels and slow down the school. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
seekfun 0 #6 May 20, 2004 Raistlin, I'm going to assume you're talking about buying AFF jumps in some sort of package deal. I can touch on this issue from a student's perspective. I have been fascinated with the idea of skydiving since I was but a wee lad. So, at the age of 19, full of piss and vinegar - and short on cash - I went to the local DZ and started making AFF jumps. I made about 1 jump per month. I didn't learn anything, but I did have fun. Then I wandered off into college, the Navy, a war or two, and came out 9 years later ready to try this thing again. So, I took my 60 days of saved up vacation time from the Navy, a bunch of money, and I drove down to Skydive Chicago. It was late in the season, I pitched a tent at the end of the runway (not literally) and stubbornly told the instructors I wasn't leaving until I was a skydiver. They dug my attitude, had me do several jumps a day, and in less than a week, I was off student status and having fun. Then I took a job with the DOD and it got in the way of my skydiving. So, I quit that job (over a cell phone from IHOP) and took one with less travel involved. Now I'm jumping every weekend - except the ones with clouds. So, package deals rock in my opinion. Jumping frequently added immeasurable value to the already quality instruction I was receiving. SDC's program has 18 levels, and on some days, I made 4-6 jumps. That allowed each lesson to build on the next and helped me immensely in reaching my goal. Thanks Nannette. Thanks Dave. Go Navy, topher "...there is a there out there..." - Tom Robbins Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Raistlin 0 #7 May 20, 2004 Oops, I am sorry for being so brief. The situation is as follows: as it has been correctly said, AFF is best taken advantage of when you complete it in the course of a few days as opposed to a few months. Even though it only costs around $800 here, this is still a lot of money to cough up for most people. So I proposed to introduce a "installment deal"... you sort of get a loan from the DZ, complete AFF, keep jumping at the DZ and slowly (say, within a few months) repay your debt. I actually read about it somewhere on dz.com... So we are interested in how this has been done on those DZs that offer it. Like... how does the DZ ensure that the person doesn't complete AFF and then disappear for good... is there involvement with the bank... do you pay more in interest, or the amount stays the same... I believe this hasn't been previously done in any of the few russian dropzones, hence the post here :) Thanks, Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
seekfun 0 #8 May 20, 2004 Raistlin, I heard a few people tossing this idea around recently. I think the idea is wonderful in theory, but in practice, it might not fly. Pun intended. First, you're talking largely about lending money to young people - who can't come up with $800 bucks - for the purpose of jumping out of an airplane. From a bank's perspective, this doesn't shine out at them as a wise investment of their free funds. There's no collateral, even a mild injury could result in a loss of the borrower's employment, and there's a lot of overhead in lending out many small loans, especially if they're paid back in short periods of time. If a bank bites off on this, it's going to be with a pretty hefty interest rate in mind. We're not talking 0% financing on this one. No siree. A more realistic perspective may be a loan arrangement that covers jump training, some coaching, and a first rig. However, we're still not over the issues of collateral and young people with no credit. Now, for the working adult who wants to get into skydiving, an arrangement like this may be feasible and practical. I'm interested to see where this one goes. I know I'm paying off some credit cards... topher "...there is a there out there..." - Tom Robbins Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Raistlin 0 #9 May 20, 2004 Well, Things are a little different over here. $800 doesn't really sound much, but it constitutes most of what an average person earns a month (about $1000-1200). The would-be skydivers can come up with $800, but that requires what - two months of saving up - and by then they lose the zeal, or the weather turns crap, or whatever. Credit cards are pretty much non-existent in the sense of how they are used in the USA. You can't really go over-draft on them; mostly, it's just to receive your salary transfers and beyond that, bupkiss. A bank loan is also different. Practically anyone who's employed can go to a bank and get a credit without explaining what for. But are there no dropzones in existence that take up the role of the bank in this case and give the loan themselves? (in the form of: jump your cojones off now over this week; bring payment later a chunk a month) I am sure at least one person mentioned this system at their DZ... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
seekfun 0 #10 May 20, 2004 Raistlin, You got me. I hadn't taken note of the fact that you weren't from the egocentric USA. I haven't taken part in the wonderful international aspect of skydiving yet, but I'm learning. I apologize. Good Luck, topher "...there is a there out there..." - Tom Robbins Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Raistlin 0 #11 May 20, 2004 In fact, it's me who should apologize for not providing enough background information, heh. Outta curiosity, why 42.5 jumps? Rode to altitude then decided not to jump out? :) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
seekfun 0 #12 May 20, 2004 Raistlin, The 1/2 jump is my reserve ride. Thanks for asking, topher "...there is a there out there..." - Tom Robbins Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #13 May 20, 2004 QuotePlease rephrase your question. Dropzones in Quebec have found that if students buy the complete AFF/PFF package and do a dozen jumps their first week, they learn well. The trick is finding a bank that will allow them to pay off their bill - in installments - over the winter. On the other hand, students that can only afford to do one or two AFF jumps per month learn slowly. often have to repeat levels and slow down the school. I definitely didn't benefit from the 1-2 jumps every 3 weeks. But some of that was driven by weather (wind) rather than my busy schedule. Even if I wanted to do more than 2 jumps in a day, the typical wind hold from 12-4 enforced it. Ideally I should have done 1-2 days each weekend for 2-3 weeks. I did pay for the packge, though in part that was a misunderstanding. I thought I was paying for 7 jumps plus a freebie for paying up front. What I actually got was one jump at each level, plus a repeat. A dozen jumps in the first weekend? Sounds exhausting! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites