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jadaks

AFF Level 2 line twist

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New to Skydiving ( 3 total Jumps) I had my first small incident. The jump took place at Skydive Taft ( Ca ) last week. The jump w/ 2 instructors was going great up till pulling the rip cord. It took 4 tugs for me to pull to rip cord. My hands could not grip the handle well enough to get it out. By the 4th tug i used more might than i should have, and upon opening, my body seemed to twist causing the lines to be twisted. I was able ,due to the great training, to remain calm and just twist out. I landed safely but sure was proud to have had the instruction I did. My recommendation to all newbees who experience this... check altimeter, know how much time you have, and remain calm. Also, a little slack on the rip cord upon exiting the plane would help in getting a good pull for those handles that are so snug against the pack. Blue Skies all - see you in the air !!!

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I sure hope it is the only common issue I have...



Sorry, but this struck me as incredibly ironic.

Common issues, by definition, are common. So you will have more common issues. You might even have uncommon issues. They will be scary. Be prepared and expect them.
www.WingsuitPhotos.com

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On static line progression you get line twists an average of 70% of the time because the prop blast spins the bag on deployment. Believe me, this is the least of the things that might go wrong.
I find it funny when I hear AFF students worry about line twists and the S/L guys worry about going unstable but each takes the other thing as pretty uneventfull.

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It took 4 tugs for me to pull to rip cord.



(since this will be moved to safety and training> anyways...)

What happened to the 2-try rule? Is that a local thing, only taught at my DZ?

I as taught never to try anything (regarding 'proceedures') more than two times. pulling your PC? no more than 2X. got a line over you want to clear? no more than two tugs. Got a horseshoe? try to clear 2X, no more.

I was taught a 2 try rule...is that not universally taught?

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Elfanie
My Skydiving Page
Fly Safe - Soft Landings

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"No shit there I was, 5000 feet up and the lines of my chute were all twisted up."
"Woah dude, did you freak out?!"
"Almost, but then I remembered my training. Like a voice inside telling me to not give up, to keep hope alive, that I would live to see another day.... and then I heard a voice."
"Wow, like God or something?"
"No. My instructor. Over the radio. Yelling at me to undo the damn line twists."
"Oh."
"Then I pretty much just kicked my legs a bit, undid the twists and flew it home and drank some beer."

Grats on your first "no shit there I was" story. LOL. :D

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yeah, happens about 1/3 openings is what I've been told. I personally have had them right on that average, not an incident though unless you ride those twists to the ground and hurt yourself or worse. Good job at clearing them.

Never go to a DZ strip show.

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Nice job on not freaking out. You're right... line twists are common.

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Also, a little slack on the rip cord upon exiting the plane would help in getting a good pull for those handles that are so snug against the pack.



This statement on the other hand bothers the heck out of me. Sorry. I don't think students at your level should be messing with their equipment. Especially with something that could cause a pre-mature deployment. Any more experienced jumpers or AFF instructors care to elaborate?

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> I was taught a 2 try rule...is that not universally taught? <

Your right 2 tries then EP. Cant burn altitude messing around
------------------------------------------------------
"From the mightiest pharaoh to the lowliest peasant,
who doesn't enjoy a good sit?" C. Montgomery Burns

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Also, a little slack on the rip cord upon exiting the plane would help in getting a good pull for those handles that are so snug against the pack.





If this is only your level 2 AFF jump, DO NOT GIVE ANYONE GEAR ADVICE! It's kinda scary that you're even trying.

AFF students should only listen to their AFF instructors, so unless your instructor tells you to do something like that to your gear, don't even think about it!

And.. line twists are mega-common.

"Life is a temporary victory over the causes which induce death." - Sylvester Graham

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That's incredibly high in my experience. I regularly go for 50 jumps without more than a 45 degree off heading opening.


Depends a lot on the pack job. I tend to make my lines stows as neat as possible with no pleated lines in the bungees. I've found that the canopy comes out of the D bag more cleanly and I rarely get more than one twist (on a freefall rig), which usually sorts itself out as the slider comes down.
Line twists should not be a problem unless coupled with some other malfunction. The major danger with them is when the jumper goes for the brakes before clearing the twists and ends up with one brake line hung up and in a fast spiral while trying to kick out the twists.

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Hey, somebody was right, this is not an incident,but it could have been. Quick comment: Lines twists are almost always caused by turning during deployment. The scary part of your post is the four pulls. If you can't get your pilot chute out on your second attempt. Go for the reserve. I think maybe you were a little panic-ey. Perfectly understandable. Try practice ripcord pulls during your freefall and relax. Blue Skies bob

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ROFL! Thanks for linking that! LOLOL!

Jadaks, re: line twists, great job keeping your head. Your instructors taught you well, and may this be the most exciting level you experience, gear wise.

As to the slack you mention, actually, that's not too wise. You could have a bump on the door on exit, your instructors may bump you, something may dislodge the hackey and there you are, deploying a canopy very very high. So trust your instructors to teach you about equipment, ask them, and follow their advice to the letter, and you will be just fine. And remember the 2 pulls, and then emergency procedures.

Take care, good luck, and welcome to the sky and these forums.

Ciels-
Michele


~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek
While our hearts lie bleeding?~

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yeah, happens about 1/3 openings is what I've been told. I personally have had them right on that average, not an incident though unless you ride those twists to the ground and hurt yourself or worse. Good job at clearing them.



1/3 ?!?!!! thats crazy. as a student you might expect them to happen when you arent solid at pull time but you are pulling so high and the canopy is so large and docile kicking out shouldn't be a problem. but 33% of the time? if i opened into lt every 3 jumps i would fire my packer. lol.

jadaks: don't fuck with the student gear. don't advise anyone to do anything. you are as green as green gets. eyes and ears open, mouf closed except to axe questions. tell your JM about your pull problem and explore causes and solutions with him/her.

oh yeah... good luck. it gets better.
namaste, motherfucker.

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I actually was under a 190 ( 1-1 ) instead of the normal 288 trainer. Under canopy all went well once out of the twist. I realize the twist was mostly caused by my movement in attempt to release the rip cord. I do listen and do trust my JM's. Control and landing were fine under the 190 and I plan on doing it again. My main point to others in training was keep a cool head, listen to the emergency procedures training , and don't jump if not confident you comprehend what could happen. The JM's are very serious and detailed... I will continue to listen... and follow directions. thx

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As a static line and an AFF instructor line twists happen at different rates. With s/l the amount of line twitsts i see is probably 2 of 3. This is caused by the static line pulling on the bag at an angle and causing the bag to spin. On AFF jumps it is far less common. if it were 1 in 10 i would be surprised. on the subject of attempting to pull 4 times, the sim says 2 tries or 2 seconds. this recommendation should never be violated. i am glad that you have the curiousity and bravery to post this. you will go far by having the open mind and ears.

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Jdaks,

Since this hasn't been moved yet, I assume the moderators are OK with this here.

AFF-5, I dropped a leg and spun hard left. My JM actually rehearsed this with me on the dirt dive. Pull. Pull. Pull. I did, but thanks to the excellent training I got, I anticipated line twists. I applied anti line twist technology, and had a good chute at 4,500 feet.

It happens, but I'm 1 out of 8, and I KNEW I screwed up when I pulled. 1/3 is high to me.

Also, and this is NOT advice, but experience, at Elsinore it is one-pull, two-pull, re-set, arch, reserve. Four pulls is not fair to you. I pull as HARD as I can on EVERY jump. I throw the PC as hard as I can sideways, palm up. It is the JM's responsibility to get out of the way :D

You handled the line twist great, congratulations! You really did a great, great job. Take care, but for the sake of new jumpers who might "pull" some slack on the PC, please don't give advice. Share your experience and let the AFF-Is, the Tontos, the Sharks, the rjfs, the others we see on this board reply according to their experience and training.

Thanks for posting, hang in there, bro!!!
Bob Marks

"-when you leave the airplane its all wrong til it goes right, its a whole different mindset, this is why you have system redundancy." Mattaman

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This is what is so great about this site and the people involved. Comments - advice - good and bad - This was my first posting here, and I have learned VERY much from everyone. * 2 pulls- and then reserve. GOt It ! I hope to meet and fly with all of you one day. Cya ... Thnx again

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