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bigway

repacks every three months

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>The re-pack cycle still is 60 days for a rig that has and portion of it
>made out of natural fiber/fabric.

Interesting. I've seen several standard rigs made at least partially from leather (with a nylon backing) - none that I know of are repacked every 60 days.

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we do it here in new zealand every 6 months, this proven to work as we have only 2 fatalities in 8 years!! the states do it every 4 months so i am now told. Why do they do it every 4 months?



This proof doesn't stand up so well if we go back to your earlier post where you start NZ only has 400 jumpers. If representative, that's a rate about 2/3rds that of the States, but one more accident and it's equilivent. Or remove all the canopy crashes here that are totally unrelated to rig maintenence, and it's lower here.

I think Europe would be a better place to validate the benefits. Much bigger sample size.

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im sorry, i am not trying to compare the incidents at all.
i understand that there is a shit load more jumping in the states.
i was just trying to say that we repack our gear evey 6 months and it seems to do the trick. Those fatalities were 1 being a hook turn and the other, i am not sure but if i remember correctly it was a suicide(no disrespect to the family, sorry if i am wrong).
my point is our reserve canopies get touched a minimum of twice a year.
The canopies in the states get opened and touched a minimum of 3 thimes a year thats 5 times more than us in five years. in my opinon which is not one of an expert but a jumper, i am just trying to understand why it is neccesary for your reserve pack to be opened that one extra time a year.
someone posted that after 20 repacks you need a new reserve. that means at a minimum the life of your reserve is 6 years and 8 months.
where as in new zealand the minimum life is 10 years.
do i sound like an idiot ramblin on about this or do i have a point?
respect to the states though, i would love to be able to live in the states as that is where my sport peaks.


.Karnage Krew Gear Store
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I was just wondering. I was afraid you were going to get slammed for the fatalities comment. I just wanted to clarify whether or not it was gear related.

I understand what you mean by moving it up to 6 months because the Death rate has nothing to do with Repack times. You are correct, it does work at 6 months so why not increase it?

I will never involve myself with that ongoing argument.

billvon, the way I understand it, if the leather is backed by nylon, it's affectively an all nylon rig. The parachute does not contain natural fibres and the container itself only holds the parachutes. There fore it's not affected by the natural fiber ruling.

(I may be wrong on that but it makes sense since the leather bares no weight )
My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto

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In the states I never repack my rig more then 2 times a year and I stay legal the whole time. How? Winter. I can't jump in the winter so I don't have to have it repacked to just sit there.

And its not 20 repacks... PD puts a limit on their canopies of 20 uses or 40 repacks, what ever comes first. Do you really want a 13+ year old reserve when there are newer and better designs on the market? 15 years ago Ravens were still fairly new and Cypres was still in testing phases. If you use a reserve 20 times you might want a new packer. If you reach 20 years on the reserve and have'nt repacked it 40 times you are not jumping enough.
Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

Parachutemanuals.com

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As a rigger they could double the price of reserve repacks and I will still hate packing reserves.......I never ever packed a reserve to get rich......just to keep the DZ running.........I don't know a rigger who has a love of packing....its a necessity for skydiving and someone has to do it.....

Reserve repack cycles have no relevance to fatality rates..............Jimbo is quite correct.........

Taupo Tandem Skydiving is a tandem factory, and do a hell of a lot of tandems.....so what....they cater and service a market....I'm sure all the T/M's check their rigs before each jump...as any one who enjoys living will do.........

A lot of different factors can influence repack cycles...jump numbers are but one of them....climate/environment is another......there are always reasons for different cycles/rules, some logical, some not................

What exactly is your point Bigway???.....Are you trying to big note about NZ's bounce rate for some reason......if so please desist......as anyone who has been around skydiving for a while will tell you......it can turn to shit in the next 5 minutes!!!!!....

A reserve is supposed to save your life....but I'd prefer you to pack and deploy your main properly in the first place.........

Is that OK with you Sparky???....
My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

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whhooo. no mate i aint trying to talk about bounce rate death rate or anything of the sort. I am just asking why the re pack is different for different countries. in skydiving we all seem to stick to the same rules(most of them anyway) i am just trying to see why this law in our sport is different. All the comments about taupo and things just come into it and if it was mentioned first by me was because i was trying to explain where my question is coming from.
I am pretty sure that i never started comparing death rates i was merley saying that wigh 2 fatalities that this can not be the reason why the states does not have the law of repacks every 6 months. i never said that reserve repacks were relevant to fatalities i was trying to show that it is not. as we do it six months and they do it 4 months.
you got a bit of spark in you havent ya mate?


.Karnage Krew Gear Store
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I think I pointed out a few reasons why repack cycles can vary.......but one big reason is because NZ has always been extremely progressive in its approach and attitude.....and has led the way in many areas of skydiving over the years......always a "can do" attitude with forward thinkers to make things happen............NZ went to a 6 month cycle years ago...........in the early 80's if I recall.....

The Poms are 25 years behind.....always have to have a committee to look into something then never make a decision........NZ by comparison is small and its easier to get consensus and monitor change.....most of the ex military dinosaurs were replaced in the mid 70's......unlike many places where they still control a lot of the DZ's........military bases........they have no time for civvies or their ideas............

Your way of presenting your thoughts seemed very convoluted to me thats all.......

My "Sparky" comment was aimed at another poster who will know what I mean.......

Yes I'm always known for speaking my mind.....it gets things happening........too many PC people pussyfoot around issues for my liking.......makes for good friends........but deadly enemies.......

What DZ you from???.....

What about those All Blacks then............
My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

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Sorry...looked at your profile after asking your DZ.......I'd already guessed Auckalofa........Mercer huh...............

Where are you in Pomgolia?? (if thats where you're still are)......
My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

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scotland....all blacks are playing oz in about 7 hours. i run a pub here so opening up early. i wish i still had my pub down in oxford during those last english matches. i hate skydiving here, my closest dz is one hour away, it is only open in the weekends and it rains every weeken. i am waiting for lynley and gareth in aucks to send over my new gear and the heading to austria and hopefully meet up with jamie cardow at the world champs in croatia. yeah i was at mercer. i was one of those graduates from the chch diploma course, but dont get me started on that course.


.Karnage Krew Gear Store
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>The re-pack cycle still is 60 days for a rig that has and portion of it
>made out of natural fiber/fabric.

Interesting. I've seen several standard rigs made at least partially from leather (with a nylon backing) - none that I know of are repacked every 60 days.



Is it real leather or a good copy? Do you know how often every rig you have seen is repacked?
The FAA says in 105.43.....

1) Within 120 days before the date of its use, if its canopy, shroud, and harness are composed exclusively of nylon, rayon, or similar synthetic fiber or material that is substantially resistant to damage from mold, mildew, and other fungi, and other rotting agents propagated in a moist environment; or
(2) Within 60 days before the date of its use, if it is composed of any amount of silk, pongee, or other natural fiber, or material not specified in paragraph (b)(1) of this section.

And no, I don't know what pongee is.
My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

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The bureaucrats don't give a darn about riggers income.
____________________________________________
Nor should they. Although, sometimes it seems like the tax code was set up to employ accountants:S



Didn't mean to imply they should only to state that a "short" repack cycle had nothing to do with trying to provide income for riggers.


"Truth is tough. It will not break, like a bubble, at a touch; nay, you may kick it about all day like a football, and it will be round and full at evening."
-- Oliver Wendell Holmes

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>Is it real leather or a good copy? Do you know how often every rig
> you have seen is repacked?

Dunno on most of them. Only one I ever asked about it was Mick Cottle, who had real leather on his rig. He believed that since the leather was not structural that the interval should be 120 days.

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>Is it real leather or a good copy? Do you know how often every rig
> you have seen is repacked?

Dunno on most of them. Only one I ever asked about it was Mick Cottle, who had real leather on his rig. He believed that since the leather was not structural that the interval should be 120 days.



Part 105 dose not mention anything about structural:
"(2) Within 60 days before the date of its use, if it is composed of any amount of silk, pongee, or other natural fiber, or material not specified in paragraph (b)(1) of this section. "
My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

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The repack cycle in germany is 180 days, and by law (although nobody does it) a licensed sport jumper is allowed to do his own reserve pack.



Sorry, but this is completely wrong.
In Germany you need a special reserve packer license
and the repack cycle is 1 year.

Don't be a Lutz!

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pretty sure, well not that i know of anyway but pretty certain that they did not throw up their breakfast thinking it could act as a reserve parachute. so this makes me wonder what is safer?
a/ a regular 6 month repack/inspection or..
b/ eating your breakfast in the morning.


Since most fatalities are caused by other problems than reserve problems the fatality frequency is not a good measure. Furthermore not all double malfunctions are related to the reserve packjob and those who are need not be related to the repack period.

Actually eating breakfast could increase safety. Most accidents happens because the jumper does something wrong rather than there is something wrong with the equipment.

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