Skygod straight from AFF

[RkyMtnHigh 0]

I'm concerned. There's a kid who went thru AFF with lots of kudos and no repeats..blazed thru the entire student program and now he thinks he's a Skygod! He's flying camera and coaching already and yikes! IMO it's all way too soon..so much to learn still...but I suppose that the sport will teach him as he goes those things that he's skipped over.

Quality versus Quantity. Yes, you can crank out a shit load of jumps in a short period of time, but does that make you a great skydiver? I question that.

_________________________________________

[OSOK 0]

What DZ?

[Vectracide 0]

Before this becomes a "bash the new guy" for being so stupid.....how about some facts......?

# of jumps?
Currency?
When start camera?
Coaching what.......?


I'm not taking sides......I am about having ALL the information before casting my own opinions.....

Besides.....what good is your rant in the first place......will any good at all come from it to begin with?

------------------------------

Controlled and Deliberate.....

[BillyVance 34]

Those people are a dime a dozen. And then they die, or quit, a year into the sport. I've seen them and knew a couple... (not ones who died)

There was the one in TX, a deaf skydiver who just happened to have a natural talent for skydiving right off the bat. Started doing freeflying almost off student status. Got a swelled head. Even did an intentional cutaway for his 100th jump, even after being told not to when he spoke of it beforehand, and eventually got reamed and flamed when he bragged about it on here. He doesn't jump anymore.

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[skycat 0]

I'm in a lot of sport besides skydiving that make me realize doing something mean nothing. Listening, learning from others mistakes, and being humble mean a ton to becoming successful and staying alive.

If I have nothing to give back to the sport other than the comment of "Know why you disagree with something, don't just do it cause someone told you so." Works the same the other way...."Know why you agree with something."

Fly it like you stole it!

[Vectracide 0]

You really don't know any of the information I pointed out do you......

The silence is deafening.....

------------------------------

Controlled and Deliberate.....

[shropshire 0]

Sometimes..... natural talent exists and can be nutured and a world class athlete can be helped to shine.



On the other hand a complete tw** can be exposed.

Without all of the relevant facts, how would we know?

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[MooChooser 0]

Quote

Quality versus Quantity. Yes, you can crank out a shit load of jumps in a short period of time, but does that make you a great skydiver? I question that.

If this person has done a shit load of jumps in a short period of time then they'll probably be better than someone who has done the same number in a long period of time. Throw in natural talent and then its likely you'll have someone who is pretty good at what they do. Currency is important.

What makes you think that their jumps were not quality jumps?

Be honest, you just don't like this person right?

[RkyMtnHigh 0]

I actually like him. He's a nice guy but I just think he's getting the cart before the horse. What makes me think it's quantity vs quality is the videos of his jumps and 800 jumps in a year.

AFF to D license in one year. Do you think he's ready to be an AFFI or TM? technically based on his jump #s and license # he qualifies to get the rating.

_________________________________________

[squirrel 0]

Quote

AFF to D license in one year. Do you think he's ready to be an AFFI or TM? technically based on his jump #s and license # he qualifies to get the rating.

Well, if the USPA will give him the ratings in under a year, its something we have to live with, no matter what you think. But the deciding factor is will a DZ hire him with this amount, or lack of, time under his belt. If we are unhappy with the ability to achieve these ratings in this time frame, we need to change the guidelines.

Side note. In the US you can go to trucking school for a week or so, take a test, and then be allowed to drive a 80,000 pound vehicle, at 75 miles an hour down the highway. 80,000 pounds vs. a 3000 pound car...whos gonna win? Whos gonna die? Is the person good enough to avoid an accident, smashing over little commuter cars full of people? Well, the guidelines say so. Get where I am going with this?

________________________________
Where is Darwin when you need him?

[DSE 3]

Quote

I actually like him. He's a nice guy but I just think he's getting the cart before the horse. What makes me think it's quantity vs quality is the videos of his jumps and 800 jumps in a year.

AFF to D license in one year. Do you think he's ready to be an AFFI or TM? technically based on his jump #s and license # he qualifies to get the rating.

he can't become a TM in one year.
IMO, doesn't matter how much time he has in the sport, if he's dedicated enough of his life and money to do 800 jumps in a year, more power to him; he's probably damn good, based on currency alone.
Jonathan Tagle did 800 jumps his first year, he's a world champion. Maybe your guy is on that same track?

[Gawain 0]

Quote

I actually like him. He's a nice guy but I just think he's getting the cart before the horse. What makes me think it's quantity vs quality is the videos of his jumps and 800 jumps in a year.

AFF to D license in one year. Do you think he's ready to be an AFFI or TM? technically based on his jump #s and license # he qualifies to get the rating.

800 jumps in a year is pretty damn impressive in my book. Currency is fairly relevant in this sport. Experience is a whole different matter. Coaching others to jump or getting into video is one thing. He probably hasn't been around the sport long enough to say, run a DZ or open a gear store.

So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!

[FallingDuck 0]

From what it sounds like he is a good jumper with some natural talent. As long as the rest of the people at the dz keep him from getting too cocky then he sould be ok.

[LloydDobbler 2]

Quote

he can't become a TM in one year.
IMO, doesn't matter how much time he has in the sport, if he's dedicated enough of his life and money to do 800 jumps in a year, more power to him; he's probably damn good, based on currency alone.
Jonathan Tagle did 800 jumps his first year, he's a world champion. Maybe your guy is on that same track?

Yup, I agree. Could be.

On the other hand, I've also met a couple of skydivers going down that route (500+ jumps in their 1st year) who perfectly illustrate the anecdote about being able to throw a rock out of a plane 500 times...(and yet it still being a rock).

I say the wiser, more seasoned jumpers are probably a good indicator. Most appreciate a younger jumper with talent, but get really annoyed with a younger jumper with a big ego that he can't back up. If they fly with him and think him good, he's probably good. If they fly with him and think him lousy, then hopefully they'll try and shrink his head down a little bit...for his sake & everybody else's.

Signatures are the new black.

[bigway 4]

what on earth is wrong with coaching other people off aff and doing video with 800 jumps?

He has double the practical experience you have.

Is it really his fault that he has dedicated his life to the sport and come so far in such a short time?

Why do you call him a skygod? do you look up to him like he is a skygod?

someone jelous?

.Karnage Krew Gear Store
.

[Opie 0]

Quote

what on earth is wrong with coaching other people off aff and doing video with 800 jumps?

He has double the practical experience you have.

Is it really his fault that he has dedicated his life to the sport and come so far in such a short time?

Why do you call him a skygod? do you look up to him like he is a skygod?

someone jelous?

His number of jumps in that short time is impressive. However some things you only learn with time. I bet he's got a lot of great stuff to share as a coach with that many jumps in a year, but I would rather have a coach that has made 200-300 a year for say 5 years, jumped at many different dropzones and boogies around the country (or world), and has spent a few years learning lessons that only come from being in the right place at the right time.

It's nothing negative about him.

[bigway 4]

understandable but a guy who is coaching just off aff students and flying camera with 800 jumps in one year. There is nothing wrong with that. All he is doing is coaching basics by the sound of it.

Good for him i say.

.Karnage Krew Gear Store
.

[peregrinerose 0]

Frankly, I'm jealous of anyone who has the time and money to make 800 jumps in a year! Is he aware of his surroundings? A generally safe jumper? Make decent judgement calls? Flying a canopy that suits his skill level? Is he a good flyer?

I honestly don't see a problem with someone with that many jumps in so short of a time being a coach and flying video. It may even make him a good coach, since his first jump was relatively recent... it is fresh in his mind exactly what it feels like to be a new jumper and the psychological aspects that go along with that.

I think every jumper in the sky has a lot to learn... there's always SOMETHING we don't know and can learn to do better regardless of jump numbers.

Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda

[diablopilot 2]

It really depends on the jumpers attitude. Do they still learn as much as they teach?

----------------------------------------------
You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

[shropshire 0]

Quote

Quality versus Quantity. Yes, you can crank out a shit load of jumps in a short period of time, but does that make you a great skydiver? I question that.

That quoted text did not come from me (or even from one of my posts!!) ... and I dont even believe it.

Would be rather nice if you had replied to the quoters post, dont yoou think?

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[pincheck 0]

Quote

It really depends on the jumpers attitude. Do they still learn as much as they teach?

do you ever stop learning ,I can only think not.

Billy-Sonic Haggis Flickr-Fun

[diablopilot 2]

Unfortunately, some do.

----------------------------------------------
You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

[Pulse 0]

I have to agree that some things really do get better with time. He may be okay with practical stuff. But the fact is he can't have that much 'life' experience when it comes to skydiving without being around the drop zone for a few years. That opens your eyes to a lot of things.

"Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled."

[hajnalka 0]

Quote

On the other hand, I've also met a couple of skydivers going down that route (500+ jumps in their 1st year) who perfectly illustrate the anecdote about being able to throw a rock out of a plane 500 times...(and yet it still being a rock).

I say the wiser, more seasoned jumpers are probably a good indicator. Most appreciate a younger jumper with talent, but get really annoyed with a younger jumper with a big ego that he can't back up. If they fly with him and think him good, he's probably good. If they fly with him and think him lousy, then hopefully they'll try and shrink his head down a little bit...for his sake & everybody else's.

I really liked these words, because we have this same guy at our DZ. He's called Eric. All of our instructors loved him from day 1, and that didn't change when he started doing video or coaching after a few months. He was a college student who basically lived at the DZ and jumped his ass off.

He got a bit uppity at one point when he was downsizing every two weeks. We talked to him, and ... he listened! He's never had an injury or caused an unsafe situation, as far as I know.

From a very early age he was filling in for video at RW meets, and many teams have tried to snag him.

Got started with BASE, took a Tom Aiello course, and took a few months off for a X-country BASE jaunt, starting at Moab, going up to Twin Falls, visiting/jumping in numerous cities, ending up at Bridge Day. Along the way, graduated to a very small JVX and is now one of the best canopy pilots at our DZ.

He hangs out in the rigging loft with us and helps us out; packs his own reserves under my supervision.

He got his tandem rating about two months ago and is now part of our regular full-time instructor rotation.

Quite simply, he's a very talented natural. Your guy may be, as well.

So, how do the senior, trusted jumpers and instructional staff at your DZ react to this guy? This is what I think's important. Has anyone complained about him? Is he causing controversy?

Eric caused mild controversy at our DZ, which was quickly resolved (all you had to do was see video of him flying, or watch him land a few times, or hear him work with students .) If I wasn't at the DZ full time --- and if I wasn't the partner of our head instructor --- I may have viewed things quite differently myself.

Just posting a different perspective.

If your guy is a safety concern, please talk to someone at your DZ! If he's on an ego trip I'd be surprised ... but if so, I'd bet it won't last long. If he's talking on and on about gear mods and RDS's and WLs and packing methods and video equipment and dropping names and uploading video to his laptop, etc. etc. this is normal and it will pass - DO NOT induce vomiting; do not call 911.

Best,
D

[dorbie 0]

Quote

I actually like him. He's a nice guy but I just think he's getting the cart before the horse. What makes me think it's quantity vs quality is the videos of his jumps and 800 jumps in a year.

AFF to D license in one year. Do you think he's ready to be an AFFI or TM? technically based on his jump #s and license # he qualifies to get the rating.

From your initial post I would never have guessed he had 800 jumps a D license and was extremely current.

You need to learn what the requirements are for the ratings you're throwing around somewhat hysterically.