Bob Rawlins' Private Pilot's License -- Spinoff From Duanesburg Incident

[ZigZagMarquis 8]

Et All, at the behest of the Mods, I spun this off from the "Man Jumps Without Rig" thread

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Tumbler said:
I wished so much to remain above the fray in this and leave the facts as my only communication, but find it difficult. This post will be off topic, but germane to the way the thread has progressed. Should the Mods find it inappropriate, well hell, I have no defense.

I had no idea my sport was filled with such a bevy of angels. While the knuckle dragging, children eating skydivers of Duanesburg crawl back into our caves to worship the devil and eat our dead you are floating blissfully above our Neanderthal-like hoard. What a wonderful world you live in.

Let those amongst you without fault come forth and cast those stones, as it is clear some of Bob’s competitors are doing. Evident to all when a Duanesburg student chimes in to defend his friends, a bit naive mind you and young, and is attacked by a fellow skydiver. Stick with guns on me big fella, I can take it.

Bob is a strange man with his own views of the world. He also happens to be in charge of the Daunesburg Skydiving Club and sets the tone for the drop zone. As evil as you make Bob out to be; did you know he took Sloan up for free? There was never a dime collected, nor wanted, because Bob just wanted to help out some kid who was doing a class project and didn't have much money. Would your DZ do that? Every weekend Bob ensures the fridge is stocked with steaks, chicken, ham, and vegetables and feeds us all, not just staff but everyone, for free; many times cooking as well. He takes his plane to the best damn aero mechanic in the Northeast, the same one at least two other dropzones use, and pays top dollar for the best parts to ensure the plane is always at its best, legally and mechanically. I held in my hand yesterday Bob’s FAA class three medical, dated June 9th, 2006. He has been in this business for 32 years, longer than most people on here posting have been alive and he has been flying the entire time.

The ONLY ones able to cast informed judgment upon him and his operation will be the FAA investigators when their investigation is complete and based upon their complete and thorough understanding of the regulations governing such operations. Unless there is an FAA attorney posting on Dropzone.com I suggest nearly all other posts are personal and emotional responses, overzealous and self righteous rants and/or pure conjectures, with few being based on the facts of this particular case and the regulations overseeing them. When the FAA investigation is complete, they may indeed come down “hard” on this dropzone, do nothing at all, or come to some place in between the two. Whatever the outcome, someone will be unhappy and that young man will still be dead.

Personally, I can’t sleep. I can still see him in my minds eye, standing in our packing area. I shook his hand, told him to enjoy the ride and that it is so cool when the skydivers leave the plane. He smiled, shook my hand back, and said he was looking forward to it. I chuckled to myself when I saw the little camera he had. I thought maybe I should let him use mine, but I had video and stills to jump on the next load, so I needed them. We are all going through grief, guilt, anger and bewilderment over this and will for some time.

For all the PM’s and posts with the love and support, thank you. Thank you from everyone at Dburg. It makes me so damn proud to be part of this merry band. These sentiments are echoed by many at the Dropzone.

I will post any more factual data that comes to light, or bits of information as this continues to wind its course but suggest we may have exhausted the usefulness of this particular string.

tom

(edited for spelling)

Tumbler,

Fair enough. Through all and after all of that, have any of you there asked Bob why he doesn't have a Commercial Pilot's License and Class 2 Medical Certificate when it seems clear that he should have had one to be flying jumpers and if he has been asked by one of y'all, what was his answer?

[mjosparky 3]

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The ONLY ones able to cast informed judgment upon him and his operation will be the FAA investigators when their investigation is complete and based upon their complete and thorough understanding of the regulations governing such operations.

This is complete bull shit. As a pilot and a jumper with over 30 years in the sport my informed judgment is that this guy lied to his customers and cheated them every time he charged for his services knowing full well he was not qualified to provide them. Get you head out of the sand and see the facts for what they are.

Sparky

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

[ZigZagMarquis 8]

Sparky,

While I don't disagree with your words and I understand this is a public forum, I was and still hope to get an answer to the pointed question, "Why does Mr Rawlins feel he can fly jumpers with just a private pilots license?" Suspicions and judgements aside, I'd like to hear the answer to that question.

Do I think I'll get an answer to that question? Well... we'll see, but what seems abscent in the rush to his defense is "why did he think it was okay to fly jumpers with just a private pilot's license" all the steaks and beer in the fridge withstanding.

[shermanator 3]

I'm curious of the legalities of this. Being a private pilot, and taking money *is this dz a club, or operation?* .. anyways, Can the regular jumpers of the dropzone take legal action for compensation of money given to him under the belief that he was a commercial pilot and allowed to take money for compensation?

CLICK HERE! new blog posted 9/21/08
CSA #720

[pilotdave 0]

Not if they want to jump elsewhere... ever.
But seriously, why would any jumper do that? They paid to jump, they jumped. Why would they deserve money back?

Dave

[peckerhead 0]

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The ONLY ones able to cast informed judgment upon him and his operation will be the FAA investigators when their investigation is complete and based upon their complete and thorough understanding of the regulations governing such operations.

This is complete bull shit. As a pilot and a jumper with over 30 years in the sport my informed judgment is that this guy lied to his customers and cheated them every time he charged for his services knowing full well he was not qualified to provide them. Get you head out of the sand and see the facts for what they are.

Sparky

Ever punch a cloud Michael? Ever break a rule? Of course not! You live in a perfect world. 30 years and you aint never done anything wrong? Nothing?

Wow! You are a saint and we should all bow down to you! If your best friend gets busted do you run to the prosecution? Do you call the FAA everytime you see us break a rule? It happens every day!

You just lost all my respect dude.

People are grieving and lives are being shattered and you seem to want to help the other side.


What is the matter with you?

[mjosparky 3]

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What is the matter with you?

I have a very low tolerance for people who lie and cheat, people who are too fucking lazy to do the job right. Aviation rules much like skydiving rules are often written blood. This is not the 60’s or even the 70’s. It is way past the time where the skydiving community start taking responsibility for how jumpers and DZO’s alike conduct themselves.
As for loosing respect for me, would you respect me more if I stole you car or maybe bounced a check on you? You don’t get to pick and choose which laws you obey and which one you don’t. You may feel it is all right to drive drunk because you can handle it. But if you get caught you will go to jail because it is illegal, dangerous and just plain wrong.

Sparky

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

[peckerhead 0]

Sorry Michael, but I will not throw someone under the bus without knowing all the facts.

It seems like some people here have an ax to grind. If you are not one of them then I appologize.

Let's let the dust settle, OK?

[Armour666 0]

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I'm curious of the legalities of this. Being a private pilot, and taking money *is this dz a club, or operation?* .. anyways, Can the regular jumpers of the dropzone take legal action for compensation of money given to him under the belief that he was a commercial pilot and allowed to take money for compensation?

The other legalities I would be worried about as a jumper is if I land off and cause some sort of damages the USPA insurance coverage WOULD NOT BE VALID

A lot have mentioned that they don’t think it effects them on the jumper side of things if the pilot is licensed properly or not but it dose.

From the USPA website. Insurance programs

“This insurance is valid for skydives made in accordance with USPA's Basic Safety Requirements and the Federal Aviation Regulations. Most drop zones assure that jumpers have this type of insurance by requiring current USPA membership to jump there. All claims must be brought in the U.S. or Canada.”

SO this one time at band camp.....

"Of all the things I've lost I miss my mind the most."

[Colson 0]

Everybody has broken rules.

Cloud minimums, airspace, TFRS, undetected paperwork discrepancies, etc. Chances are they were accidental and were glad nobody busted their ass. I cant think of anybody who would bust their friend because he flew his cherokee but forgot to update the W&B sheet.

Willfully flying for 10+ years without the required certificate is in a class of its own.

[mjosparky 3]

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Let's let the dust settle, OK?

Deal.

Sparky

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals