Squeak 17 #26 September 8, 2008 QuoteHi denete, QuoteIs there another thread where I can find information on this? Try AC105. I was not referring to his flying the aircraft, I was referring to the jumper(s) not telling him that they were jumping illegal equipment. Hope that this clears that up for you, JerryBaumchen This, to me would fall under the banner of "ignorance of the law is no excuse" If the poilot was happy to take jumpers up then, said pilot should KNOW the regs pertaining to it. Failure to know those rules is completely the pilots doing.You are not now, nor will you ever be, good enough to not die in this sport (Sparky) My Life ROCKS! How's yours doing? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #27 September 8, 2008 It's been said before......I don't BASE at the Dropzone, and I don't Skydive off objects.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skypuppy 1 #28 September 8, 2008 QuoteAnd im not talking about ex jumpers or people who just do tandems. Im talking about skydivers. Lotta blowhards, too. REally, for someone with the experience level you have listed on your profile, I find it amazing you want to keep pushing the point.If some old guy can do it then obviously it can't be very extreme. Otherwise he'd already be dead. Bruce McConkey 'I thought we were gonna die, and I couldn't think of anyone Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,380 #29 September 8, 2008 >Like we evil jumpers deceived him and lost him his job. In many places in skydiving and BASE jumping, trust is important. I know a lot of people I would trust to give me a gear check. Now, they could lie to me, even mess with my gear, and directly or indirectly cause my death. But I am willing to take that risk. If someone intentionally overlooked something (or intentionally gave me a mal) I'd be pretty disappointed. So would you, I suspect - even though, in the end, only you are responsible for the gear you jump. Pilots aren't much different. I'm pretty careful about checking for spots/clouds/traffic when I jump, partly to protect myself and partly to protect the pilot and the dropzone. I use seatbelts for a similar reason. Now, could I disregard seatbelt rules while taxiing, hang out the door and yell "FUCK YOU FAA ASSHOLES!" when someone from the FAA was there? Sure - and going by the rules, it would be the pilot's fault. But since I trust the pilots at the places I jump, and they trust me, I wouldn't do that. Everyone's different, I suppose. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JerryBaumchen 1,046 #30 September 8, 2008 Hi Squeak, I made my first jump in 1964 and my last jump in 2003. In all of those years, no pilot has ever asked me if my rig was legal or not, or to see my packing data card to determine if I was in date or not. I 'think' you have jumped here in the USA. What would you have thought if the pilot asked to see every packing data card of every jumper on the load(s) to determine if they were in date or not? JerryBaumchen PS) I jumped in Australia in 1990 & in 1994. Only the dz management asked to see my packing data card. I don't know the nitty-gritty of the rules in your country but I was legal and in date for my country. I hope that somehow I did not violate any pilot. I'd feel damn bad if I did. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #31 September 8, 2008 Great post IMHOIt's funny, but there've been a lot of posts about the pilot being put in trouble by these naughty jumpers but not one (that I've seen) has asked what "Did He know about the jump before hand". - Just a load of hot-air and assumptions. (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
strop45 0 #32 September 8, 2008 Quote I hope that somehow I did not violate any pilot. I'd feel damn bad if I did. Boy, I hope so too, at least unless they were pretty and willing. Seriously I can see Andy's point. If you have never knowingly broken a rule or two, then maybe its fair enough to criticize those who who do with such certainty and self-righteousness. But next time you jump though some industrial haze, exceed the speed limit in your car/motorbike, or otherwise break a rule or two, give a thought to those who use base gear from aircraft. I don't plan to ever use base gear from an aircraft, but I can see the reasons and rationale for so doing. WayneThe difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits." -- Albert Einstein Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Squeak 17 #33 September 8, 2008 Quote Hi Squeak, I made my first jump in 1964 and my last jump in 2003. In all of those years, no pilot has ever asked me if my rig was legal or not, or to see my packing data card to determine if I was in date or not. I 'think' you have jumped here in the USA. What would you have thought if the pilot asked to see every packing data card of every jumper on the load(s) to determine if they were in date or not? JerryBaumchen PS) I jumped in Australia in 1990 & in 1994. Only the dz management asked to see my packing data card. I don't know the nitty-gritty of the rules in your country but I was legal and in date for my country. I hope that somehow I did not violate any pilot. I'd feel damn bad if I did. I understand what you're saying Jerry and i mostly agree, but pilots working at DZs are working under the (at least) auspice of the DZO. i.e. the pilots are relying on the DZO/DZSO to maintain the apporpriate jumper requirements. A pilot that is not a jump pilot taking jumpers up should (for their own sake) avail themselves of the apporopriate rules and regs. (i'm assuming that the pilot in quetion was not operating under standard DZ conditions, but i could well be wrong here.)You are not now, nor will you ever be, good enough to not die in this sport (Sparky) My Life ROCKS! How's yours doing? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
robskydiv 0 #34 September 8, 2008 I think that BASE is cool. I've always wanted to go to Bridge Day and make one. Or even off of the Batman building in downtown Nashville... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PeregrineFalcon 0 #35 September 8, 2008 Quote I don't plan to ever use base gear from an aircraft, but I can see the reasons and rationale for so doing. Wayne Hey, Wayne. What is the rationale for using base gear from an aircraft? I'm not trying to be a smart ass here. I really want to know. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,380 #36 September 8, 2008 > What is the rationale for using base gear from an aircraft? Testing, mainly. I tested my first BASE setup (Mojo, mesh slider, 42" PC) from an airplane. It was in a legal rig (an old Swift.) Jumping from an airplane removes the danger of an object strike and gives you more time to deal with problems that develop. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
msigman85 0 #37 September 9, 2008 As a pilot I know the Regs, As Skydiver I know Regs. As friend to many a BASE jumpers, I know Base jumping a little. If I lost my job because some foreign asshole skydiver came to our dropzone and broke the law knowingly and got caught I would expect him to be alienated, pissed on, and drop kicked off the drop zone. Jump pilots are there for the skydivers and with out jump pilots no one skydives. Everything is a pilot's fault in skydiving because the FAA needs someone to blame. Skydivers NEED to understand this. It is impractical to ask pilots who are there to serve YOU to know everything about BASE and SKYDIVING gear. We know about flying a/c. We especially those of us at busier drop zones need to be able to trust our jumpers. Domestic, and foreign. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JerryBaumchen 1,046 #38 September 9, 2008 Hi Squeak, Not to beat this old mare anymore but my posts were based upon the assumption that the pilot did not know of the illegal rig. If the pilot knew then he was a party to the violation and, IMO, needs to understand the risks of getting FAA-tagged. JerryBaumchen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy_Copland 0 #39 September 9, 2008 You know whats hilarious, half the folks going down the nationality track are probably the ones who say "I'm Irish" or "I'm German" and even "I'm Italian." You're all foreigners in the US unless you're native, get over it. Stick to the facts Mr Dropkick WWE hero.1338 People aint made of nothin' but water and shit. Until morale improves, the beatings will continue. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CSpenceFLY 1 #40 September 9, 2008 You just had to go and bring wrassalin' into it didn't you. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
likestojump 3 #41 September 9, 2008 QuoteYou know whats hilarious, half the folks going down the nationality track are probably the ones who say "I'm Irish" or "I'm German" and even "I'm Italian." You're all foreigners in the US unless you're native, get over it. Stick to the facts Mr Dropkick WWE hero. Very simple test Andy. When the "dash-Americans" come to Europe - do they identify themselves as German/Irish/Italian, etc or just plain-old "monolingual American" ??? This thread has NOTHING to do with nationalities, ethnicity, just with FAA regs. Whatever JerryB's reasons are for bringing countries into the conversation, it puzzles me... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy_Copland 0 #42 September 9, 2008 It keeps getting brought up though and its confusing the shit out of me 1338 People aint made of nothin' but water and shit. Until morale improves, the beatings will continue. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,380 #43 September 9, 2008 Your one warning. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #44 September 9, 2008 Quote You're all foreigners in the US unless you're native, get over it. Same is true for those living in England. Is the point about foreigners that they may not know the FAA regs? BASE seems more grey area, legally speaking, in the US than in other countries. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
likestojump 3 #45 September 9, 2008 QuoteQuote You're all foreigners in the US unless you're native, get over it. Same is true for those living in England. Is the point about foreigners that they may not know the FAA regs? BASE seems more grey area, legally speaking, in the US than in other countries. no, the whole point is that JerryB kept pointing out Andy's supposed ignorance of FAA regs and/or supposed blatant disregard and relating those issues to him being a non-American. It may not be what he intended to do, but it sure as hell sounded ignorant. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
virgin-burner 1 #46 September 9, 2008 Quote It keeps getting brought up though and its confusing the shit out of me come jumping over here, BASE is completely legal in this neck of the woods.. but hey, you're a foreigner, maybe not! “Some may never live, but the crazy never die.” -Hunter S. Thompson "No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try." -Yoda Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
likestojump 3 #47 September 9, 2008 Quote Quote It keeps getting brought up though and its confusing the shit out of me come jumping over here, BASE is completely legal in this neck of the woods.. but hey, you're a foreigner, maybe not! BASE is completely legal in the US too. There are bans by a few agency owned lands and municipalities, but otherwise 99.9% of the country is quite legal. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #48 September 10, 2008 Quote BASE is completely legal in the US too. There are bans by a few agency owned lands and municipalities, but otherwise 99.9% of the country is quite legal. You sure about that percentage? Would NPS agree that even 99.9% of Bridge day jumps are legal? Nevermind Yosemite. Certainly doesn't enjoy the same status as rock climbers and mountaineers do...hopefully that will change in time, esp if fuel costs make skydiving less viable. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
msigman85 0 #49 September 10, 2008 who cares about any of this crap? Where you're from.. the legality of base jumping.. You want to jump the empire state building, jump the empire state building. The skydiving community might even applaud you. Ya did something you felt like doing, and ya didn't screw over another member of the skydiving community and then criticize the community for calling you an arrogant piece of shit which is what it seems.. you did. no? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #50 September 10, 2008 huh? did your post make more sense before you edited it? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
