Airport security and carryon parachutes....ugh....

[Chris-Ottawa 0]

Morning,

So, here I am, sitting in the terminal waiting for my flight. Had a bit of trouble getting through security with my rig as carry on and I have time to tell the story.

First of all, I absolutely flat out refuse to put it as cargo and have them lose my parachute only to offer me $200 in compensation. No F-ing way.

So, throw everything on the belt while getting some funny looks by the other passengers and mostly the security personnel. The first guy that sees it, lights up, eyes wide saying what is that. I briefly say it is a parachute. At this point he goes off and starts asking alot of questions and drawing a bunch of attention, nothing bad, just curious questions. A couple other staff come over to check it out. They finally get it through the belt and the one lady comes over with a smile/grin/fuck you type look. She says "do you have electronics stuffed in there. SO I carefully explain that there is an electronic device that opens my parachute for me. She says ok, I'm going to have to get my supervisor. Off they run and about 15 minutes later, supervisor appears. During this time they stopped the whole line and left the parachute in the middle of the x-ray machine. They hum and haw, ask me a bunch of questions, then I hear the cursed words. "We'll have to open it to be sure".

I'm thinking....FUCK.

Lady comes over and says... "Since we've never seen one of these before, can we open it up to verify what the electronic device is? I again, carefully, explain what it is and offer up some of the printed documentation I gathered before the trip. This is where I say "THANK YOU AIRTEC". That x-ray card saved me a repack. I also had to show them that it turns on and I can disable it and the supervisor said, he was ok with it, just be sure to swap it. So they swab the hell out of it and say it's good to go. This is when security guys with all the questions at the beginning walks back over with more questions. And he grabs my handle and says "DO you just tuck these away. I QUICKLY said, "that's the handle I use to activate my reserve if I have a malfunction, we probably don't want to pull that right now. He quickly let go and just walked away.

Now that I've held up the line for about 30 mins, thinking everyone behind would be pissed, I had a whole bunch of the approach me and ask questions, or make crash jokes. I happily answered their questions, but didn't want to draw more attention so I kept it minimal.

Thankfully, it worked out and hopefully i make it easier for the next person through.

Anyways, just thought I would share. I'll be in Z-Hills in mere hours...

*This occurred at the Ottawa International airport (Canada)

"When once you have tasted flight..."

[diablopilot 2]

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So, throw everything on the belt while getting some funny looks by the other passengers and mostly the security personnel.

Put it in a gear bag.

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You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

[pilotdave 0]

I know you're in Canada so I wouldn't expect you to follow US guidelines, but the USPA and the TSA have a lot of advice on how to travel with a rig. It's a lot easier when you do your homework first and have all the info printed out. I don't know about canadian security, but I travel with the section number of the TSA manual written down. If they have a question about my rig, I can point them to THEIR operating manual that says it's allowed. And of course you didn't follow the #1 piece of advice... the gear bag.

Dave

[Chris-Ottawa 0]

Agree on the gear bag, but I feel that if I'm open about it and not seeming to "hide/cover" anything, that they'll be a little more lenient.

When I go through security, it's actually all US border agents or whatever they're called. So technically, I think I could print out the FAA manual.

I do have letters from westjet saying it's allowed as well as a reference to the FAA manual from DZ.com, plus the cypres card. I only had to show the cypress card. Oh and FYI...I thought my rig would look a bit different than the cypress card shows as it's a bit old I assumed, but not at all...It look IDENTICAL, including colours and everthing.

I guess the point in this is stay calm and talk your way through it. Gear bag, yep, you're right....would have saved me some looks/questions.

"When once you have tasted flight..."

[pilotdave 0]

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Agree on the gear bag, but I feel that if I'm open about it and not seeming to "hide/cover" anything, that they'll be a little more lenient.

What you're doing is legal. You don't need to worry about being open about it. Both the USPA and TSA recommend having your rig in a bag with nothing else.

I've seen a lot more trouble when people try to make things easier by letting security know it's a parachute. I plop my bag on the belt and don't say a word. 99% of the time it comes through just as if it was filled with my dirty laundry.

Dave

[diablopilot 2]

Most of the world doesn't care you're a skydiver, not only are you not going to prove a point to airport security, you're not even going to pick up any chicks in the airport simply because you want to be "open about it".

Duffle bags are 10 bucks at Wal Mart. Stop making it difficult for the skydiver following you through the line.

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You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

[Remster 24]

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When I go through security, it's actually all US border agents or whatever they're called. So technically, I think I could print out the FAA manual.

You have it wrong.

When you go to the US from Canada, while the immigration issues are handled at the canadian airport by US immigration officials (Border Patrol), the security checks and xray machines are run by CATSA, the Canadian agency, not the US TSA.

Remster

[wildfan75 1]

Not that this would help international travel, but when I went through MSP to SAN, I got stopped and when the supervisor came over and started flipping through the TSA manual thingy, I asked if it would help if I gave her the section numbers that dealt with parachutes (its on here or a link from here somewhere). She said yes and I rattled off the numbers and TSA manual volume and she closed the book and thanked me for my time. Hope that tip helps someone, it helped me.

[kelpdiver 2]

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Most of the world doesn't care you're a skydiver, not only are you not going to prove a point to airport security, you're not even going to pick up any chicks in the airport simply because you want to be "open about it".

Duffle bags are 10 bucks at Wal Mart. Stop making it difficult for the skydiver following you through the line.

for some of us, it's not a need to show off, but the reality that a gear bag to fit these 200+ canopies will exceed carry-on sizes. If you wear it like a backpack, the straps/harness isn't viewed as part of the size.

[Scrumpot 1]

1. Duffle Bag or Roll-on carry-on. USE ONE!

There's absolutely nothing wrong with doing that, and it is better on so many levels and from perspectives I won't even begin. Also - it may take some "work" sizing-wise, but if your rig will fit in the sizing bin on it's own, you CAN find a tight bag, or roll-on to fit "around" it. There is no (and that is no) excuse.

2. Based solely on your narrative (these are your words), I think your next big mistake is in how you described it, when asked "what is that"(?). The answer of "A Parachute" quickly renders thoughts in Whuffo's heads of "what does he need a parachute for?" Is he planning to jump outa this plane??

Instead, IMHO when I am asked (and I have been - plenty of times), my response is still quick and simple, yet it separates the rig being carried through, from the event of you flying the airline, altogether.

Ex. "That is my skydiving rig. ...I'm travelling to take part in a skydiving event at XXX". Don't use simply the stand-alone word it's a "PARACHUTE". IMO, if that is what you said - then that also is what got you held up for further inquiry.

JMO, but being as LEAST CONSPICUOUS as you possibly can be, the better. There is absolutely NO GOOD REASON or "excuse" to be ccarrying your rig, slung over your shoulder(s), back-pack style. There is nothing but downside exposure IMHO, to doing that.

coitus non circum - Moab Stone

[repcool 2]

Quote

Quote

Most of the world doesn't care you're a skydiver, not only are you not going to prove a point to airport security, you're not even going to pick up any chicks in the airport simply because you want to be "open about it".

Duffle bags are 10 bucks at Wal Mart. Stop making it difficult for the skydiver following you through the line.

for some of us, it's not a need to show off, but the reality that a gear bag to fit these 200+ canopies will exceed carry-on sizes. If you wear it like a backpack, the straps/harness isn't viewed as part of the size.

I have a 210 in a G4 that fits into a carry on case just FINE. I traveled with it close to double digits last year with no problem. There is a simple process in place in the US. TSA doesn't want you to check it, they want you to take it through security so they can inspect it with you present. I never had any problem, it always starts with a few questions about "where are you going?" but it seems to me to be more out of curiosity than profiling. Remember, these guys are bored. It gets "sniffed" and that is it.

The one funny thing is twice I have forgotten to take off my hook knife and both times because the rig fell into the "sniffing" process it seemed to skip the inspection and the knife passed by. Good job I am an honest citizen.

Simon

[happythoughts 0]

1. Always tell them as you put it on the belt, "This is a parachute."
The response is usually, "Yes, we've seen them before." because they wish to be cool.

2. Carry the TSA rules for parachute inspection that can be found
on the USPA website.

3. Carry the Cypres diagram card.

4. Be polite, but don't volunteer, "Hey, here it is. Go ahead
and swab it." You'll sound a little "too prepared".

5. They will just swab it and let you continue on.

[ladydyver 0]

its funny every time we go through an airport we get different responses....even in the same airport. you ask them why and they say they are the ones doing it right and all of the others were doing it wrong. I just make sure that I go to the airport early just in case.

DPH # 2
"I am not sure what you are suppose to do with that, but I don't think it is suppose to flop around like that." ~Skootz~
I have a strong regard for the rules.......doc!

[repcool 2]

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its funny every time we go through an airport we get different responses....even in the same airport. you ask them why and they say they are the ones doing it right and all of the others were doing it wrong. I just make sure that I go to the airport early just in case.

This is good advice, I assume I will have to pack my rig again, which means I take leave an extra 35 minutes!

[I3uller 0]

Haha I swear I think they are more conflicting opinions in skydiving than any other sport in the world....

[kingbunky 3]

Quote

I have a 210 in a G4 that fits into a carry on case just FINE. I traveled with it close to double digits last year with no problem. There is a simple process in place in the US. TSA doesn't want you to check it, they want you to take it through security so they can inspect it with you present. I never had any problem, it always starts with a few questions about "where are you going?" but it seems to me to be more out of curiosity than profiling. Remember, these guys are bored. It gets "sniffed" and that is it.

The one funny thing is twice I have forgotten to take off my hook knife and both times because the rig fell into the "sniffing" process it seemed to skip the inspection and the knife passed by. Good job I am an honest citizen.

Simon

...and if that doesn't work, a quick and dirty workaround (i did it with a javelin j4 with a sabre 190 in it) is to cutaway the main, leave it in the dbag and just wrap the bridle around it to keep it together. put the rig (minus main) in your roller bag or whatever, fill the empty space with whatever, and put the main in your other carry-on. a quick re-connection, continuity check and pack at the other end and you're good to go.

"Hang on a sec, the young'uns are throwin' beer cans at a golf cart."
MB4252 TDS699
killing threads since 2001

[bfilarsky 0]

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...and if that doesn't work, a quick and dirty workaround (i did it with a javelin j4 with a sabre 190 in it) is to cutaway the main, leave it in the dbag and just wrap the bridle around it to keep it together. put the rig (minus main) in your roller bag or whatever, fill the empty space with whatever, and put the main in your other carry-on. a quick re-connection, continuity check and pack at the other end and you're good to go.

Seems like a lot more work than just carrying the rig on with no bag......

[headcase 0]

I have traveled frequently with my rig as a carry-on.

Tips.

1) Place rig by itself in a soft tight fitting duffle bag.

2) Bring a laminated Xray-card in the duffle side pocket and/or in a luggage tag attached to the outside of the duffle. Bring a paper copy of the x-ray card to give to security.

3) Before putting the rig through the x-ray machine quietly get the x-ray operator's attention and show him the x-ray card and explain you have a parachute. He will x-ray and then pull you aside and the supervisor will show up and usually about 5 other people as well (Security personnel are usually intrigued and helpful).

4) When asked pull the rig out of the bag yourself (If they start to do it explain you would prefer to assist them to avoid an inadvertent reserve deploy or cutaway).

5) They'll swab for explosives and you'll be on your way almost before you get your shoes and belt back on.

Lastly, if you are in a hurry at the beginning of the security line well before you get to the X-ray machine if you let them know you can usually get to the front of line via the side entrance used for secondary inspections which is where the swabbing and closer scrutiny of carry-ons occurs. This can save you 30 minutes if the airport is busy.

Security personnel like the break from the usual routine of angry, farty, stinky, rude travelers. With a bit of luck and savoir faire you will find yourself treated quite nicely---at least that has been my experience for the most part.

Cheers

[tetra316 0]

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3) Before putting the rig through the x-ray machine quietly get the x-ray operator's attention and show him the x-ray card and explain you have a parachute. He will x-ray and then pull you aside and the supervisor will show up and usually about 5 other people as well (Security personnel are usually intrigued and helpful).

4) When asked pull the rig out of the bag yourself (If they start to do it explain you would prefer to assist them to avoid an inadvertent reserve deploy or cutaway).

I never announce that I have a parachute with me. Half the time it goes through the xray machine without a second glance so why invite extra screening when you might not even get it if you had kept quite. Second I always take it out of the bag so it is scanned by itself. Saves time and no risk of them swabbing the bag and picking up some trace of explosives from something else.

[pilotdave 0]

My experience has been very different. I've travelled with rigs many times including internationally (to/from Israel, where security is almost insane). I never bring any attention to my rig. It's in a bag with nothing else. I don't tell them what it is. At most I've been asked if it's a parachute. A couple times I've had them call over a supervisor to look at the x-ray. But I've never had them take it out of the bag and I've never had them swab it.

People that bring attention to it get attention. I've travelled with other skydivers that warn security that they are carrying a parachute... they are always the ones that have problems.

When it goes through just like every other bag, I always wonder if the TSA agent is so well trained that he knows it's a parachute and it's allowed or if he's so poorly trained he doesn't notice that there's anything odd about it.

Dave

[headcase 0]

That's why these discussions are so helpful. They provide a cumulative experience greater than any one individual's.

I agree that most of the time just schlepping it thru security unannounced with no fanfare works best until it does get flagged, then the risk is of a juggernaut exists.

I have tried all most iterations including: checking the rig into luggage (announced and unannounced), carry-on (announced and unannounced), in a duffle or not. What I have found is that a simple heads up and as a carry-on although not the easiest is the easiest if security gets a boner for in depth screening which depending on where you are can get interesting. If you are somewhere they have seen rigs typically no problem but if you happen to travel somewhere uptight and without exposure to rigs in the past combined with paranoid security personnel it can get annoying at best .

The input by all here is great. Good luck!!!

[DSE 3]

I travel extensively, and usually have a rig. I don't pack it in anything, because I usually have my computer backpack with me too, and the airlines/security get a little squirrelly sometimes with two backpacks, but no one glances at the rig unless they think it's a backpack. Occasionally I've had someone want to know about "the explosive inside" and I politely explain that it's not quite accurate to call it that, and ask if they'd be comfortable with an explosive charge on their back? If they really push then I do have a copy of the TSA directive, the CYPRES card, and an Xray scan image that points out the parts. Only once have I had to show it, and that was at Ontario, after leaving Perris. Just arrived in MCO via two airports and two security checks, one in ATL and the other SLC. No problems at all.
Like Dave says..."draw attention to your rig, and you'll get the attention you did/didn't want."

[Chris-Ottawa 0]

Hey,

Looks like this sparked a good advice thread.

Something I would like to add as I feel it will assist the situation is the fact that I said nothing aside from the fact that it is a parachute and the agent that had a bunch of questions was asking me stuff that any whuffo would. Stuff about skydiving, not the gear itself, aside from the cost and safety aspect. I feel he was genuinely interested.

The agent that told me she would have to open it, was not at all being mean, and as I was loading the plane about 2 hours later, she was at the gate outside the plane. She apologized and said since they've never seen one before, they like to use it as a training aid.

When it was in the scanner, she told me that the Cypres came up showing as an electronic device, and having hollow areas in it, indicating "air cylinders" (normally). This is when they asked me for more information on what it was and that's why I provided the cypres card. It really was not a terrible order, more of a close call.

"When once you have tasted flight..."

[MB38 0]

Anybody have a decent resolution x-ray image of a rig with a Cypres? I have my Cypres card, but I'd love to laminate one for my bag tag and have a printout I can keep in the bag...

I really don't know what I'm talking about.

[Blink 0]

If you go to the manufacturers website, you can find a copy of the card you have and print out an extra.

Here is the link to the Vigil website:
http://www.vigil.aero/files/1997.pdf

I know Cypres has one as well, just need to do a little searching on their site.

Cheers.