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Tuna-Salad

Wing loading question..

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What wing loading is considered advanced or high performance? I don't have a SIM on hand, but I remember it saying X wing loading is approaching high performance.
My wing loading is 1.20

1.19 actually but I rounded up.
Millions of my potential children died on your daughters' face last night.

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Well, that's a loaded question that is open to a lot of subjectivity. What is high performance and at what wing loading is "high performance" achieved? There's just not a black and white answer.

Also, 1.2 wingloading on a 190 is NOT the same as a 1.2 winloading on a 107. Some people believe below a particular canopy size it is considered high performance regardless of wingloading.

But, that' said, I don't think 1.2 at your canopy size would be considered high performance. But that's just my opinion. Keep in mind you can easily kill yourself by screwing up on a "non-high performance" canopy, even at much lighter wingloadings than yours......or any wingloading for that matter.
Blues,
Nathan

If you wait 'til the last minute, it'll only take a minute.

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Here is Brian Germain's wingloading recommendations chart. These are pretty conservative numbers. But they are a starting point, and Brian Germain knows a whole lot more about canopy flight than I do. One of his points is that you can learn more on a canopy you're not scared of, because you can explore its range.

And here is Billvon's downsizing checklist.

Wendy W.
There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

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My wing loading is 1.20



Look dude, I read your other thread, where you were thinking about going to a 190, and you need to know that there isn't one answer to your question.

You have to consider the size of the canopy, and the size of the jumper. Most people have heard the line, '1.2 on a 120 and 1.2 on a 170 are two very different things. The 120 will be quicker, and fly faster than the 170'.

This is true, and it's related to the line length (shorter lines make for quicker handling) and the lower overall drag of the smaller canopy.

This is why the smaller jumpers, 140 lbs and under, generally need to shoot for a lower WL when looking at gear in the begining. Otherwise you'd have new jumpers flying around under 150s and 135s.

The thing is that sword cuts both ways. When you tend toward the higher end of jumper weight, say 220-230ish on up, you also have to make some special considerations.

Now let's keep in mind - I don't know you, and I don't know if any of this applies to you, but -

You have to consider things like how fast can you run? Be realistic if you're a bigger guy, because if you can't run as fast as your canopy, you'll need to consider the next point-

How much of a fall or impact do you think you can walk away from? On a no wind day, you may be going faster than your legs, and take a fall. Or maybe the winds get funky on you, and the bottom drops out halfway through your flare. How are you going to fare in these situations?

You're always going to have to keep in mind that many of the 'rules of thumb' in skydiving were made for the average sized jumper. If your size is either toward the lighter end, or the heavier end, some of the rules won't exactly apply to you, and you will have a few considerations unique to your size.

I think the important thing to think about when selecting canopies is this - the main thing that will make you a better pilot is experience. The trick is to just keep jumping, and you'll get there. Even a very minor injury, like a sprained anlke or wrist can keep you grounded for weeks on end, so make choices that will keep you at 100% and keep you jumping, chipping away at the skills you need to go fast, and be safe while doing it.

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Talk to TK, or Paul, or anybody else over at Zhills who knows you and knows what they're talking about. Seriously.... just buy them a beer at the bar and ask the exact questions you're asking on here and you'll get great answers. Are they going to be exactly what you're looking to hear?? Probably not.
Apologies for the spelling (and grammar).... I got a B.S, not a B.A. :)

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Other thread.. the 190 is the size canopy I want.. and it will be a while down the road before I get it...I was trying to say that I do not intend to go below a 190..... EVER
Lots of good advice here. Definately the 2'nd from the bottom.

I have stood up about 90% of my landings (and some of them have been fairly hard)
I totally agree with what is being said, and the charts provided are a good guide.. seems I am well below those reccomendations already.

I am not so concerned with downsizing as most people are, but I would like to get to a small enough canopy that I can rent demo gear for cheaper than I am renting student gear. (I have actually downsized at a much slower pace than some I have seen)

Presently the largest they have to offer is a 200.. so.. I hope you understand my motivation.
Millions of my potential children died on your daughters' face last night.

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I have stood up about 90% of my landings (and some of them have been fairly hard)



This is not the way to look at it. If you are about to have a hard landing, a PLF is the way to go, not trying to stick the stand up.

Standing up a landing is over-rated, and in no way a measure of skill. Being able to stand up (and walk away) after a landing is what's important.

I didn't realize you're jumping at Z-hills. What you neeed to do is this, ask around and see who has a container that would fit both you and the canopies you want to demo (hint-look for guys who look like you size wise). Ask if you can borrow (or even rent) their container and reserve to demo some canopies.

You'll need to provide a guarantee to replace anything you lose or damage. You'll also need a rigger to handle switching canopies (Sally Hathaway?), and you'll need to have the demo canopies in hand before taking the rig. You may have to jump during the week, when the owner of the rig is not jumping.

The best way to get started might be to ask TK for help. He'll know what to do.

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but.. but.. what if your exit weight is ABOVE 265? by like 30 lbs or more??



I feel your pain. Drop me a line.;) (although I doubt you have a question about wingloading).

Its important to remember that 1.3:1 on a 150 isn't the same as 1.3:1 on a 190. Then there's just the canopy's design. 1.3 on a Katana 170 isn't the same as 1.3 on a Sabre2 in terms of performance.

This is something we have repeated time and time again, but it needs to be continued to be repeated.
--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

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