Tipping...

[Just4me 0]

What do you mean I am expected to tip too?
I am taking my son for his first tandem jump next week. I was looking through a FQA and they talked about tipping?? It is pretty expensive to do this.
What is the expected tip?
Isn't the instructor's job to take my son on a jump?
I am just curious to why tipping is part of the sport?

[indyz 1]

Nobody in this industry expects a tip and, at least in the area where I instruct, receiving a tip is pretty rare. That said, those occasional tips are very much appreciated.

[djmarvin 2]

Depends where you jump on the tipping habits. A lot of instructors receive tips, many don't. If you feel that your instructors do a great job tip the accordingly, it is a service based industry afterall. Yes you are paying big bucks to have the time of your life, unfortunately skydiving is an expensive sport with very expensive aircraft and equipment. Most of that money goes to the owner, your instructor receives only a small portion of that. Normal tips for me range from $5-$20

DJ Marvin
AFF I/E, Coach/E, USPA/UPT Tandem I/E
http://www.theratingscenter.com

[skymama 35]

If you think the Instructor is genuniely putting forth his/her best effort to make the jump a memorable one, it's great if you can afford to give a tip. Like someone else said, they really don't make that much for the jump and don't forget that he/she just saved your son's life.

She is Da Man, and you better not mess with Da Man,
because she will lay some keepdown on you faster than, well, really fast. ~Billvon

[Just4me 0]

I would hope that it is not his/her job to save my son's life.
Isn't it his/her job to do a good job and be well trained to do a tandem jump with someone else?

I don't see the instructor as someone who will save my son's life.

[NWFlyer 2]

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I would hope that it is not his/her job to save my son's life.
Isn't it his/her job to do a good job and be well trained to do a tandem jump with someone else?

I don't see the instructor as someone who will save my son's life.

If not the instructor, who do you expect to take your son out of the aircraft and pilot him safely to the ground? That's what we mean when we say "saving his life."

Tip or don't tip - that's your decision.

"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

[wmw999 2,114]

It's not necessarily expected most places, but it sure does brighten up the day of someone who probably eats more ramen for dinner than you do.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[Tuna-Salad 0]

if i have the cash that day and im in a generous mood.. yeah ill tip.. the packers.. manifest.. etc.. but then again my particular dz.. the people are good at their jobs so afford that extra $ here and there... not much but atleast itll buy them a beer at the end of the day

Millions of my potential children died on your daughters' face last night.

[peanutgallery 0]

It's a service industry, would you pay for the food and not tip the waiter?

I used to have a handle on life, but it broke

[davelepka 4]

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I don't see the instructor as someone who will save my son's life.

You have a misunderstanding of the situation. Without the assistance of the instructor, your son woul dhave very little chance of coming away from a jump unharmed.

Now if your son is returned, not only unharmed, but excited, and feeling as if he had been a part in the success of the jump, learned a few things about skydiving, and generally feeling as if he was well taken care of, then it wouldn't be unreasonable for you to shell out a $10 for the guy who made it possible.

Anyone can sit there like a lump, hook your kid up and drag him out the door. If the instructor goes the extra mile, and makes sure your son gets the most out of the jump, recognize it.

You do it when a waitress makes you feel at home and well cared for, so why not this?

[SivaGanesha 2]

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You do it when a waitress makes you feel at home and well cared for, so why not this?

My concern--although it is not such a big deal for tandems but definitely a factor for AFF and beyond--would be that an instructor receiving a tip would feel a pressure to pass a student on a jump they otherwise should be repeating. A waiter usually doesn't have to make any decisions that are so important so it is not so big a deal.

I think the tradition of showing appreciation by buying beer that everyone can share is a good tradition in skydiving and appropriate to the nature of skydiving. Tips for individuals would cause me some concern in skydiving.

I have no problem with the quality of a waitress' service depending on how large a tip she is expecting to get. I do see an issue with the safety of an instructor's performance depending in any way on the size of a tip.

"It's hard to have fun at 4-way unless your whole team gets down to the ground safely to do it again!"--Northern California Skydiving League re USPA Safety Day, March 8, 2014

[rlucus 0]

I'd like to start with this smells of troll.


But I'll feed... Compare it to a nice restaurant, you pay a lot of money and guess who gets the least amount from your bill... the very person who you interacted with the most and a waiter doesn't make a living from his paycheck.

Now compare that to a Tandem Master, (which by the way, has spent ENORMOUS amounts of money and time to earn that position) He only makes at the most $20 from your purchase because skydiving is an expensive business (a medium sized jump plane like the Cessna Caravan costs $1,000,000)

He has to perform the job of a tour guide, a teacher, and an entertainer. All while putting up with being kicked, scratched, head butted, and occasionally thrown-up on. Along with the extra physical abuse a tandem rig causes from regular gear.

They do it for 2 reasons, they love the sport so much and love sharing it with other people or they can't afford to pay for a sport that they can't give up.

They won't add in gratuity (like unfortunately some services have been reduced to being required too) They don't even expect it, but they damn sure appreciate it. Can you honestly not afford another $20?

/rant

No I don't even work in a field that could be tipped, but I think too many people in too jobs aren't being tipped when they should be. Pleasing people isn't easy.

[peek 20]

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What do you mean I am expected to tip too?
I am taking my son for his first tandem jump next week. I was looking through a FAQ and they talked about tipping?? It is pretty expensive to do this.
What is the expected tip?
Isn't the instructor's job to take my son on a jump?
I am just curious to why tipping is part of the sport?

Personally I think it is somewhat tacky for a drop zone to mention tipping in their documentation or on their web site.

I think most instructors would rather you buy some beer and hang out with them at the end of the day, drink some with them, and ask questions about skydiving.

That shows your appreciation much more than mere money.

[BobbyR1990 0]

i tipped my tandem instructor $10 and it really made him happy

[councilman24 36]

Would a rock climbing guide save his life in an emergency? Would a white water guide? Or a scuba dive master? While granted that he will be saving his own life also it is the instructor's expertise that will make you son's jump as safe as it can be. Including during an emergency situation that may arise.

As to tipping? See all of the above examples. Would you tip them? Maybe, maybe not. The instructor is an employee of the DZ. If you choose to compensate him above the pay that he gets from the dropzone that's your choice. If he's abrupt, disinterested, unfriendly then he probably doesn't deserve a tip. If he goes out of his way to make your son's experience extra special, it's not because he or she wants a tip. It's because he or she want to make your son excited about skydiving. If that's worth some extra consideration that's great. If not, that's okay too. Tipping is never required (except by some restraunts I don't appreciate). Let you son decide, he's an adult.

BTW before the wide spread use of devices which activate the reserve parachute (now required for tandem) if the jumper (or tandem pair) doesn't, every skydiver was dead once they left the airplane UNLESS THEY TOOK A POSITIVE ACTION. Parachutes don't just happen.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[Reaperwear 0]

No you are absolutely not expected to tip.
I agree too that it is tacky to even bring it up.

We rarely get tips, although we get paid a very small portion of what you pay. Some of us go to great lengths to give all our students/customers a great memorable experience.

It would be my privilege to share our sport with you and your son.

And if someone tips I usually buy our support staff of packers & catchers beer at the end of the day or lunch, they are paid even less.

I hope you and your son have a great day skydiving.

I refuse to tiptoe through life, only to arrive safely at death. www.reaperwear.com

[davelepka 4]

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an instructor receiving a tip would feel a pressure to pass a student on a jump they otherwise should be repeating.

That's a negative ghostrider.

There's no telling who the instructor for the next jump is going to be, and needless to say, if you bought your way past a level, they would have their work cut out for them. Instructors count on the previous logbook entry to give them an idea of what they're getting into, and the that includes the line, "Pass to AFF Level xx".

Besides, it takes more than money to impress an AFF instructor. Richard Branson, the billionaire, has been through some jump training in preperation for his around-the-world ballon trips. He failed many, many levels, including one where he grabbed his chest mounted main ripcord, and his cutaway with the same hand, and deployed his main and cut it away in one smooth motion. I don't think he ever actually graduated to solo freefall. They just gave up and figured if he had to bail out of his ballon, he'd be OK.

As far as just buying beer, not all instructors drink beer. If you instructor makes you feel well taken care of, then take care of them and hand over some cash. It's a few bucks they can spend in any way they see fit.

The concept of buying beer and hanging out is unrelated. If you're going to hang out and drink beer, you better put some beer in the damn fridge.

Even if you don't like your instructor or think he did a shitty job, if he's hanging out at the end of the day, you offer him a cold one anyway.

The jumping, the instructing, the tipping - that's business.

The hanging out, and drinking beer - that's pleasure.

[rehmwa 2]

Nobody, in any industry, "Deserves" a tip.

tips are voluntary and people can tip or not as they feel - simple enough. I tip when I want and do so frequently. But if I didn't, it wouldn't bother me much.

I NEVER tip when it's advertised or put out there like it's expected (tip jars, signs, etc), or asked for directly ("do you want any change from that?"). And a sign that says "we don't expect tips, but appreciate when you do" is the same as asking for it in terms of the effect on people.

hell, you can walk up to a stranger and just give them a couple bucks for no reason at all if you like - try it, it's fun

I think tips are a terrible thing in any industry, people should be paid for the work they do by their employer. Industries that rely on tipping are just passing on their expenses to their customers indirectly instead of as part of the pricing equation. It's not really fair to the employee if you think on it.

If someone does a good job - they should get more raises, and keep their jobs as determined by their employer. If they do a terrible job, the complaints should lead the employer to fire the bad worker. It's not that hard a concept.

so, yes, with that in mind, I'd rather the DZ charged an extra $10 (or whatever) on that tandem and just gave the TM $10 more per jump if the TM deserves it. And the TM should just ask for that deal anyway. That takes the expectation away from the customer so they can enjoy the experience.

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[JohnMitchell 14]

Making that first jump is an expensive day. Although I love getting tipped, maybe 1 in 5 passengers tip me, usually $10-20. I really don't mind if they don't. Occasionally I will admit that I feel a really tough passenger should tip me, but it's part of the job, and I'm fairly well compensated for it.
I do remember this pretty, young college coed tipping me one time. I almost wanted to tell her to keep it, that she was a very easy passenger and that a college student needed the dough more than I. Ironic situation, eh? I kept it, but wished she had saved it up for another jump. She would have been a good skydiver.
So if you don't tip on your first day, that should be totally fine with anyone. If not, I'll say they are a jerk. Have a great time.

[Just4me 0]

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No you are absolutely not expected to tip.
I agree too that it is tacky to even bring it up.

We rarely get tips, although we get paid a very small portion of what you pay. Some of us go to great lengths to give all our students/customers a great memorable experience.

It would be my privilege to share our sport with you and your son.

And if someone tips I usually buy our support staff of packers & catchers beer at the end of the day or lunch, they are paid even less.

I hope you and your son have a great day skydiving.

I will give you the prize for the most postive reply! Thank you! If I knew where you were I would bring my son to you for his jumping!
I am a little disappointed, it is raining today and I get the feeling his jump will have to be postponed :(

[Just4me 0]

Thanks for all the imput. I will feel out the situation when we are done.
I think every job is a service job.
And no...I am not a troll :)

[skybytch 259]

Do you tip the guy who runs the Zipper at the fair? Same thing...

[timmyfitz 0]

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I do see an issue with the safety of an instructor's performance depending in any way on the size of a tip.

Do you really think an instructor is going to compromise safety if he doesn't get a tip? Try again.

Also, I have had several AFF students that have tipped me (before and after the debrief) but it certainly didn't influence whether or not I would pass them on or not.

[Reaperwear 0]

While i have joked to friends that I'm a human carnival ride. How much time do you spend with the guy who runs the zipper? how much experience and training do you think the guy who runs the zipper gets, and if things start to get hairy i.e. a malfunction who do you want the guy who runs the zipper or me.

I refuse to tiptoe through life, only to arrive safely at death. www.reaperwear.com

[Baksteen 84]

The zipper guy, of course - at least I wouldn't be attached to him

"That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport."
~mom