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dancy

Downsizing?

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I can see lots of guys around who are talking about downsizing all the time. To me it seems like one should be as cool as possible - the smallest your rig is the better.
Now I'm planning to buy a new rig with a new main canopy and a little downsizing. At present I am using a 190 square-feet canopy with a wing loading of 0.8. Considering my exit weight and experience (180 jumps) I could jump a 150 or even a 140. In spite of this I'd like to buy a 170. The reason is that I do like to stay in the sky as long as possible - but everybody smiles at me. They say I should choose a smaller canopy. I know it would penetrate better into the wind and I could make more spectacular landings. The rig could be smaller which would look great.
Do you also find my choice ridiculous?

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If you dont want to downsize you dont have to.
but if you are going to buy new gear maybe you should concider a main with the new thinner fabrics?
such as pulse or simular.

so that means you can get your 170 but it will fit in a rig for a 150 (perhaps even 135?), in that way you can downsize later without buying a new rig.

keep in mind that they can simle however much they want, its still your choise:)

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bigger is almost always better...i had a canopy collapse at 40 ft. which prompted me to upsize one reserve size and two main sizes...i went from a pd126 reserve to a 143 and a sabre 120 to a sabre 150.

do what you feel confident, comfortable and happy with, not what the "cool" people think is right for you.

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Jump whatever you want, and whatever makes you feel confident udner canopy. The last thing you need if you are landing off, or in challenging conditions is to be worried about being able to handle your canopy.

In terms of rig size, I would challenge any jumper to make a jump with a rig one size bigger than they are used to, and really be able to tell a difference. Between a 150 or a 170 you're looking at one rig, or the one size up, and you will never be able to tell the difference in the air.

If you want to be able to downize later, without buying a new rig, look in to a used 170 and have the rig sized for a tight 170. The used canopy will be easier to pack, and when you downsize to a 150, the rig will be even easier to pack.

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I can see lots of guys around who are talking about downsizing all the time. To me it seems like one should be as cool as possible - the smallest your rig is the better.
Now I'm planning to buy a new rig with a new main canopy and a little downsizing. At present I am using a 190 square-feet canopy with a wing loading of 0.8. Considering my exit weight and experience (180 jumps) I could jump a 150 or even a 140. In spite of this I'd like to buy a 170. The reason is that I do like to stay in the sky as long as possible - but everybody smiles at me. They say I should choose a smaller canopy. I know it would penetrate better into the wind and I could make more spectacular landings. The rig could be smaller which would look great.
Do you also find my choice ridiculous?



Who are these "everybody" and "they"?

Your instructors, DZO's, S&TA's?
" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley

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When you leave the aircraft there is only you and your choice of gear to ensure that you have a safe flight and landing - your friends are not involved.

If you choose the wrong gear then you and you alone will have to deal with whatever situation arises, therefore i would strongly suggest jumping the gear that you feel most comfortable with. :)
If you like a 190 - stay on it, if you would like to downsize to a 170 and it's a safe choice then go for it but do it because it's the right choice for you - not to look cool :S

There's no point in getting broken permanently to look cool for a short time!

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I like my 190 but I've jumped a 170 and it was also great. A 150 would be ok as well. So it's not a safety point of view - just the time I can spend in the air.
I might be weird because most jumpers nowadays prefer long, spectacular swoops which they can achieve with higher wing-loading. But on the other hand it means that they reach the ground in a shorter time.

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I like my 190 but I've jumped a 170 and it was also great. A 150 would be ok as well. So it's not a safety point of view - just the time I can spend in the air.



Actually it is a safety issue, so just add that to the list of reasons not to downsize.

A smaller canopy is certainly less safe than a larger one. A smaller canopy will give you less time under canopy to deal with traffic, or to locate and set-up for a safe landing area. A smaller canopy will also respond to inputs more quickly and to a greater degree than a larger one.

A smaller canopy will penetrate into winds better and handle turbulence better than a larger one, but only to a small degree. Making the choice to jump in those conditions is a short coming on the part of the jumper, not the canopy.

Additionally, it's never a good idea to donwsize more than one size at a time. If you are currently jumping a 190, then a 170 would be your next logical choice. A 150 is considered to be the crossover point in to a 'high perofmance' canopy, so skipping a size to downsize into a 150 is an epsecially bad idea.

You never have to downsize if that's what you want. It's your money, and your skydive, do with it as you see fit.

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Between a 150 or a 170 you're looking at one rig, or the one size up, and you will never be able to tell the difference in the air.



I dunno Dave.... I put 300ish jumps on my 170 and then downsized to a 150. The difference seemed HUGE to me. It was nothing like changing from a 210 to a 190 or a 190 to a 170. The 170 to 150 change seemed to cross an exponential line of performance.

Granted, I'm a tad wimpy.... but I put fewer than 100 jumps on the 150 and decided that being a little scared every time I landed it was stupid and dangerous.

I noticed a significant change in the "safer" direction when I went back to my 170.

Okay, shit.... I just realized you were talking about noticing rig size not canopy size and I almost deleted this but WTF. It might be valuable info to someone...
Owned by Remi #?

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I had that same experience when downsizing from a sabre 210 to a sabre 190.

I'd put only a few jumps on the 210 - I thought it was an awful canopy, no fun at all. It just wouldn't turn and riser pressure was something fierce.
I actually felt the navigator 240 I'd been jumping prior to the sabre 210 was more responsive and fun, though I did recognise that the Sabre 210 lost altitude more quickly; both in full flight and once I'd finally get it to respond to toggle input.

So I downsized to a sabre 190.
When I did a 360 I looked at the ground and was surprised to experience ground rush under canopy for the first time. The canopy was very 'touchy' - it'd react quite fast to any input I cared to give.
I realised I'd be making quite a few hop and pops dedicated to canopy control on this thing..
"That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport."
~mom

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Who gives a shit what other people say you should be doing? It's your canopy, it's your ride and it's your life..
They won't be the ones flying the canopy.. so it's easy to tell someone what they should be doing..

I don't get the big hurry with downsizing.. I only did it to be able to rent demo gear from sunshine factory because the largest canopy they had was a 210 (Which I still jump)

I think of it like this.. the ground comes up pretty fast already and at this stage would probably get hurt pretty bad if I fucked up a landing... so adding speed will only make that outcome uglier.. why risk it?

(Of course that is MY personal view on ME downsizing, your results may differ)
Millions of my potential children died on your daughters' face last night.

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I know how u feel buddy. I flew a 215 until i had 180 jumps and i just loved being under canopy and checking out the view. People were asking me all the time why i dont get a smaller canopy and i just told them to get stuffed. I am now on a 170 and loving it but i dont regret spending my time on a bigger canopy.

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Just mention that someone told you about the possibility that
you should be prepared to do an off-dz landing. You may have
to do it downwind.

Tell them that you want to be prepared, so you are going
to do a 5mph downwind landing before you downsize.

...today. Ask them to join you. If they think it is a problem,
ask why.
:ph34r:

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I flew a 215 until i had 180 jumps and i just loved being under canopy and checking out the view.



I thought I was the only one who jumps for the view...
After a jump my buddies usually discuss the freefall and how much they enjoyed their fast canopies and the landing. But most of them are boys while I'm a girl, and that might cause the difference between our attitudes.

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Now I'm planning to buy a new rig with a new main canopy and a little downsizing.



Start with the reserve size you feel comfortable with 143? 160? 176?
once you have made that decision, then decide on a main.
I have a 150 reserve, and have had 170, 150, 135 mains in my rigB|

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Good advice, thanks.
I'm planning a 150 reserve and a 170 main. Later I can downsize the main.



If you're not ready for a 150 main which you'll be familiar with and have 2000' to fly back to a nice wide open field where you land into the wind you're not ready for a 150 reserve which you'll be unfamiliar with and likely to have half that altitude to learn to fly it to an out landing which is small, has obstacles, and may be down or cross-wind.

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Good advice, thanks.
I'm planning a 150 reserve and a 170 main. Later I can downsize the main.



If you're not ready for a 150 main which you'll be familiar with and have 2000' to fly back to a nice wide open field where you land into the wind you're not ready for a 150 reserve which you'll be unfamiliar with and likely to have half that altitude to learn to fly it to an out landing which is small, has obstacles, and may be down or cross-wind.



Now this is good advice. If you are not ready for a 150 main you have no busness on a 150 reserve.

In 30 years of jumping I never heard someone land a reserve and say that they wished that it was smaller. Not once.

Sparky
My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

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This is just a fact of life in skydiving, much like there is generally a planet in the direction in which you fall. People has been talking and talking and talking about how I have a WAY too big canopy and should downsize. I try to buy a new canopy and decide on a size and model that I've tried and like, but my local dealer asks if I want to try an even smaller one.

It's like a constant background noise, much like aircraft noise. I choose to not listen to it. It's up to you what you want to do.

;)

It can be a good idea to fly in brakes to float above everyone else when you have a very light wingload. That way you will get a clearer pattern and not have to worry about traffic. When I had my Silhouette 150 wingloaded at 0.95:1, I hardly ever had to deal with traffic, I was usually last down if there weren't any students or tandems. You should also be extra caucious when it comes to wind, wind that everyone else can jump in, can make your canopy go backwards. It's completely possible to land safely in a safe area with a canopy that doesn't go through the middle wind, but it is harder than when you have penetration, and you might not want to fly in that kind of wind.
Relax, you can die if you mess up, but it will probably not be by bullet.

I'm a BIG, TOUGH BIGWAY FORMATION SKYDIVER! What are you?

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