Pilot chute tangled around leg

tumbleroll · February 8, 2010

Was participating in a canopy piloting course today, jumping hop 'n pops from 3,500 feet. My exit was woeful and I struggled to regain stability - haven't done low altitude jumps for a while and I was having all sorts of problems.

While flailing around on my back like an idiot (not sure of height) I threw the pilot and the little f*cker snagged on my foot and tangled around my leg. Didn't really follow a plan after that, just sort of kicked my legs like crazy until (thankfully) it untangled after a few seconds, the canopy deployed and I was able to land safely (after sorting out some horrendous line twists).

The whole episode sort of freaked me out a little. I asked people on the ground what I should have done. They said I should not have thrown while unstable in the first place and certainly not while on my back, which I guess is completely true, but not really an answer to the question I asked.

Did I do the right thing - kick to disentangle? If this didn't provide a quick solution should I have cut-away instead, or simply pulled silver?

Grateful for advice.

hcsvader · February 8, 2010

What were the altitudes for this sequnce of evens?
When did you pull?
When did it clear?

Have you seen my pants?
it"s a rough life, Livin' the dream
>:)

GLIDEANGLE · February 8, 2010

Tumbleroll:

The issues you raise in your post are so numerous and serious that what you really need to do is sit down with an instructor and discuss the entire jump. I suggest that you print off your posting and give it to the instructor. You need to have this chat before you jump again.

Some time in the training harness to practice ALL your Emergency procedures would be time well spent too!

Good luck!

The choices we make have consequences, for us & for others!

pchapman · February 8, 2010

Yeah that was a bit of a f*ckup. So you'll get chewed out here but there are things here for people to learn.

A low exit shouldn't be any harder, it is only that people get psyched out if used to higher exits.

Calculate the time available, eg, a 5 second delay is only 366 ft. For lower hop and pops you may actually have a lot more time than you might first think. Doing the numbers can help reduce people's worries.

So figure out how much time you should have to your preferred minimum pull alt, or to some minimum decision altitude (eg, 2000' or whatever).

In a way you did what instructors keep telling people -- if you are low and don't know how low, pull instead of wasting altitude to get stable.

Yet at this point you should be avoiding that scenario, and as long as one's time sense isn't way out, a flip to belly should be quick enough. Sure, if one gets some momentum and wind blast effects going out the door, the first tumble may be unavoidable, maybe one goes for a 2nd, but then one should be able to quickly enough get control again.

Gaining stability might be slowed by 'trying too hard', doing things too quickly without a plan -- that's where a quick flail doesn't work as well as a deliberate and slightly slower arch followed by a specific counter-action that one chooses.

Kick the PC off? Sounds good to me.

If still in a high speed mal and getting low, whether to cutaway first or just pull silver, that's an interesting one. In your case, the pin hadn't popped, so you weren't actually yet in some sort of horseshoe situation. I'll let others offer suggestions, but it tends to get into that area where both methods are accepted and some prefer one, some prefer the other.

If faced with a possible two out with a horseshoe, I'd rather have some control over the main canopy, keeping it attached at my shoulders too, rather than possibly having it attached only at my foot. This is despite the possibility that the deploying main might pull the entanglement off one's foot.

Just throwing out ideas here; none of this is official doctrine.

davelepka · February 8, 2010

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I asked people on the ground what I should have done.

I hope they said 'Arch'. That's what you should have done.

Everything else is trying to make the best out of a bad situation. Just avoid the bad situation in the first place, and arch.

MarkM · February 8, 2010

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Didn't really follow a plan after that, just sort of kicked my legs like crazy until (thankfully) it untangled after a few seconds, the canopy deployed and I was able to land safely (after sorting out some horrendous line twists).

The main thing to ask yourself is what would you have done after a few attempts at this. You could easily get so focused on clearing the PC that you lose track of altitude and time.

Quote

They said I should not have thrown while unstable in the first place and certainly not while on my back, which I guess is completely true.

Pull.
Pull at altitude.
Pull with stability.

The stability part is 3rd on the list of priorities.

skyjumpenfool · February 8, 2010

Practice your hop n pops up higher so you have time to get stable if stuff happens. Once you figure out the stability thing, you'll be ready to go lower. Don't let this scare you off. You just identified an area (actually, several areas) where you need some work/practice. Not least of which is altitude awareness. When stuff hits the fan, there's always time to check your altitude!

A question only you can answer for yourself is this….. Did I go into panic mode? If your response to an emergency situation is “PANICK”, to the point that you don’t think straight, then maybe this sport is not for you. It sounds like you dealt with the situation, got it cleared, and saved your life. Sometimes, panic mode happens when you’re on the ground and have time to think about what just happened. That’s normal.

Glad everything turned out o.k.

Birdshit & Fools Productions

"Son, only two things fall from the sky."

JohnMitchell · February 8, 2010

Like Dave said a few posts above, "ARCH."

Also, precede that arch with a good exit that puts you flat and stable on the relative wind. If you're not sure exactly what I mean by that, ask a local instructor.

For the situation you were in, I teach "2 tries to clear the entanglement, then cutaway and pull your reserve." I'm glad you were able to get that off your leg. Horseshoe malfunctions can be very scary.

justme12001 · February 8, 2010

as most everyone has said first of all you should leave stable. Hop and pops arent as scary as most people think. However sometimes you do get unstable, and if you happen to pitch while unstable and get the p/c wrapped around your foot/leg/arm what I was taught and teach is to point either the hand/arm or the foot/leg straight up at the sky and it will unwrap. You are falling down and it wants to catch air and slow down, so what happens is it unwraps itself. If it doesnt clear then do your EPs. Hope that helps some, and I am pretty sure someone will yell at me for something that I said wrong somewhere in this post

mrbiceps · February 8, 2010

Everyone makes mistakes buddy, you did well to unwrap it from around your leg and land safely. I think they shouldnt have let us out from what was less than 3500 feet, seeing as 7 of the 10 of us had less than 100 jumps. That is why i said something to the pilot and asked for 5000 feet on the future loads. Just to give us a bit more canopy time and also allow a bit more height for such a situation. cheers - winston

dragon2 · February 8, 2010

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Everyone makes mistakes buddy, you did well to unwrap it from around your leg and land safely. I think they shouldnt have let us out from what was less than 3500 feet, seeing as 7 of the 10 of us had less than 100 jumps. That is why i said something to the pilot and asked for 5000 feet on the future loads. Just to give us a bit more canopy time and also allow a bit more height for such a situation. cheers - winston

WTF? 3500ft? less than 100 jumps? So what? With your number of jumps you should be able to get out at 2500ft no problem

Asking for 5000ft makes you sound like an AFF baby

ciel bleu,
Saskia

hookitt · February 8, 2010

Arch.
Head up or even back.
Legs out but not straight.

Why legs out? Helps keep you from backlooping and keeps your feet away from the bridle.

Remember this. There is always wind. Arch like you mean it and the wind will correct your orientation.

Ignore the ground as you exit. If you try to level yourself with the ground, you will flail.

Arch, don't reach for what you can't grab.

You already know this.

Pull
Pull on time
Pull on time stable

If for some reason you cannot become stable in time, there is only one option. Pull. Deal with whatever comes next.

Hope that helps.

My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto

hookitt · February 8, 2010

More altitude is great but for a hop -n- pop, you don't need it. If I were getting out at 5, I'd at least fall to 4000 just so you can have a bit of freefall fun.

Train your exit. Exiting stable is easy but go ground train it. 3500 feet is plenty.

It will take about 11 seconds to fall the first 1000 feet. If you take 5 of those seconds and exit, arch... pause... remain arched, reach, pull. You will still be in the saddle about 2500 feet and most likely even higher. 5 seconds is a long time. Most likely a nice relaxed stable exit and pull will take you 2 seconds. You'll be flying at 3 grand.

My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto

DrewEckhardt · February 8, 2010

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Everyone makes mistakes buddy, you did well to unwrap it from around your leg and land safely. I think they shouldnt have let us out from what was less than 3500 feet, seeing as 7 of the 10 of us had less than 100 jumps.

None of you should have had problems getting stable within the 6+ (USPA 3000 foot minimum container opening altitude for students and A-license holders) to 10 (USPA 2500' minimum container opening for B-license holders) seconds available.

Harmless · February 8, 2010

+1

"Damn you Gravity, you win again"

skyjumpenfool · February 8, 2010

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............ seeing as 7 of the 10 of us had less than 100 jumps. That is why i said something to the pilot and asked for 5000 feet on the future loads. Just to give us a bit more canopy time and also allow a bit more height for such a situation. cheers - winston

I, like others above, will disagree with your numbers. However, you need to make your own "hard deck" decisions!!! If you're not comfortable leaving the aircraft below 5K, then don't! If you need to pull by 4,500 to feel confident, then 4,500 it is. Just make sure everyone is aware of your breakoff and pull altitudes.

Birdshit & Fools Productions

"Son, only two things fall from the sky."

firstime · February 9, 2010

do you jump with a hook knife, if not you will now

popsjumper · February 9, 2010

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do you jump with a hook knife, if not you will now

Man! You're going to get flak for that statement for this situation.