popsjumper 2 #26 March 3, 2010 QuoteBack to the same problems with FMD/FPD. What if the first person makes a bad choice? What if the person in the middle of the load changes the pattern? Why did they change it? Which direction should you land? IMO FMD/FPD asks way too much of jumpers least equipped to deal with that decision. You can't plan your pattern because you don't know what direction you'll be landing. You can't actually set up until you've seen which direction someone else is landing. You're dependent on not only the FPD making the right choice but also every other jumper on the load in front of you. You need to spend a bunch of energy watching the FPD when you should have more (not all) of your attention on the people around you. I know I don't have a lot of experience with FMD/FPD but I can say that I've never received a satisfying (to me) solution to these issues from proponents of FMD/FPD. ...and you won't. They cannot see the logic and common sense. They spend a lot of time and energy trying to justify their solution to one problem and ignore all the other problems their solution creates. All those problems have been highlighted to them numerous times...to no avail. I put my money on the young jumpers at designated landing pattern DZs. They can land circles around those poor FMD youngsters for no other reason than that they are taught how to handle downwind and X-wind landings AND get solid practice doing it. Low turns into the wind injuries? Fear of downwind and X-wind landing obviously. Did you notice the comments about "if you don't like landing her, land over there? What's going to be so different "over there"? What I really appreciate though, is those FMD people making it known where they are so I'll know what places to avoid.My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Baksteen 84 #27 March 3, 2010 Quote Did you notice the comments about "if you don't like landing her, land over there? What's going to be so different "over there"? She won't see you land? "That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport." ~mom Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MomDaBomb 0 #28 March 3, 2010 Me too-I'm ALWAYS the last one to land. It's funny....The other day a guy on the same load as me, jumped after me, had already repacked by the time I made it down! I couldn't believe it. I don't mind being last though. It's probably best for everyone involved. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 1 #29 March 3, 2010 Quotewhat the fuck are you going to do once the dolphins start jumping? Thank them for the fish, and stay the hell out of their way. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BrianM 1 #30 March 3, 2010 QuoteQuotewhat the fuck are you going to do once the dolphins start jumping? Thank them for the fish, and stay the hell out of their way. No, no no! They thank you for the fish!"It's amazing what you can learn while you're not talking." - Skydivesg Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 1 #31 March 3, 2010 can't get nuthin' past these folks. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
emmiwy 0 #32 March 3, 2010 Quote Me too-I'm ALWAYS the last one to land. It's funny....The other day a guy on the same load as me, jumped after me, had already repacked by the time I made it down! I couldn't believe it. I don't mind being last though. It's probably best for everyone involved. Same here! Tandems get down faster than me, and I pull lower than they do [usually]. It's all in the spiraling I think--sometimes I think I spiral pretty aggressively but its still the scariest part of the dive for me. I'm working on spiraling faster and harder :) Nothing wrong with last one down, everyone is paying attention to you ;) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #33 March 3, 2010 I absolutely hate the First Man down idea. BUT...... I am 100% in agreement with following WHATEVER the DZ designates as the rule (even FMD on a load of idiots) the reason is that if everyone is following any specific rules, then the pattern has a better chance of being predictable in one way or the other and that helps avoid bad traffic the only real problems I ever see is when someone decides on their own to follow different rules than everyone else....... my only personal rule is to find out the rules at any DZ you visit - follow those rules - when the DZ is unclear about expectations, be more on the defensive at all times ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
virgin-burner 1 #34 March 4, 2010 you're probably jumping at the wrong place.. “Some may never live, but the crazy never die.” -Hunter S. Thompson "No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try." -Yoda Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
danielcroft 2 #35 March 5, 2010 Quote Ok, you seem to be the first to trot it out, so I'll pick on you... FMD/FPD/First Soulless Ginger-haired Hermaphrodite With A Gimp Leg Down - wtf? Is everyone trying so hard to be PC? Can't we simply make it FSBD (First Sentient Being Down)? After all, what the fuck are you going to do once the dolphins start jumping? I have to try to remember FSBD now. That and twatmuppet. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FFMedic 0 #36 March 5, 2010 FMD. Yep that's what I keep getting told. Here's our pattern. Fly this and we'll like you. Cool! I want to be liked. I want to jump here. How come at EVERY DZ I have jumped at, most in Washington, Eloy,Elsinore,Mesquite, San Diego and even in Canada, I dutifully get into the pattern to find I am the only one to do so? OK, not absolutely every time but so often I wonder why they mention it. I never hear of anyone being lectured or talked to and conclude that patterns are for newbies and regulars do as they please. Maybe there is some logic to this. I am not a "regular" at any one DZ so maybe I am out of the loop. I get surprised by people showing up in front of me on final and have no idea where they came from. (above no doubt). Not saying I'll just start landing as I please too, just wondering what all the lip service is about patterns if most people ignore them. Are they too boring? At my level they seem safe and appropriate. Do you lose that feeling as you rack up the numbers? Newbie who's just curious. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,731 #37 March 5, 2010 >Do you lose that feeling as you rack up the numbers? Almost 6000 jumps and I still fly a pattern in traffic. So no, I don't. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #38 March 5, 2010 DZs need to:.... HAVE a rule (but it's pointless if they don't:.....) ENFORCE their rule ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
danielcroft 2 #39 March 5, 2010 Quote>Do you lose that feeling as you rack up the numbers? Almost 6000 jumps and I still fly a pattern in traffic. So no, I don't. Me either, only have 300 jumps though so maybe I'll be all jaded & surly later. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
popsjumper 2 #40 March 6, 2010 It's good that you are getting around so much. It's good that you are finding out just how many idiots we have in this sport. Keep flying the pattern, whatever it is at that DZ on that load. Don't let them convince you to become one of them guys.My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
