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Jockeyshifter63

Downwind landing techniques

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I plan to ask my instructors this weekend about this but I wanted to throw it out there. I did search the forums for this info under downwind landings but could not find what I wanted to know. I am a Noob. Just earned my "A" and as of right now I have 44 Jumps. I am pretty conservative and do listen to my coaches but I just cannot remember if this was taught, and I cannot find it in my notes. (We were taught that while upwind landings are preferrable, you can land downwind or crosswind if necessary to follow the canopy traffic.
Anyway, here it is; I was at a boogie this weekend, my first. I rented the rig (the only one) and it had a PD 260 canopy. No worries, bigger than I have been jumping but I like the ride down anyway and I thot if it takes longer it will keep me out of the traffic jam in the landing area. We were instucted to land "with the arrow" and I did. It just so happened that it always seemed to be downwind. Granted, the earlier jumps had a ground level wind from 0 to 4 knots. I was digging the learning experience of down winders and with the bigger canopy I was almost always the last down. One jump I really almost made it my last. I was leaving lots of room for my approach leg on these landings but this one when I was about 200' I got a pretty good tail wind gust. I thot I still had plenty but was wrong. I was about 50' up and I had 4 choices, none good. On the left was the hangers, middle left was people vendors and asphalt, right was a transformer and power lines and middle right was a 50' diameter hole. I took the hole. Not pretty but no body was hurt. Here is my question. When it looked like I was long (100') my training kicked in and I instictively went to 1/2 then 3/4 brakes trying to bleed off altitude. Was this correct or did I exacerbate the problem.
(I do know the real answer is don't put yourself in that position, but "No shit there I was......")

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>When it looked like I was long (100') my training kicked in and I instictively went to
>1/2 then 3/4 brakes trying to bleed off altitude. Was this correct or did I exacerbate
>the problem.

When you are flying _most_ canopies, adding brakes while flying downwind will extend rather than shorten your final. (In other words, your approach will get flatter, not steeper.)

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A few tips for landing:

- make sure you know where you want to land in time - I choose my out by 1500ft if I'm not going to or not sure I'm going to make the DZ.
- don't fly over anything you do not want to land in/on low (ie, below 1000ft).
- aim for the middle of the field, ie give yourself room on ALL sides: room in front of you and behind you to deal with more or less wind than expected, plus be able to go left or right to avoid someone/something should that be necessary.
- look at where you want to land, not where you do not want to land.

ciel bleu,
Saskia

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I used to work in helicopters and there was a pilot I flew with alot who, when he was flying, used to have one eye open for an 'out' in case of an engine failure. We flew round Sydney, Australia, once and as we flew he pointed out as a running commentary where he would land. I took this to heart with flying my canopy too and always try and keep an eye out for my options.

In your situation it looks like, other than flying in brakes which maybe didn't help, you made it down uninjured so you did OK but try to think about your options earlier in the flight, that way if you need them you've already worked them out and it gives you one less think to worry about.

CJP

Gods don't kill people. People with Gods kill people

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That was the most challenging landing conditions I have ever encountered. Winds that went from 0 to light and variable to 10 mph variable with density altitude of up to 7500 feet.
Replying to: Re: Stall On Jump Run Emergency Procedure? by billvon

If the plane is unrecoverable then exiting is a very very good idea.

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- don't fly over anything you do not want to land in/on low (ie, below 1000ft).



I just wanted to emphasize this point. You don't want to fly over an object if you have to fly back over it. I may or may not have learned this one the hard way and had to land in some peas on the other side of the trees.

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That was the most challenging landing conditions I have ever encountered. Winds that went from 0 to light and variable to 10 mph variable with density altitude of up to 7500 feet.
_________________________________________________

Thanks for the input folks. This brings up another thing that I know nothing about. Please explain density altitude to me. I heard this term but don't know what it means. My home DZ and the Boogie DZ are within a couple hundred feet of each other in elevation (approx 5000') but I was told later that the Boogie DZ has a higher density altitude so it was like landing a couple thousand feet higher. Lots more experienced people than I were having trouble standing up their landings at the Boogie too.

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You can think of density altitude as "performance altitude."

Note: I'm a brand new skydiver, but I've been a pilot for years, which is where this information is coming from.

Think of density altitude as the altitude your wing "thinks" it's flying at. For example, if you're jumping in Denver and the DZ elevation is at 5000 feet above sea level, but the density altitude is 8000 feet, your parachute will perform as if you were landing at a DZ that sits 8000 feet above sea level. You're going to come in faster than normal. For pilots, density altitude means longer takeoff rolls and slower climbs.

Things that increase density altitude include heat and moisture. On really hot days, the density altitude is going to increase. Think about it: the air you're flying through is heating up and expanding, making it less dense. Less dense, or thinner, air means your chute has less to work with as you fly through the air. Moisture also increases density altitude, to a lesser effect. A molecule of water, H20, weighs less than a molecule of oxygen. So more water molecules in the air reduce the density of the air you're flying through.

As temperature drops, so does density altitude. In Denver on a cold day, the density altitude can get as low as 3500 feet. Now your wing performs more like it would at sea level.

Hope that helps!
--------------------------
That which can be asserted without proof can be dismissed without proof.

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That was the most challenging landing conditions I have ever encountered. Winds that went from 0 to light and variable to 10 mph variable with density altitude of up to 7500 feet.
_________________________________________________

Thanks for the input folks. This brings up another thing that I know nothing about. Please explain density altitude to me. I heard this term but don't know what it means. My home DZ and the Boogie DZ are within a couple hundred feet of each other in elevation (approx 5000') but I was told later that the Boogie DZ has a higher density altitude so it was like landing a couple thousand feet higher. Lots more experienced people than I were having trouble standing up their landings at the Boogie too.



Just google "density altitude' an you will find definition and graphs.

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