in 2-way (or 4-way) is it up to the divers who are higher to come down to the lower jumpers?

[mixedup 0]

(just an in between trips to the DZ question)

Still doing some coach lessons (2-way). Looking back at the video I see in the first part of the dive I was trying to fly forward to the instructor, however I was a little below him so I was also trying to "hug the ball" and get a bit higher. End result I didn't make much forward head way as I was stretching my arms out in front to get some height too. Instructors said it was like I pushing the accelerator down while pushing the brakes at the same time :)

Just wondering in retrospect now:

a) in a normal 2-way would it be up to the higher jumper to come down to the lower jumper?

b) what's the body position for gaining height but driving forward a bit at the same time? Just less arms relative to straightening out the legs I guess - no special tricks here?

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[LDiCosimo 0]

Generally i've heard go to the low jumper.

BUT

If your with a new group make a plan, and stick to it. Maybe one of the jumpers just got their license and isn't good at not crashing through the formation. Or everyone thinks they are going to the other guy and the group just keeps chasing itself.

Generally i've heard go to the low jumper.

[quade 3]

When you ask whose responsibility is it to do what, the real answer is it's the responsibility of all jumpers to attempt to meet somewhere in the middle. This starts out before you even get on the plane by having the right jumpsuit and if required, maybe wearing weights. Knowing what works for you comes with experience. More is better.

Be that as it may, sometimes the best of plans go awry.

When that happens, the practical solution is for those that are higher to increase their fall rate. The reason is fairly simple to understand in that it's almost always easier to speed up than slow down, but beyond that once a person has gone so low they can no longer see the other people without twisting their head, it's pretty much over for them in terms of doing anything useful about it. The more they turn their head and then body, the worse things are going to get because they're just spilling air.

There has to be a sort of calculation made by whoever is in the best position to get back together. On a 2-way, the answer is almost always going to be to try all the way to break off altitude. When the formations get bigger it may become impractical for 20 people to chase the one guy that fell out of the formation.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[Squeak 17]

if you are flying with mixed ability levels you might find it advantageous to elect a "BASE" to work towards. That way everyone is not wondering who or where to go to.
If the base is the most experienced it would be in their interest to make sure that everyone can at least have a decent chance to get to them. (i.e. they can go to the lower person or float a little if someone is struggling to get down.)

You are not now, nor will you ever be, good enough to not die in this sport (Sparky)
My Life ROCKS!
How's yours doing?

[jephprospect 0]

If I'm low I like to just line up under the high one till they burble to my level

[mirage62 0]

+1

Kevin Keenan is my hero, a double FUP, he does so much with so little

[jimmytavino 16]

i was NOT sinking out!!!

everybody ELSE was floating!!!!

jimmy

[Joellercoaster 6]

Quote

b) what's the body position for gaining height but driving forward a bit at the same time? Just less arms relative to straightening out the legs I guess - no special tricks here?

Definitely get with your coach on this one, as it's easier to show than to explain.

But. Slow/fast fall happens mostly with your torso. Your arms are a relatively weak input compared to your trunk (and legs). Pushing forward with your arms and neck causes you to dearch at the chest, which slows you down - your arms aren't contributing too much directly (except, as you noticed, to push you backwards a bit).

Once you figure out how to make your torso slowfall with your shoulders and (more importantly) your hips, you can use your arms and legs independently to control your position. Legs in booties are a good source of drag too, of course.

Your coach will definitely be able to help :)

--
"I'll tell you how all skydivers are judged, . They are judged by the laws of physics." - kkeenan

"You jump out, pull the string and either live or die. What's there to be good at?

[mixedup 0]

Quote

Once you figure out how to make your torso slowfall with your shoulders and (more importantly) your hips, you can use your arms and legs independently to control your position.

@Joellercoaster - thanks for the tip - hadn't heard this one, but it sounds very useful if I can get it happening...

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[ksaylor1 0]

It can be pretty hard to go two directions (up and forward) at the same time. If you turn 90 degrees to your "target," you can "hug the ball" without raising you chin (spilling air and pushing you farther away). If you manage to get yourself on level, you can then turn back to your "target" and close the distance. Good luck.

[mixedup 0]

@ksaylor1 - thanks - what's the reason for the 90 degree turn? Was it to see your target without raising your head & then backsliding like you mentioned?

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[ksaylor1 0]

you got it. after the 90 degree turn, you can keep eyes on your "target" by turning your head (as opposed to "raising" your head). a more effective "de-arched" body position without backsliding. plus the benefit of seeing where you're trying to get to.

[hackish 8]

Some organizers will say f-them it's their responsibility to stay with the group. Others will bust the formation open to go to the low jumper.

In our informal 4 way group we usually try to get our speed up to help them get "up" to us as everyone should be working for a uniform goal. I think the choice needs to be made so it's appropriate for everyone's skill levels but there isn't really a hard and fast rule on this.

-Michael

[captain_stan 0]

Quote

Some organizers will say f-them it's their responsibility to stay with the group.

Whenever this subject is mentioned, I laugh about the time many years ago when a "senior" jumper chewed my ass for flying to the low man, who couldn't get back in the formation. My antagonist didn't realize that although our six-way-scrables team could indeed continue without the lost man, we wouldn't be able to score any more points when reduced to a five-way!

A good plan is golden, and there's a time and place for almost everything.