popsjumper 2 #51 May 21, 2012 Quote If it wasn't for the $2000 plane ticket, 4200 miles. Oh and the TSA probably wanting to stick their hand up my bum. Your DZ would be my home DZ I have a solution: [sam kinison voice] MOVE SUCKER! [/sam kinison voice] Besides that, there's no charge for the TSA sex. My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
popsjumper 2 #52 May 21, 2012 Quote Quote I love telling this story because a) it's true and b) it one of the reasons why I wholeheartedly support the "Pay it Forward /Skyward" concept. At the risk of veering off topic, is there any way, at this point, that I can pay it forward to newer noobs? I'm too new to give advice (with the exception of "doubleknott your shoelaces"). Well sure! Ground stuff: - Teach them to pack - Quiz them on EPs. Pick one every so often during the day and say, "If you have a _______, what are you going to do?" - Get them to buy a SIM and actually read it. - Quiz them on equipment knowledge. "What is this and what does it do?" - In general, quiz them on all that stuff you had to know for your A license. - Teach them about Beer Rules. In the air, - You can get together with another A license for two-ways and help each other with diving exits, swooping/docking and fall rate. One be the steady reference point while the other practices, then next jump swap roles. (You'll get to see some funny stuff...) You don't HAVE to have a super-duper Coach/Instructor in the air to learn these things, Yes, it's best but only because he will be more observant and be better able to give you proper feedback after landing. Have the C/I teach you what to do and then go up and have some fun with it on a two-way with your A license buddy. Not every jump has to be a concentrated working jump. These things can be learned while you are having fun with another young jumper.....two birds, one stone. Now, if you want to be trying out for Arizona Airspeed tomorrow, then yes, paid coaching, tunnel time, lots of dollars and hours of time....go for it!My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 7 #53 May 21, 2012 QuoteI backslide like crazy and have trouble with my fall rate. This makes me feel guilty about asking to jump with more experienced pals, and very reluctant to ask to jump with people I don't know well. 1. Be honest about your skills. You think we assume that at 30 jumps you are a rockstar? Anyone that has organized or worked with students has a pretty realistic expectation of younger jumpers abilities. 2. Don't do zoo loads. It is better to do a two way than a clusterfuck 10 way."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wildcard451 0 #54 May 21, 2012 I would love to be able to give you a helpful answer, but realistically, I was a quitter... My EW was 255 lbs, I was always the big guy, fast fall rate, etc. I kept this up for about 800 jumps. Then someone said, hey, you're a big guy, I bet you could swoop real well. I fell in love with hop and pops and pretty much my last 700 jumps have been solos at 6K. That being said, it still comes down to saying to someone - "hey, I'm new. I'm looking for people to jump with. Wanna make a fun jump?" I don't even want to tell you how much my freefall skills have taken a shit since I started swooping. Doesn't stop me from going to play with friends. You've done a great job getting this far. Don't let yourself be your own worst enemy. Go out, have fun. Ask some people to jump. If they say no, ask more. If this is a theme, find a new place to jump cause those people are all douchebags. If you ever want someone to fly with, who at 1500 jumps still isn't all that good in the air, look me up in VA. /that goes for anyone, anytime. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hellis 0 #55 May 21, 2012 Why has nobody suggested nudejumping yet? Oh, we are not in the bonfire forum are we? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 0 #56 May 21, 2012 Further to Ron's advice about avoiding zoo loads, be aware that it has always been fairly common for friendly male jumpers to invite a newer female jumper on a size or type of jump that is beyond her current skill set's ability to safely handle. this may be flattering, but it can also be unsafe. just remain alert for this. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnMitchell 14 #57 May 21, 2012 Quote Further to Ron's advice about avoiding zoo loads, be aware that it has always been fairly common for friendly male jumpers to invite a newer female jumper on a size or type of jump that is beyond her current skill set's ability to safely handle. this may be flattering, but it can also be unsafe. just remain alert for this. Ahhh, very good point. I was very protective of Vskydiver. We did dozens of two ways before doing any larger jumps. I wanted to make sure she could always track away from idiots. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Joellercoaster 6 #58 May 21, 2012 Quote I'm too new to give advice (with the exception of "doubleknott your shoelaces"). You may think it's not worth much, but: that's really good advice!-- "I'll tell you how all skydivers are judged, . They are judged by the laws of physics." - kkeenan "You jump out, pull the string and either live or die. What's there to be good at? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,116 #59 May 21, 2012 Anytime you're invited on a load where they tell you that you don't have to do anything, it's probably not a good load for you to be on (unless it's your SCR and the DZ needs beer ). You'll gain nothing by being baggage on a load. Especially if they tell you don't worry, you can pull in the center, because they'll track away from you. Wendy P. There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DanG 1 #60 May 21, 2012 Quote- Teach them to pack - Quiz them on EPs. Pick one every so often during the day and say, "If you have a _______, what are you going to do?" - Get them to buy a SIM and actually read it. - Quiz them on equipment knowledge. "What is this and what does it do?" - In general, quiz them on all that stuff you had to know for your A license. - Teach them about Beer Rules. To the OP: You may be able do a lot of that, but don't forget that you're not an Instructor. Working with your A license buddies on things like this is great, but please don't try to teach students. Also, your experience has a parallel on the other end of the experience scale. Near the end of my jumping career (I quit about 2 years ago) I had trouble finding people to jump with me. Most of my contemporaries were working, something I'd lost interest in, and most of the newbs were too shy to ask someone with my experience to jump with them. I actually got turned down by newer people because they didn't want to waste my jump money. It was weird. I ended up doing a lot of solo's, just like you. Someone up thread suggested asking manifest to do a call-out for you. I definitely recommend this. There may be people just like me hanging around the DZ looking for new friends to jump with. - Dan G Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MakeItHappen 15 #61 May 21, 2012 same story different day..... http://makeithappen.com/spsj/newbie.htm .. Make It Happen Parachute History DiveMaker Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Southern_Man 0 #62 May 21, 2012 Quote Also, your experience has a parallel on the other end of the experience scale. Near the end of my jumping career (I quit about 2 years ago) I had trouble finding people to jump with me. Most of my contemporaries were working, something I'd lost interest in, and most of the newbs were too shy to ask someone with my experience to jump with them. I actually got turned down by newer people because they didn't want to waste my jump money. It was weird. I ended up doing a lot of solo's, just like you. You jumped with me and turned 8 or so points when I only had ~30 jumps or so. I will forever be grateful for that. It was a very fun jump."What if there were no hypothetical questions?" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Namowal 0 #63 May 21, 2012 Quote To the OP: You may be able do a lot of that, but don't forget that you're not an Instructor. Working with your A license buddies on things like this is great, but please don't try to teach students. Me teaching students would be like Mr. Magoo teaching knife throwing... My blog with the skydiving duck cartoons. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tatetatetate 0 #64 May 21, 2012 Quote Besides that, there's no charge for the TSA sex. I'm not that kind of person. Has to be flowers, a nice dinner and music. I mean I don't want to be called a slut right? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Baksteen 84 #65 May 21, 2012 Quote Just ask, the worst that can happen is they say no. Most experienced jumpers have been in the same position as you at least once. Just make sure you pay it forward when you have experience by jumping with the low timers, especially the ones that are struggling. Sometimes all a new skydiver needs is a friend to motivate them to make it past that initial stage of inexperience and lack of self confidence. This. Best advice I've read in quite a while. "That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport." ~mom Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wolfriverjoe 1,340 #66 May 22, 2012 Quote I've had my A licence for over a month now, and am trying to jump with other people whenever I get the opportunity. Sometimes it's there- the DZ hosts organized events frequently, and sometimes I can get friends to jump with me... ...but currently I'm not very good. I backslide like crazy and have trouble with my fall rate. This makes me feel guilty about asking to jump with more experienced pals, and very reluctant to ask to jump with people I don't know well. The paradox is, I'm not getting any better at jumping with others until I get more practice at, well, jumping with others.Any suggestions? Or should I just cough up the money for coached jumps when it looks like I'm on my own? There's lots of good suggestions here. One I haven't seen yet is to find a jumper who is looking to become either a coach or AFFI. They may well be looking for a "less skilled" jumper to use as a practice student. And ask around. There are often experienced jumpers who are perfectly willing to do a fun jump with newer jumpers. I heard "the enthusiasm and excitement of the new guys is always fun", "since you aren't very good, then I have to work harder and be better than if I jump with skilled people", and (most importantly) "I had experienced guys jump with me when I was new, just make sure you jump with the new guys when you've been around a while." And keep in mind, that even chasing a "backslider" around the sky, even up and down due to fall rate issues, all of that is more fun than doing a solo. Look around for someone who doesn't seem to have a partner. I have heard "You suck, but it beats jumping alone." (It was a joking comment, but it was pretty accurate too ) You can also hook up with another new jumper or two. There are some pretty basic drill dives that are only three or four points, repeatable if you get that far. Ask an instructor or load organaizer for some ideas/suggestions/instructions. Make sure you dirt dive it well, and debrief it after. And you said: Quote At the risk of veering off topic, is there any way, at this point, that I can pay it forward to newer noobs? I'm too new to give advice (with the exception of "doubleknott your shoelaces"). Sure. Be welcoming and friendly. If you see a student or new jumper standing alone, go say "Hi." Help them feel like they belong. Remember how you felt at the beginning. All these experienced jumpers, laughing and joking and having a good time. And you were the new student, not knowing how to fit in. Not knowing how to act or what to say. If you want to help the new guys, help them learn that this is one of the best groups of people in the world to be a part of. And the simple suggestion of double-knotting shoelaces (or maybe how to make sure long hair is properly secured) is a good way to both give a piece of advice that isn't necessarily obvious and also to make them feel like someone cares about them."There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy "~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
devildog 0 #67 May 22, 2012 QuoteQuoteI backslide like crazy and have trouble with my fall rate. This makes me feel guilty about asking to jump with more experienced pals, and very reluctant to ask to jump with people I don't know well. 1. Be honest about your skills. You think we assume that at 30 jumps you are a rockstar? Anyone that has organized or worked with students has a pretty realistic expectation of younger jumpers abilities. My first 4 way was #30 something. I was going solo, but a 3 man group was looking for a 4th and our manifest girl said, "Hey, why don't you three take him along?" The guy putting it together looked at me and said, "How many jumps do you have?" Me, "30 something" Him, "Any good?" "I have 30 something jumps. What do you think?" We laughed, and he said, "Alright, let's go." :)You stop breathing for a few minutes and everyone jumps to conclusions. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Namowal 0 #68 May 22, 2012 Thanks again for all the suggestions and ideas! :)My blog with the skydiving duck cartoons. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
popsjumper 2 #69 May 22, 2012 Quote Quote To the OP: You may be able do a lot of that, but don't forget that you're not an Instructor. Working with your A license buddies on things like this is great, but please don't try to teach students. Me teaching students would be like Mr. Magoo teaching knife throwing... Yes, DanG was kind enough to point out something I should have emphasized: Let's not get involved with the pre-licensed students just yet. They fall under the umbrella of the Instructors. I should have been more specific to say that I interpreted your "noobs" label to mean other young jumpers with A license or such. My suggestions would be great for YOU too. While you are quizzing them, you are at the same time drilling yourself with/by repetition.My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
