Raven Reserves

[billvon 2,400]

>Will you expound on that?

Sure. They stall early in the stroke; the more heavily loaded they are, the earlier the stall. I've seen two broken bones because of it and a half dozen hard landings because of it.

One of those broken bones occurred after a spinner on a wingsuit jump. It was an interesting one because the jumper in question actually DID do a practice flare after the cutaway and noticed the early flare point. Then he had to land out due to the low cutaway, got nervous, reverted to previous training and flared all the way.

If there are people out there still jumping canopies that stall like this during the flare (say, a PD150 with 800 jumps on it, or a very out of trim Triathlon 135) then they would likely be able to land such a canopy. Most people won't be able to land it well. Thus my recommendation that jumpers do not use Ravens at higher loadings for reserves.

Not all gear is created equal.

[377 20]

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One thing I've done in the past is pack my reserve canopy into a borrowed container and make a jump on it just to check it out, esp. after a repair job (on a 26' lopo). Has anyone else thought about test driving it before they stake their life on it?

I did something close. Jumped a rented Raven as a main to see what it would be like to land one of my Raven reserves. It flew OK but the flare was not at all to my liking. I tried various flares up high and it just felt too easy to stall it if I did a fast flare. I did a standup landing on it but it took more thought and careful control than I might be able to perform right after a low cutaway.

I did some Googling and found that poor flare was a common Raven complaint. I think they will open reliably, fly OK and maintain structural integrity, but I wanted a reserve that flared nearly as well as my main (a Triathlon).

I traded in my two Raven reserves and got two PD 193Rs. I had a cutaway soon after and the PD 193R flared beautifully with no special care needed. I am glad I switched even though it was a costly upgrade. Used Raven reserves sell cheap. Used PD rerserves hold their value much better. There is a reason for the difference.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[RiggerLee 61]

They do have diffrent dynamic caricteristics. I only have a couple of jumps on them, at relitively light wing loadings, but I didn't find it to constitute a problem on the larger canopies. Most of the real issues I've seen have been on the smaller sizes which just didn't seem to scale as well or behave as well as the larger originals, smaller micro ravens and small m series. Although I would concider it to be well known sence it hasn't been mentiond here I feel obbliged to point out that do to the inconcistancy in how canopies are measured, that if you go by the pubblished numbers that you are actually jumping at a higher wing loading then it would apear. So when you say that a raven does not land as well as a PD at the same wing loading I'm forced to point out that the wing loading is actually higher. Conversly when you say that a PD performs so well at high wing loadings I have to point out that it is because PD lies about the size of there canopies and that the wingloading is actually lower.

And just for the record I do prefer how PD canopies fly but not enough to make me affraid to jump a Raven. We jumped them for years. I've seen lots of jumps on them. You cant say they don't work. As to wing loading... There are a lot of people out there that don't really need to be loading there reserves at 1.5 regardless of how you measure them. And I really don't think you need to be loading even an optimum at 2.0 So what's the point in the whole argument?

Ravens have been around forever with countless changes and upgrades over the years. As it's been pointed out there are diffrent generations but I'm a little surprised no one in this whole bitch fest has bothered to point out some of the more glareing problems they have had over the years. As an example the whole line attachment debockel. The various form of repair and the contraversy over there efectivness. And yes, I am one of those riggers that declines to pack m-series with type 3 tape on the attachment points. I just don't think it's adiquit concidering the canopies propensity for aberant hard openings.

There was also some issues with broken lines on some super ravens. As I recall it was atributed to higher wingloading and higher altitudes. Could some one help me out on the details? As I recall it led to a recamendation of jumping lower wing at dropzones that had higher landing areas. I never really saw the logic behind this my self.

Now haveing said all of this. These things have been around for freaking ever. With a history that long any manufactorer will have had some issues. Just for fun should we start a thread on the lemons PD has put out? So althoue they have had some glitches I don't see how you can condem Ravens in general. And I don't see any reason why some one should go out a pay some excesive price for a brand new optimem when there is a perfectly good Raven sitting there in a bag Cheap. I wouldn't.

Lee

Lee
[email protected]
www.velocitysportswear.com

[popsjumper 2]

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Thus my recommendation that jumpers do not use Ravens at higher loadings for reserves.

OK...I missed the "higher wingloading" part. Thanks.

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[alexafox 0]

I had my first mal a couple of weeks ago and my reserve is the Micro Raven M 150...

It was a terminal speed opening and it opened beautifully (quick but nice)!

I'd never flown a 150 before (my main is a 168) and landed no problems! I thought the flar was fine! I load the reserve at about 1.2.

As a newbie myself I can say this canopy felt fine to fly. I practiced a couple of flares up high, then stood up my landing (off DZ with no windsocks or anything to guide me).

I'm sure people have had other experiences though!

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